Student Privacy

[RachelHuck]

Alabama.

A friend of mine had his binder taken up in class by a teacher. She claimed she just wanted to read the notes he took in class. However, she read the section he had in the three section binder that he used as his journal. Not only did she take up his binder without permission, snatching it right out of his hands, she read his personal thoughts in a different section of the binder than of which she said she was going to read. In this section, he wrote a small bit about how he wished to kill a teacher. She then took it up with the authorities and my friend must speak to the police tomorrow. Is what she did legal, or is it an infringement of privacy? He goes to a public school in Alabama.

 

[Antigone*]

Alabama.

A friend of mine had his binder taken up in class by a teacher. She claimed she just wanted to read the notes he took in class. However, she read the section he had in the three section binder that he used as his journal. Not only did she take up his binder without permission, snatching it right out of his hands, she read his personal thoughts in a different section of the binder than of which she said she was going to read. In this section, he wrote a small bit about how he wished to kill a teacher. She then took it up with the authorities and my friend must speak to the police tomorrow. Is what she did legal, or is it an infringement of privacy? He goes to a public school in Alabama.

Thank God she did what she did. She probably saved the life of a teacher.

Oh and it was perfectly legal.

 

[RachelHuck]

My friend never actually intended to actually kill the teacher, he was just venting because he was angry.

 

[Antigone*]

My friend never actually intended to actually kill the teacher, he was just venting because he was angry.

And now he will get the help he needs for his anger issues.

So when he points a gun at a classroom full of kids and pulls the trigger because he is angry and venting he'll say "I was just angry. I had no intention to kill anyonem"

 

[Humusluvr]

Alabama.

A friend of mine had his binder taken up in class by a teacher. She claimed she just wanted to read the notes he took in class. However, she read the section he had in the three section binder that he used as his journal. Not only did she take up his binder without permission, snatching it right out of his hands, she read his personal thoughts in a different section of the binder than of which she said she was going to read. In this section, he wrote a small bit about how he wished to kill a teacher. She then took it up with the authorities and my friend must speak to the police tomorrow. Is what she did legal, or is it an infringement of privacy? He goes to a public school in Alabama.

This isn't an issue of privacy or a legal question. Your friend needs help. He needs to learn to "vent" without making threats.

The school has the right to search *anything* on it's property, especially things like backpacks, binders, lockers, even cars. If it is on school property, it is fair game. There may be things you don't know about why the binder was taken up, like that the teacher may have had suspicion about the student. Your friend is in a world of trouble.

 

[xylene]

She probably saved the life of a teacher.

Just to be sure we had better have the child deported.

 

[BOR]

The school has the right to search *anything* on it's property, especially things like backpacks, binders, lockers, even cars. If it is on school property, it is fair game.

Not true.

There may be things you don't know about why the binder was taken up, like that the teacher may have had suspicion about the student. Your friend is in a world of trouble.

This is more in line with the legal criteria.

 

[Humusluvr]

Not true.

True. The teacher might not have the right to grab a backpack or whatever out of the student's hands, but the teacher is not a law enforcement agent. The student may ABSOLUTELY have the child detained until the school's officers get there and then they WILL be able to search whatever they want. Even if the kid has to stay there until someone goes for a warrant, or if the child is an immediate threat then on the spot. It's a losing battle for a kid to hold out on being searched.

And in this case, if the student was so adamant about the teacher NOT reading what was in the binder, I, as a teacher, would have the binder confiscated or the student detained. The safety of all the students and the teachers take precedent here.

 

[BOR]

True. The teacher might not have the right to grab a backpack or whatever out of the student's hands, but the teacher is not a law enforcement agent. The student may ABSOLUTELY have the child detained until the school's officers get there and then they WILL be able to search whatever they want. Even if the kid has to stay there until someone goes for a warrant, or if the child is an immediate threat then on the spot. It's a losing battle for a kid to hold out on being searched.

And in this case, if the student was so adamant about the teacher NOT reading what was in the binder, I, as a teacher, would have the binder confiscated or the student detained. The safety of all the students and the teachers take precedent here.

New Jersey v. TLO, 1985, dictates when school officials/teachers can search students/belongings.

They are still "agents of the government" though not as constrained under the 4th.

 

[Humusluvr]

New Jersey v. TLO, 1985, dictates when school officials/teachers can search students/belongings.

They are still "agents of the government" though not as constrained under the 4th.

Thanks for adding the case law that confirms what I wrote.

"The Court ruled by a margin of 6-3 in favor of New Jersey. Justice Byron White wrote the Court's opinion. White recognized that students in public schools have a constitutional right to privacy under the 4th Amendment and that school officials are bound by constitutional restrictions. But the opinion also stated that the rights of children and adolescents are not the same as those of adults and that school officials have a responsibility to maintain the discipline necessary for education. “The school setting,” White wrote, “…requires some modification of the level of suspicion of illicit activity needed to justify a search.” The rights of students must be balanced against the needs of the school setting."

New Jersey v. T.L.O. (1985)

And, that case was with a vice-principal, not a teacher.

Always better to search students with a parent present. Make the kid wait in the office until parent shows up, search them, they still would have found the threat to kill a teacher.

 

[BOR]

Thanks for adding the case law that confirms what I wrote.

You wrote;

The school has the right to search *anything* on it's property, especially things like backpacks, binders, lockers, even cars. If it is on school property, it is fair game

.

TLO does NOT support that at all, if you think it does, you are wrong. It is NOT fair game. They need reasonable suspicion as per TLO. They simply can not search a student becuase they feel like it, period.

 

[bobbybats]

if someone could humor me a little bit here ...

lets say the student claimed it was a story he was writing..
ever see an episode of south park ? any "SAW" movies ?

for a threat to be made, doesnt it have to go a little further than writing in a journal " teacher made me so mad today i felt like killing her" ?

come to think of it in school there was alot of threats being made but usually student to student i cant imagine what would happen if there was an investigation after every " im gonna kick your ass"

 

[BOR]

for a threat to be made, doesnt it have to go a little further than writing in a journal " teacher made me so mad today i felt like killing her" ?

"Thought crimes" are generally protected speech, but possession of such on school grounds, and if they have a "reasonable suspicion" to believe it is true, what is in the binder, is another matter.

 

[Humusluvr]

You wrote;

.

TLO does NOT support that at all, if you think it does, you are wrong. It is NOT fair game. They need reasonable suspicion as per TLO. They simply can not search a student becuase they feel like it, period.

OK, I see where you are going with this. And you're right. There has to be suspicion that the student is in possession of something threatening, like a gun or drugs. Then, the school has reasonable suspicion to search what is on school property.

 

[Humusluvr]

if someone could humor me a little bit here ...

lets say the student claimed it was a story he was writing..
ever see an episode of south park ? any "SAW" movies ?

for a threat to be made, doesnt it have to go a little further than writing in a journal " teacher made me so mad today i felt like killing her" ?

come to think of it in school there was alot of threats being made but usually student to student i cant imagine what would happen if there was an investigation after every " im gonna kick your ass"

From the original post, it sounded like the threat was against a specific teacher. That's not in a Saw movie. That's a threat, and should be taken seriously. It was even "I'm gonna kick your butt." It was "I'm going to kill this teacher."