City of Flint Water

[JenniSam]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? MI

I own several properties in the city of Flint and I was asked an interesting question over the weekend. In light of the current water crisis and the fact that some residents cannot get safe water in their homes (even with a filter), can tenants legally break their leases? Since water is a habitability issue, would this leave landlords in a position where they would have to allow tenants to leave immediately without penalty? I�ve been lucky, no tenants have left and are all paying the $57 service charge each month even though they have not used any water (or have only used enough to flush the toilets). But I think I would have to let them leave.

 

[justalayman]

If you supply them with potable water it would remedy the lack of city water. Whether it would be financially practical for you to do so is something you would have to investigate.

But if they are not provided water, yes, that would be a breach as the home is not legally habitable without potable water.

 

[tranquility]

An interesting question that is not going to have a clear answer. The basic MI law regarding this says:
554.139 Lease or license of residential premises; covenants; modifications; liberal construction, inspection.

Sec. 39.

(1) In every lease or license of residential premises, the lessor or licensor covenants:

(a) That the premises and all common areas are fit for the use intended by the parties.

(b) To keep the premises in reasonable repair during the term of the lease or license, and to comply with the applicable health and safety laws of the state and of the local unit of government where the premises are located, except when the disrepair or violation of the applicable health or safety laws has been caused by the tenants wilful or irresponsible conduct or lack of conduct.

(2) The parties to the lease or license may modify the obligations imposed by this section where the lease or license has a current term of at least 1 year.

(3) The provisions of this section shall be liberally construed, and the privilege of a prospective lessee or licensee to inspect the premises before concluding a lease or license shall not defeat his right to have the benefit of the covenants established herein.


History: Add. 1968, Act 295, Eff. Oct. 1, 1968

While it seems "fit" would include potable water, it is clear the question is going to be litigated.

 

[justalayman]

the health department can condemn every one of those houses. Potable water is required to obtain and maintain a certificate of occupancy so, one way or another, they can escape their lease if somebody doesn't provide them with potable water.


Oh, here it is in the landlord tenant law:

b) To keep the premises in reasonable repair during the term of the lease or license, and to comply with the applicable health and safety laws of the state and of the local unit of government where the premises are located, except when the disrepair or violation of the applicable health or safety laws has been caused by the tenants wilful or irresponsible conduct or lack of conduct.

 

[FarmerJ]

Jen have you called culligan ? kinetico ? or what ever name they go by water treatment companies in your area to learn if they have filtering systems that can get the lead gone or not? I know that theres some pretty advanced on site treatment equipment to deal with iron that is so severe you get diahreha from drinking it ( one of the group homes ive worked in its well was that high in iron that they had to go for a very spendy system so just wondering if there is something out there that can get it out for you at each property ? odd question but worth asking , are any of your properties old enough that they had private well at one time and would your city let you reconnect the home to the old well during this public health crisis? Jenni also years ago this reminded me of this, back in the later 80s my friend Kim lived in Darien ill ,he too rented in a larger 1960s era three story walk up and anyway the city water there was treated the best they could but it was not potable and anyway it might be worth finding out from Chicago area newspapers how that panned out for them and if they had any archived storys about tenants who rented and left due to this issue years ago when I arrived very late then went to get a drink of water kim stopped me and told me what had happened and it was more than just the burb he lived in , it was a number of burbs and it was industrial waste leakage that contaminated the water. anyway Im pooped , bed time.

 

[quincy]

Jen have you called culligan ? kinetico ? or what ever name they go by water treatment companies in your area to learn if they have filtering systems that can get the lead gone or not? I know that theres some pretty advanced on site treatment equipment to deal with iron that is so severe you get diahreha from drinking it ( one of the group homes ive worked in its well was that high in iron that they had to go for a very spendy system so just wondering if there is something out there that can get it out for you at each property ? odd question but worth asking , are any of your properties old enough that they had private well at one time and would your city let you reconnect the home to the old well during this public health crisis? Jenni also years ago this reminded me of this, back in the later 80s my friend Kim lived in Darien ill ,he too rented in a larger 1960s era three story walk up and anyway the city water there was treated the best they could but it was not potable and anyway it might be worth finding out from Chicago area newspapers how that panned out for them and if they had any archived storys about tenants who rented and left due to this issue years ago when I arrived very late then went to get a drink of water kim stopped me and told me what had happened and it was more than just the burb he lived in , it was a number of burbs and it was industrial waste leakage that contaminated the water. anyway Im pooped , bed time.

FarmerJ, the Flint water goes beyond simple "Culligan" water treatments. The pipes are unusable and need replacing as they are leaching lead. The only water that residents can use safely is bottled water, which is being collected from sources nationwide and being distributed door-to-door by the National Guard and volunteers, or through centers set up throughout the City.

There have been several class action suits filed already, one to prevent water shutoffs to residents who have not or will not pay for the poisoned water. The class action is asking that an exemption be given Flint residents for past and future water bills. Right now, the water is good for toilet-use only.

Other class actions include asking that the State be held financially accountable for the water poisoning, and that the State is held financially responsible for all personal injuries/deaths and all property damage that has been caused and is sure to result from the tainted water.

 

[JenniSam]

We had not considered any alternative water sources because until the last few days the message was that filters were a good fix and they were provided. Our biggest struggle is the reliability of the information we are receiving. At this point, who do you believe?

First the water is good, then it’s bad. Then the filters work and now they only work for some. I am hearing, if the city pipes are eventually fixed the homeowners must still do the same for each home. All of the pipes inside of my homes are PVC but obviously the external connections to the city main are not.

An option like Absopure or Culligan water jugs that you see in an office setting may be beneficial as it would provide water to use for cooking and drinking. However, the state claims that you CAN bathe and shower in the water but who really knows if that is true. Are reports of skin rashes and hair loss a result of consumption only? I’m not confident that they know or that they would fully disclose now.

Quincy – your mention of the lawsuits is spot on. The lawsuits that are sure to follow are a real concern of mine. Just last year the City of Flint’s water department was on the losing end of litigation due to illegal rate increases. We were told the water switch would save money yet the cost still went up and color turned brown, people knew something was wrong. When GM was allowed to connect to the neighboring town’s water system, that was another red flag. Hydrants would run for weeks at a time to “flush” the system. All of these actions were red flags and there are massive efforts to distribute bottled water to homes and schools. My business partner is a teacher for Flint Schools and says the water has been turned off for months. He is concerned about how this will play out when the water donations slow down or stop coming in. It is all very surreal. But we plan to be here after all of this plays out so I guess we better figure each tenants situation asap.

 

[quincy]

... Our biggest struggle is the reliability of the information we are receiving. At this point, who do you believe? ...

I think it would be safest to believe those who have nothing to gain by lying (like the doctors who are testing residents for lead and the independent agencies that are testing the water and the pipes).

I would not trust much of what the State or local governments say.

 

[justalayman]

Is the state administrator still in office running this deal?


I cannot find anything addressing only external exposure but it wouldn't mean a lot regardless. If you wash clothes in lead laden water, common sense suggests the clothing will now have lead on them. You then handle them, then handle food or even put your hands in your mouth (especislly children) where the lead is then consumed.

While the cdc says ingesting lead laden water up to the epa action limit 15 ppb is not likely to cause harm to a healthy adult, I have heard of a measurement of 800 ppb in flint. Even worse though is children are more susceptible to the long term effects of lead exposure.

As Quincy stated, the only think I would use this water for is flushing a toilet (wow, I wonder what this is going to do to the water that runs through the sewage treatment facilities). I would use it in any manner that you would come into contact with it or with items that were in contact with the water.

Even if bathing in the water is safe, the incidental ingestion of the water isn't. When washing you have various types of your body surfaces. When rinsing you face you would expose the inside of your nose and your eyes to the water. Those surfaces are much more permeable than plain ol' skin.

But don't be fooled; even skin is water permeable. Whether it could carry the lead along with it I can't say.

 

[JenniSam]

The Emergency Manager who facilitated the switch to the Flint river was asked to testify at a Senate committee hearing this week and not surprisingly announced today that he is stepping down.

Recall efforts against the governor who placed the Emergency Manager have all failed due to minor technicalities and he has no plans to step down.

 

[quincy]

Also gone is top leadership at the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality (MDEQ).

There were questions about and concerns over water quality when Flint switched from the Detroit Water and Sewer Department to the Flint River system back in April of 2014. But water cost savings were balanced against all of the known and suspected risks in a Money v. Lives analysis. It is easy to see the winner when government is asked to judge.

I have run across on the streets of Detroit a few people with Recall Snyder petitions, passing out Recall Snyder buttons while collecting water bottles for Flint. The buttons look a lot like the recall Snyder buttons distributed a few years ago.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

The real question is would it be easier to just shut down the city, rather than address the cost of the water issue.

 

[quincy]

The real question is would it be easier to just shut down the city, rather than address the cost of the water issue.

And the 90,000+ people would go where exactly?

Even with the nuclear reactor malfunction at Three Mile Island and the resulting contamination of the air and water, there was never a question of shutting down Harrisburg and surrounding cities (although pregnant women were told to evacuate). Those who lived and live along the coasts of Louisiana and Alaska did not have their cities shut down after the oil spills contaminated their water and land. And how many cities have had chemical companies poison their water supplies?

Although the cost in dollars to the State of Michigan to fix all of the problems spawned by the water contamination will be high, and the cost to the residents of Flint of their health even higher, shutting down the city is not an option that I think anyone has seriously considered (although I am sure Governor Snyder wishes Flint would go away).

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

There is a mass of unsold housing around the Flint area in other cities. Buying out these old houses and shutting down the city corporation may be best when factoring the costs of the city long term in addition to its water supply.

 

[JenniSam]

As far fetched as it may sound, the idea of shutting down the city or bulldozing half of it has been mentioned even before this water issue. However, downtown flint does not reflect what is normally reported about the city as a whole. There are many colleges in flint that have been doing very well. Kettering University, University of Michigan-Flint and Michigan State University recently built a satellite office downtown. Hurley Medical Center also just built a Children's Clinic that opened about 3-5 months ago. Although General Motors was allowed to switch from City of Flint to Flint Twp water, they recently built a very expensive addition to an existing plant so I don't see them moving as well.

I predict that because of this issue, droves of houses will be abandoned and will remain abandoned even by landlords. This will make property even cheaper than it already is and corporations and investors will jump on them. I predict that the revitalization of downtown flint will spread throughout the city (slowly). It will not happen overnight but I don't see the city looking like it does now 5-6 years from now.