Monitoring activities during other parent's time

[t74]

Stare: OK

Parent1 has sole legal; 50/50 physical custody with Parent2; there are no limitations on who the parents can allow the preteen child to interact with including my family;

the only limitation on the child' is that Parent2 cannot enroll the child in any outside activity during custody period (including child care) but regulations state that a child of the age should not be left alone more than 4 hours (and the child is socially immature and irresponsible with electronic devices such as using the phone on adult websites); my family members regularly spend time with the child while Parent2 is at work both at Parent2's home and elsewhere; Parent1 leavess the child home alone for 8 to 10 hours per day; Parent1 has file for sole physicl custody in the past for Parent2 leaving the child alone waiting for transportation to school consequently Parent2 makes sure child is supervised according to state recommendation using grandparents and longtime friends

Child's phone must be turned on and in the child's possession 24/7; parents can make 2 calls per week to child during other parent's custodial time; child can call parent as often as like; parents can text as often as like and will text repeatedly demanding the child call; Parent1 provided and controls applications on phone but has given child ability to buy and download apps

OK is one part consent state. I assume Parent1 can give the consent to record for the minor child

It has been recently determined that Parent1 has active spying/monitoring apps on the phone which are known to be used to gps track child and take photographs inside Parent2 home. It is believe that there may be the app to remotely enable the microphone and camera; one known app notifies Parent1 if the child leaves Parent2's house/limited area in yard The child cannot even be taken to the drive-thru to choose a meal or to meet Parent2 at a counseling appointment without Parent1 being informed; It can be assumed that Parent1 would enable the recording capabilities for even the Parent2-child counseling sessions and while being transported to/from them by my family memebrs

Parent1 has repeatedly been denied protective orders and made unfounded complaints to child protective services agency. It is reasonable to assume Pare3nt1 might make accusations against people caring for the child as she has included defamatory statements in court filings about family and friends of Parent2

Is there anything that can be done about this stalking? Other than not have anything to do with the child, what can we do to protect ourselves from her accusations?

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

We can only assume that you are either parent 2 or associated with parent 2 in this little drama.

Any custody order that the phone be on 24/7 doesn't include the right to have audio or video in parent 2's home or any time parent 2 has custody of the child.

 

[Zigner]

Stare: OK

Parent1 has sole legal; 50/50 physical custody with Parent2; there are no limitations on who the parents can allow the preteen child to interact with including my family;

the only limitation on the child' is that Parent2 cannot enroll the child in any outside activity during custody period (including child care) but regulations state that a child of the age should not be left alone more than 4 hours (and the child is socially immature and irresponsible with electronic devices such as using the phone on adult websites); my family members regularly spend time with the child while Parent2 is at work both at Parent2's home and elsewhere; Parent1 leavess the child home alone for 8 to 10 hours per day; Parent1 has file for sole physicl custody in the past for Parent2 leaving the child alone waiting for transportation to school consequently Parent2 makes sure child is supervised according to state recommendation using grandparents and longtime friends

Child's phone must be turned on and in the child's possession 24/7; parents can make 2 calls per week to child during other parent's custodial time; child can call parent as often as like; parents can text as often as like and will text repeatedly demanding the child call; Parent1 provided and controls applications on phone but has given child ability to buy and download apps

OK is one part consent state. I assume Parent1 can give the consent to record for the minor child

It has been recently determined that Parent1 has active spying/monitoring apps on the phone which are known to be used to gps track child and take photographs inside Parent2 home. It is believe that there may be the app to remotely enable the microphone and camera; one known app notifies Parent1 if the child leaves Parent2's house/limited area in yard The child cannot even be taken to the drive-thru to choose a meal or to meet Parent2 at a counseling appointment without Parent1 being informed; It can be assumed that Parent1 would enable the recording capabilities for even the Parent2-child counseling sessions and while being transported to/from them by my family memebrs

Parent1 has repeatedly been denied protective orders and made unfounded complaints to child protective services agency. It is reasonable to assume Pare3nt1 might make accusations against people caring for the child as she has included defamatory statements in court filings about family and friends of Parent2

Is there anything that can be done about this stalking? Other than not have anything to do with the child, what can we do to protect ourselves from her accusations?

Please have one of the legally involved parties log on to ask their own questions about the matter. Thank you in advance for gracious understanding and cooperation with this request.

 

[stealth2]

Edit: I just realized who the poster was. Seriously, t74 - have Parent2 come on the site.

 

[Zigner]

If it were me, I'd buy a cheap non-feature phone and make sure the other party has the number while the child is at my house. The child's smart phone would be turned off and put away whenever the child is over.

 

[t74]

I am asking for ME and my family not Parent2 - especially when any of us are in Parent2's home or accompanying the child in the4 car. I cannot afford the aggravation or legal fees responding to Parent1's accusations against any of us. We do not want to abandon a 30+ year friendship with Parent2's family. I am afraid of Parent1 for all in in the family, close friends and am trying to protect me and mine. I am afaid of Parent1 legally, emotionally, and physically (Parent2 has had to call the police to remover Parent1 from property). My description of the situation was to demonstrate how far Parent1 has gone so far. Since the school situation next year will likely have members of my family continuing to step up to help Parent2, we need a plan rather than just walking away.

We have known Parent1 for many years; the divorce was bad; the remarriage and new child of Parent2 has made it far worse. It seems like Parent1 will not stop until Parent2 is deprived of all contact with the child. Psarent1 does not care who is falsely accused and is willing to hurt even people whose only concern is the safety and well-being of the child. At times given the battling parents, I'd like child services to put the child in foster care until they get their acts together - Parent1 more so than Parent2. Parent2 goes not duck well.

Friends who care about the child - and more so, the child - are at risk from Parent1's behavior. We have considered an order against harassment (different from PO). Parent1's accusations against our family member have been within complaints against Parent 2 and have so far been ignored by court but at some point this may not be the case.

This forum discusses parental strategies but not those of friends like me and mine.

 

[t74]

If it were me, I'd buy a cheap non-feature phone and make sure the other party has the number while the child is at my house. The child's smart phone would be turned off and put away whenever the child is over.

Court has ruled that the child must use the phone provided by Parent1. Parent2 may not even take the phone away for punishment for misbehavior or for accessing inappropriate website/apps.

My family member discovered child using a teen+/adult only website and could do nothing more with the phone other than notify parent after when the parent return home. My family member reported simply redirecting the child to joining in a two player video game.

It is reasonable that you house/your phone/your rules and my house/my phone/my rules but that is not what the judge ordered.

 

[Zigner]

This forum discusses parental strategies but not those of friends like me and mine.

This forum doesn't really discuss parental strategies as a rule - that's just a side-effect. Legally, you are not involved with your friend's matter.

 

[t74]

This forum doesn't really discuss parental strategies as a rule - that's just a side-effect. Legally, you are not involved with your friend's matter.

We are involved since Parent1 goes after people Parent2 chooses to care for the child Both parents are at work so ROFR does not work. Child needs supervision. Other family members of the child are not available. Parent1 refuses to place child in professionally managed programs due to COVID. We are available but are afraid of Parent1's potential accusations and intrusions into our homes.

I am assuming that I am being told that the only way to insure our interests is to refuse to care for the child.

 

[LdiJ]

Stare: OK

Parent1 has sole legal; 50/50 physical custody with Parent2; there are no limitations on who the parents can allow the preteen child to interact with including my family;

That is a very unusual court order/agreement. Is there any particular reason why a court made such an order?

the only limitation on the child' is that Parent2 cannot enroll the child in any outside activity during custody period (including child care) but regulations state that a child of the age should not be left alone more than 4 hours (and the child is socially immature and irresponsible with electronic devices such as using the phone on adult websites); my family members regularly spend time with the child while Parent2 is at work both at Parent2's home and elsewhere; Parent1 leavess the child home alone for 8 to 10 hours per day; Parent1 has file for sole physicl custody in the past for Parent2 leaving the child alone waiting for transportation to school consequently Parent2 makes sure child is supervised according to state recommendation using grandparents and longtime friends.

OK

Child's phone must be turned on and in the child's possession 24/7; parents can make 2 calls per week to child during other parent's custodial time; child can call parent as often as like; parents can text as often as like and will text repeatedly demanding the child call; Parent1 provided and controls applications on phone but has given child ability to buy and download apps.

Again, its a bit unusual for a court to order that a child's phone be turned on 24/7. Is there any particular reason for that?

OK is one part consent state. I assume Parent1 can give the consent to record for the minor child

Since parent one has sole legal custody (again, quite unusual) that is probably true. Otherwise either parent could do so.

It has been recently determined that Parent1 has active spying/monitoring apps on the phone which are known to be used to gps track child and take photographs inside Parent2 home. It is believe that there may be the app to remotely enable the microphone and camera; one known app notifies Parent1 if the child leaves Parent2's house/limited area in yard The child cannot even be taken to the drive-thru to choose a meal or to meet Parent2 at a counseling appointment without Parent1 being informed; It can be assumed that Parent1 would enable the recording capabilities for even the Parent2-child counseling sessions and while being transported to/from them by my family memebrs

If I were parent 2 I would be locating and deleting or turn off those apps while the child is with me. I would be more than happy to explain to a judge that I considered those apps to be an invasion of privacy of my home if parents 1 dared to take me back to court for doing so.. However again, there seems to be a very unusual situation here so I don't know whether there would be any particular risks in doing so. In most cases I would think that a judge would NOT be happy to know that parent 1 was doing that kind of spying.

Parent1 has repeatedly been denied protective orders and made unfounded complaints to child protective services agency. It is reasonable to assume Pare3nt1 might make accusations against people caring for the child as she has included defamatory statements in court filings about family and friends of Parent2

Is there anything that can be done about this stalking? Other than not have anything to do with the child, what can we do to protect ourselves from her accusations?

I am back to thinking that unless there is some reason for such an unusual custody order that it would make sense to prevent the stalking and then sit back and let parent 1 take the situation to court and make a fool of himself/herself.

 

[t74]

Custody was originally joint legal and 50/50 physical but the parents could not agree on medical and education decisions; judge granted Parent1 sole legal and thus this parent demands total control over the child life even during Parent2's time. Parent2's opinions are supposed to be considered but agreements are ignored. Parent1 is preoccupied with the child's health to the extent that the child is subjected to questionable treatments and off formulary use of prescription drugs, herbal/vitamin & mineral remedies, and nontraditional, controversial therapies known to attempt to elicit repressed memories. This obsession seems to be seen as good even though the child has been made ill from some of the drugs. All of this is in the records. My family member has never had to deal with a sick child so does not need to be dealing with some of the drug interactions Parent1 claimed occurred. Obviously, when in doubt call 911.

Parent1 has filed numerous protective orders, emergency custody orders, and reports with child services; permanent orders were never granted and child services reports apparently did not substantiate any of the accusations. My family member has been interviewed 5 times including about events Parent1 did not know were personally observed. Parent1 filed for another emergency order less than one week after negotiating a settlement in lieu of a trial; this latest order was denied. Once again my family member was named in the complaint for simply driving the child to an event as Parent2 requested. My family member will have the child 4 days this week while Parent1 is likely angry for not prevailing last week.

Parent1 is not allowing the child to participate in organized activities that would be supervised by mandated reporters Parent1 has filed for full physical custody several times and it always been denied. Parent1 regularly threatens Parent2 that the fight will continue until the child can never again see Parent2 and Parent2's family so it would be easier to just give in and relinquish rights. Parent1 has started threatened other members of Parent2's immediate family and my family member and another friend (to a lesser extent).. As I said, I am afraid of what Parent1 might do as a crowbar had been used against Parent2's car in the past among other things.

Parent2 requested access to the phone. The judge ordered that Parent2 had to request Parent1 delete objectional apps but it was Parent1's decision whether or not to do so. Parent2 finally got access to see what had been installed and is working through them. It has been suggested that the ohone be taken to a digital forensic person for an evaluation. At dinner this evening, my child showed us the very inappropriate posting the child made to an online forum which he was too young to be on according to the forum's TOS. My child has found the child on other forums and using insecure messaging apps while the child while watching the child.

There have been several judges involved over time. I don't know if having only one following the case will make a difference.

I cannot solve Parent2's problems. I simply want to know how best to protect myself and my family members. I know what to do after the fact, I just don't want to be in that position if it can be prevented. When my children were teens, we were the object of harassment by other tees=ns, I am too old to deal with this type activity again.

 

[stealth2]

I have to be honest, t... if the other parent of a friend's child was causing this much drama in my life? I'd be out. Sad for your friend, but this isn't your responsibility.

 

[not2cleverRed]

We are involved since Parent1 goes after people Parent2 chooses to care for the child Both parents are at work so ROFR does not work. Child needs supervision. Other family members of the child are not available. Parent1 refuses to place child in professionally managed programs due to COVID. We are available but are afraid of Parent1's potential accusations and intrusions into our homes.

I am assuming that I am being told that the only way to insure our interests is to refuse to care for the child.

Then respectfully bow out.

This a legal advice forum, and that is my legal advice. You are a legal stranger.

 

[t74]

It has been a non issue since child has been with parent1. I had hoped the parents would come to an agreement about supervising the child but parent2 has again asked my family member to check on the child and make sure the child eats an appropriate lunch during the 10/11 hours parent2 is at work. Child services recommendation is that a child of that age be left alone no more than 3/4 hours at a time. Parent1 works even further from home than parent2 and apparently leaves child unsupervised. Parent1 has filed complaint with the court that parent2 left child unsupervised for less than 3 hours but will not allow child to participate in professionally supervised programs during either of their custodial periods. Because of parent1 objections, the judge ruled that the child could not participate in state licensed summer sports or computer camps during parent2's custody periods. Judge has not stated that the child could not be cared for by others coming into the homes; parent1 is claiming that allowing aomeone into the other parent's house is a medical decision they can control. This is alleged in parent1's pending contempt complaint.

My family member is taking online class for a new job while unemployed and lives less than 2 miles from parent2's home and can easily spend time in the home with or check on child.

Text from parent1 decreed that no one other than parent2, step-parent2 and sibling be in the 3000 sq ft house with the shared child at any time. Child has been ordered by parent1 to wear mask in the house when any member of parent2's family is present. Child is not even allowed go outside to play with the dogs in an over 1/4 acre yard. Even contact with grandparents has been decreed as unacceptable. Non of this has been disallowed by court order but parent 1 is claiming that all activities of the child are health care decisions requiring approval.

Child has seen no friends in months and tells people he is depressed. Child has cried to my family member that he is afraid he will never see his friends again and also has been found to be participating in age inappropriate (PG-13+) forums and posting to TikTok. I am afraid that the child will run away or engage in physically harmful activities.

If we help parent2, parent1 will file for contempt and might file against us. If we do not help parent2, parent1 will, based on past history, file an emergency PO to deny parent2's time and file with child services for parent leaving child alone. Parent1 has filed for sole legal and physical custody - and has stated the intent that parent2 will get no visitation at all - three times in less than one year. No matter what parent2 does, parent1 will likely complain to the court even though the work situation of both parents is identical. Actually, because of job parent1 is at greater risk of Covid exposure than any other individual who comes in contact with thechild.

Obviously, the safe thing for us is to refuse parent2's request. However, I believe doing so places the child at risk of harm. Reporting to child services will likely only return child to parent1 with the child in the same isolation. When with parent2, the child has multiple responsible adults within minutes of the child's location. Apparently the judge's solution to parent1 was for parent2 to hire a nanny to stay with the child; how is this different from having an even more responsible adult (retired medical professional, retired educator, 40 something adult who has known and provided occasional care for the child the child's entire life ) care for the child. Parent1's latest demands are defy reason but then again one never knows what a judge will do.

Since I am not a mandated reporter, I have no legal, but feel I do have a moral, obligation to protect the child. I just checked; the Department of Human Services does not require licensing for the type of care being provided. There is no one To report the situation to other than child services. who cannot, IMO, solve the problem unless they place the child in foster care which is needed for children who are at much greater risk.

I fear that the child will self harm if this situation continues especailly with the inappropriate internet activity encouraging poor choices. What should be done if we deny parent2's request for help? Crossing fingers and toes is not enough. If there is an alternate legal solution to child services, please let me know.

 

[Just Blue]

Is there any good reason that your friend, the parent, can't be directed to this site and ask their own question?