Baby bit by ants in NICU develops infection & dies

[ecmst12]

It is relevent when it comes to the value of the case, and the "but for" component. That the ants may have hastened the death by a few days does not make for a viable case. Same as when negligence contributes the death of a terminal cancer patient or someone who is 95 years old.

 

[LocalRocket]

This is really appalling. I'm forwarding this thread to the moderator and asking to have the potentially damaging posts removed. I suggest that others do the same. Just because you CAN be blunt on a legal forum doesn't mean that you SHOULD be blunt in this situation. Lya, I really just can't believe that you'd use take advantage of this opportunity to make a shocking and hurtful statement for "impact". And really, ecmst12, you should be ashamed for backing her up.

Not only have I experienced losing an infant, I am coming from a point of experience in the field; I have a PhD in Human Biology, and I’m a molecular biologist by trade. I'm sorry to say that your opinion as pediatric nurse is incorrect. You are wrong that this would normally be considered a miscarriage—there is no such think as a miscarriage after 20 weeks gestation. If a baby passes away in utero after 20 weeks it is considered a stillbirth, and if early labor cannot be stopped at 20 weeks and a baby is born living, it is a live baby. No NICU nurse would ever refer to her patient as “the fetus on the ventilator in room 3”.

You are UTTERLY wrong in saying that a baby this age "lacks skin". Seriously, are you lying about having experience as a nurse? Skin is one of the earliest organs formed, and at 22.5 weeks a baby's skin, while thin and delicate, has been completely formed for several weeks and is coated for protection with a waxy substance called vernix. More importantly, f you had even cared to follow the timeline, OP's son with the ant bites was about 28 weeks old when he died. He had already been alive for 5 weeks. A baby who makes it to the 27.5 week period has a 90 percent survival rate, 80-85% if he or she is born as a multiple. For an example of what a premature baby outside of the womb looks like at this age, follow one of these links:

www.askanob.com/images/349_premature_baby.jpg

www.miraclebabyanastasia.com/9-1-05AnastasiaQ.JPG

A far as what implications any of your bogus information might have in regards to OP’s case, you obviously haven’t even correctly comprehended the reason for his post in the first place. OP never asked about his chances at winning a medical malpractice suit. In fact, he didn’t mention pursuing wrongful death charges or negligence charges at all.

All he asked was what he could do to prevent this from happening to his only remaining son, specifically in regard to the practice of allowing food and drink in the NICU, and was wondering about the possibility of overriding his insurance company in the matter of transferring his son to another hospital.

So tell me, how does your insistence that his son is an underdeveloped fetus lacking skin and bound to die relate to the case he’s making for a “no food & drink in the ICU” policy and his desire to transfer to a more trusted hospital?

 

[ecmst12]

It's already been pointed out that transferring the remaining child anywhere would be extremely unwise, medically speaking. That's not the insurance company's fault or the hospital's fault. Making a complaint to the hospital administrator or the board of nursing or the joint commission might get some action in that regard.

We are here to tell the truth, even when the truth is hard for someone to hear.

 

[pinkey14]

You obviously don't understand local rocket's point. The fact is that hurtful and INCORRECT knowledge was posted, and it had nothing to do with the OP's question. I don't get what you're trying to say, ecmst. Youre saying that since the poster's question was successfully answered (and he hasn't come on here and said that it wasn't) that the responsible thing to do was to add on a negative hypothetical scenario just because you think it has truth? That sounds like hijacking to me.

If you and lya want to spout incorrect information about the viability of preemies and what would happen if someone tried to bring suit against a hospital for negligence towards a "fetus", then the two of you should start a thread about it.

But for the dignity of this grieving family, leave the people in this poor family out of it. The only potentially "hurtful" thing that would be relevent to their actual question is telling them that they can't move their living child to a different hospital.

Adding uninformed and incorrect information about whether their babies are old enough to be worth saving is not relevant hard-to-hear truth, not to mention the fact that it unprofessional and unethical.

 

[ecmst12]

No one said they weren't WORTH saving.

 

[lealea1005]

A fetus/baby of that gestation is quite underdeveloped in every way. The prognosis is about 5% chance of surviving and even less of a chance for not having serious physical and brain-activity problems.

This is true. Fetus meaning within the womb and baby meaning live birth, hence the forward slash.

If the surviving triplet succeeds in continuing to develop into a full term baby, it will truly be a miracle.

This is true. The survival rate is less than 5%. However, the baby is here and, according to OP, continues to progress. I truly hope the baby continues to meet milestones in his development with lung function as well as other vital organs.

Circling back to the food issue, it is a breach of every set of standards with which I am familiar. The most simple way to prove their violation is to review the policy and procedure manual. An attorney can request the "table of contents" pages, locate the policy, and request only that section, which will save mega bucks and time.

This is true.

Due to the blatant infractions regarding food in a patient care area and due to actual patient harm's having resulted from the infractions, it is possible that the hospital will make a monetary settlement with the parents. I would also request absolute proof of the filing of a sentinel event report with JCAHO and/or CMS (Medicare & Medicaid).

This is true, as well. As unpleasant as it may be, the reality is what it is and I'm sure OP is well aware of the long road ahead...as do those of us with NICU experience. Again I wish them the best of luck.

Seek the advice of a med/mal attorney who will obtain the medical records and have them reviewed by an expert in Neonatology.

 

[lealea1005]

All he asked was what he could do to prevent this from happening to his only remaining son, specifically in regard to the practice of allowing food and drink in the NICU, and was wondering about the possibility of overriding his insurance company in the matter of transferring his son to another hospital.

As mentioned several times earlier, the risk of transporting OP's son at this point may greatly outweigh the risk of keeping him where he is. The parents should remain at his bedside as much as possible and seek out the head nurse and patient advocate for further help.

So tell me, how does your insistence that his son is an underdeveloped fetus lacking skin and bound to die relate to the case he’s making for a “no food & drink in the ICU” policy and his desire to transfer to a more trusted hospital?

I'm sorry, just where are these words stated.

Quote by pinky14:

The fact is that hurtful and INCORRECT knowledge was posted

As unpleasant as people without professional experience or knowledge may find it, it is NOT incorrect.

 

[LocalRocket]

Please quote your sources. It is an absolute falsehood that a baby who has made it to 28 weeks has a 5% chance. There is an ENORMOUS difference between 22 weeks gestation and 28 weeks gestation. This baby had grown and made huge progress over the course of his life, and had passed the 27 week threshhold, which is the difference between a "miraculous" survival and an expected survival.

If you read the entire post, OP's question was not regarding a medical malpractice suit. It's not relevant, and you all are putting words in his mouth and then telling him the the odds are slim that he'll get what has been asked for on his behalf by other posters here.

It's ridiculous.

 

[LocalRocket]

And by the way, if YOU aren't reading the whole thread, I have a PhD in Human Biology and lived with my own daughter in the NICU for 5 months. Can you please state your credentials? Because it is indeed FACT that incorrect info is being posted. The idea that this baby "lacked skin" was absurd, and I could hardly believe it was purported as truth.

 

[ecmst12]

A baby born at 22 weeks who spent 5 weeks in an incubator is not the equivalent of a baby BORN at 27 weeks.

 

[lealea1005]

And by the way, if YOU aren't reading the whole thread, I have a PhD in Human Biology and lived with my own daughter in the NICU for 5 months. Can you please state your credentials? Because it is indeed FACT that incorrect info is being posted. The idea that this baby "lacked skin" was absurd, and I could hardly believe it was purported as truth.

Although it is true skin has developed, it is tissue thin and without the benefit of any fat. It is not the same "skin" of a full term newborn. I totally understand the point that was being made, as should you.

Please pipe down on your hostility. It's not constructive at all.

PS and O/T:
Ecmst...are we friends again? There's always next season....only 4-5 months to go!

 

[ecmst12]

Of course, though being WS champs is hardly exciting news for the Yankees, I'm over it Go eagles!

 

[lya]

I deleted my second post becaue I believe it was the appropriate action.
In hindsight, I should have sent barry a private message; he could have read it or not, replied or not, whatever.

I am prompted to respond by the assignment of feelings and beliefs that I do not value the life of the unborn or the born-too-early. That is simply hogwash.

I am also prompted to respond to being assigned premeditatedly insensitve and cruel actions. I must admit I see several posters who are acting in what I consider to be an insensitive manner; I am referring to those who have chosen to hijack the OP's thread for their own personal rants and foot-stomping.

I accept private messaging. I may or may not read your message. I may or may not respond. If I do respond, you may not like my reply at all.

All of that being said--go back and read my initial posting. I believe the OP does not have a wrongful death suit and based on his thread's title, I believe it was appropriate to 'answer' that question. Keep reading my initial posting and you will see that I also believe the food issue is of such blatant disregard for standards that I stated I believe the OP will be able to obtain a settlement from the hospital.

 

[lealea1005]

Of course, though being WS champs is hardly exciting news for the Yankees, I'm over it Go eagles!

You're on your own...I don't do football...unless we're talking rugby.

 

[lealea1005]

It is an absolute falsehood that a baby who has made it to 28 weeks has a 5% chance. There is an ENORMOUS difference between 22 weeks gestation and 28 weeks gestation

.

The baby was born at 22 weeks, not 28 weeks. At 22 weeks there is less than a 5% chance of survival outside the womb for a multitude of reasons starting with lung function. At 28 weeks gestation, although still not a guarantee, there is a much better chance for survival. ..umm...as you should know with your credentials and all. I understand you have a PhD, and spent several weeks in the NICU with your own child, but that does not equate to hands on MEDICAL experience...sorry.

OP already got his correct answer long ago.