College Rescinding Degree

[dunscaft]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Maryland

I am wondering if there are any laws regarding how a MD University System school can rescind degrees.

Hi, I am attending a University in Maryland. I was informed today that my university is rescinding my degree because I did not meet the program requirements. Note that this is after I have received a diploma and ordered an official transcript that confirmed I was awarded the degree. I believe that the language of the degree audit changed between now and when I graduated. I don't actually think that the requirements were ever different - but when I graduated I met the requirements as they were written on the degree audit.

I have made other plans and I am trying to get into a program at another college and having a degree makes it likely that I will get in and not having a degree makes it rather unlikely (the degree counts as "points" toward the admission process).

I can provide more details if necessary, but for now I just want to look into if any laws in general apply.

 

[justalayman]

I believe that the language of the degree audit changed between now and when I graduated. I don't actually think that the requirements were ever different - but when I graduated I met the requirements as they were written on the degree audit.


I believe you need to find out if that is the reason. Then you can address whatever the actual reason is rather than running after this blindly.

 

[dunscaft]

One of the problems is I can't get anybody (either in the program or registrar's office) to give me an answer about what is the official document or resource that gives the actual requirements of the program. They just tell me that I don't have a class I need and that if I can't produce evidence that I had an exemption that I don't meet the requirements.

The person that rescinded my degree says that "departments award degrees" and she needs to follow the wishes of my department because they said that I did not meet the requirements.

She seems to think that there was nothing changed in the language of the degree audit but might look into it later. I don't have a way of proving otherwise. She says that unless I have something in writing from an adviser at my department saying I met the requirements she won't do anything. This seems like an unfair burden because it is not the practice of my department to do academic advising in writing (or quite frankly the practice of any university department I have ever heard of) - they do it face to face.

It seems like there ought to be a point where the University needs to "eat" their mistake. They shouldn't have given me a degree if I didn't meet the requirements.

Unfortunately I can't find out the actual reason. The registrar's office says they awarded me the degree in error. I can't even find an incidence of this happening at a major university - they only seem to rescind degrees in cases of extreme academic misconduct.

 

[justalayman]

dunscaft;3383817]One of the problems is I can't get anybody (either in the program or registrar's office) to give me an answer about what is the official document or resource that gives the actual requirements of the program. They just tell me that I don't have a class I need and that if I can't produce evidence that I had an exemption that I don't meet the requirements.

I find it hard to believe they don't have some old class requirements laying around.

are they claiming they erased everything from their database that would provide the information?


heck, if you are a typical student you haven't even cleaned out your car since then.


there is a poster here that is intimately involved with academia. I have seen her floating around the forum. I suspect she'll catch this and offer some advice; good or bad I don't know./

 

[dunscaft]

Unfortunately the person in the registrar's office was extremely evasive when I asked a question. Frankly they only question she directly answered was if she has heard of this happening to which she said "no."

They tell me that unless I have some exception for taking this class I do not have the requirements met. My adviser did say that the department has had this requirement for many years and that the degree audit, which he understands to be only advisory, didn't reflect the requirement until April of last year. I am very confident it was until at least after September of last year, I don't think I would have missed it. Also, there were other sources that didn't have the requirement I have long since discarded. Maybe the people that throw everything in the back of their car and leave it there for years are on to something ...

He says that the department graduation review has the final say and they said I did not meet the requirements and I was told of this. I did receive an e-mail reflecting this, but I opened a help ticket saying one class wasn't reflected in the audit (which was true). To summarize, there was a list of 7 or 8 classes I needed to choose 4 of. Only 3 were listed on my degree audit and I took 4 of them, and I wrote that on the help ticket. A couple weeks later I was told I would get a diploma and I ordered an official transcript and it said I was awarded a degree. The issue is that of the 7 or 8 classes I chose four of, one of them had to be a class (actually one of two classes) that I did not take. That part of the requirement was not on the degree audit.

My university does have a bylaw that says it is supposed to develop, maintain, and publicize timely and accurate advising information for all students. Having a requirement for years and only updating the degree audit around last April seems like a violation.

Shame they couldn't have been so sluggish telling the registrar to take my degree away.

 

[justalayman]

I sent a PM to the one person I think may be able to offer some direction, if there is any. Hang around.

 

[cbg]

JAL - you need to clear space in your mailbox.

I work for a major university, but I work for Central Admin - I have nothing to do with awarding degrees or the requirements thereof. But you should be able to go out to the school's website and find a list of the current requirements. It shouldn't be that difficult to compare the requirements that are publicly posted to the classes you took.

That's your first step.

 

[justalayman]

JAL - you need to clear space in your mailbox.

I work for a major university, but I work for Central Admin - I have nothing to do with awarding degrees or the requirements thereof. But you should be able to go out to the school's website and find a list of the current requirements. It shouldn't be that difficult to compare the requirements that are publicly posted to the classes you took.

That's your first step.

got it.Thanks

Im pretty sure OP does not meet the current requirements. That is the argument. OP argues the requirements have been changed since awarding the degree while school says no.

 

[cbg]

Then it's on the OP to show that they have changed.

But I still say he needs to LOOK at the current requirements and compare them to what he fulfilled, If he DOES meet them (and I agree that he probably doesn't, but if) then he's got something he can show them. If he can't, then if he's stuck in a he-said, she-said argument he's got a problem. THEY have the power,which means HE has to show they're wrong.

 

[I'mTheFather]

It sounds to me that he realizes now he didn't meet the requirements, but is arguing that the degree audit didn't catch it, so he should get the degree.

Dunscaft, did you ever meet with an advisor after receiving the first audit? I'm pretty sure most universities expect degree candidates to do so when the audit shows as incomplete.

 

[dunscaft]

"Then it's on the OP to show that they have changed.

But I still say he needs to LOOK at the current requirements and compare them to what he fulfilled, If he DOES meet them (and I agree that he probably doesn't, but if) then he's got something he can show them. If he can't, then if he's stuck in a he-said, she-said argument he's got a problem. THEY have the power,which means HE has to show they're wrong."

I do not meet the current requirements as listed anywhere currently.

How could I go about showing that they changed how they listed the requirements in a way that would be useful to me? I do have an e-mail from my former adviser saying the degree audit was changed about April to properly reflect the requirement. I think it was after this but I don't have a way to prove it. I applied to graduate in August. For months and months my degree audit said that I had my graduation requirement done. But now they have changed it and I didn't screenshot or save anything.

 

[I'mTheFather]

I'm also curious about whether or not you're still attending the same university.

 

[dunscaft]

It sounds to me that he realizes now he didn't meet the requirements, but is arguing that the degree audit didn't catch it, so he should get the degree.

Dunscaft, did you ever meet with an advisor after receiving the first audit? I'm pretty sure most universities expect degree candidates to do so when the audit shows as incomplete.

Not face to face. When I was told that I didn't meet the requirements to graduate I e-mailed my adviser asking for clearance to register because the fall term was about to start and I was going to try to fit in a class if I needed it. He cleared me without meeting me because he was about to leave town.

After that I noticed that one of my classes wasn't listed on my degree audit so I submitted a help ticket saying just that. And I got a reply saying my "degree audit was updated." Later, I got an e-mail congratulating me on graduating and eventually a diploma.

I have been in the undergraduate program for about eight years. I have had three different primary advisers. One of them I had a conversation with about how I didn't apply to graduate because of my dad's tuition remission (which would be lost if I had a degree). But of course none of that was documented and it was over a year ago. I remember it, but I am one of dozens and dozens of students he was advising - I don't think I'm going to get any help there.

But I had the general impression from two advisers that I was done with my graduation requirements and I just needed to apply after I was done with some science courses (I was taking because at the time I was interested in going to pharmacy school).

 

[dunscaft]

I'm also curious about whether or not you're still attending the same university.

I am not currently enrolled in any classes there. I took my last class there in the Summer. I was under the impression I have had my degree requirements done for over a year.

Of course now they are giving me the option of taking a class there for my degree or somewhere else and transferring it.

I am trying to get into a nursing program at another college in August but I may not be able to now that I do not have a degree (having a bachelor's counts as points in the admissions process).

 

[I'mTheFather]

Well, the school can certainly revoke a diploma based on an inadequacy on the transcript. The degree audit is a tool to determine if you've met all the requirements, but an error in the audit won't negate an inadequacy that it failed to catch. Although the audit may have been wrong, the school must have had a list of degree requirements posted, on a website or in a catalog, that is/was accessible to students. Even advisors make mistakes. The bottom line is that you are short one class and it's very doubtful that you'll be awarded a degree without it. It's unfortunate, and even unfair to a point, but I don't see any recourse.