Accident resolution advice in question

[Rhio2k]

I got into an accident over the weekend due to turning outside the turn and because I went around a stalled car at the light and was tboned. Of course, I was cited, both vehicles totaled, other driver broken wrist. I'm self-insured under Florida law, which means I'm immediately liable for damage and injuries for up to 40,000. Value of other car is between 6,000 and 9,000. Treatment of a broken wrist should be somewhere between 6,000 and 14,000. Other party doesn't SEEM to want to sue, and has stated that he has no money to do so anyway. He offered for me to pay around 7,000 to handle the auto portion of the accident.

A lawyer I've called for advice in confidentiality and off the books says to give him NOTHING unless he gets legal representation and serves me, and to withdraw all funds from my banking account to prevent him or any legal help he can obtain from sizing me up and deciding if it's worth it to sue "because they can't take what they can't see", and my family is going for that, but I have misgivings. I'm all for accepting this guy's offer of buying the wrecked car and settling on that front (and having him sign a notarized document stating that he is satisfied in that resolution), then working with him with the rest of the money set aside for Self Insurance for the cost of his medical bills. I'm starting to wonder if this lawyer might just be giving me bad advice to get this situation to go to court in the hopes of me becoming a client.

 

[FlyingRon]

I think you misunderstand the law. You are liable for the other driver's actual damages which could end up in excess of $40,000. That amount is the amount Florida wants you to prove you're good for if you are going to self-insure, not some cap.

Frankly, I don't think much of the "lawyer" advice telling you to play idiotic games to hide your assets. First off, it won't work. Do you think an aggressive attorney is going to be fooled by such? Florida is a very plaintiff friendly state and if a lawsuit is indeed filed, you will likely be FORCED to disclose (under threat of perjury or other contempt action) to answer the questions that indicate how deep your pockets are.

As for whether it's a better ideal to settle or to wait for them to sue takes more information than you are providing. You'll need to run that by a COMPETENT attorney. Again, your "set aside" money isn't the limit of what they can go after you for. Frankly, if I pay them anything, it will be for COMPLETE release of the claim, not just a property settlement.

 

[Rhio2k]

I think you misunderstand the law. You are liable for the other driver's actual damages which could end up in excess of $40,000. That amount is the amount Florida wants you to prove you're good for if you are going to self-insure, not some cap.

Frankly, I don't think much of the "lawyer" advice telling you to play idiotic games to hide your assets. First off, it won't work. Do you think an aggressive attorney is going to be fooled by such? Florida is a very plaintiff friendly state and if a lawsuit is indeed filed, you will likely be FORCED to disclose (under threat of perjury or other contempt action) to answer the questions that indicate how deep your pockets are.

As for whether it's a better ideal to settle or to wait for them to sue takes more information than you are providing. You'll need to run that by a COMPETENT attorney. Again, your "set aside" money isn't the limit of what they can go after you for. Frankly, if I pay them anything, it will be for COMPLETE release of the claim, not just a property settlement.

I think that last part is what the lawyer is implying by telling me to reject that offer. So, as I thought I should be pushing for a total resolution of the situation instead of resolving it in stages. Thank you.

 

[Rhio2k]

The other party called and said he might be willing to wrap the entire mess up for 25,000. Then, he starts sounding kinda smarmy "Buuuuut, what about my pain and suffering?" I think he's messing with me now. I politely told him I had to go handle something outside, and I'd call him back when I could.

 

[adjusterjack]

Insurance companies routinely pay the auto damage part of the claim as soon as possible and then work on the injury part once the claimant recovers.

Nothing wrong with doing that. Just the opposite. Any delay in paying for the car would likely anger your claimant to the point of getting a lawyer to sue you. And that's going to cost you plenty.

My advice: Pay for the car, get a Property Claim Release that you can find on the internet. Good ones are written to state that you are not admitting liability for anything.

Then work on the injury claim by doing the same thing that an insurance company claim rep would do. Get the claimant's medical records along with his bills and wait until he is fully recovered to settle the injury portion of the claim.

I'm not even going to comment about the stupidity of driving without liability insurance no matter what the law allows or how much money you have in the bank.

 

[FlyingRon]

See what happens when you don't have an insurer running interference for you. If he won't take a "take it or leave it" estimation of the property and medical bills, I'd go back to where things were initially... wait for the lawsuit.

You now realize that self-insuring was probably a folly. First, if you have high net worth, you don't want to go with the "minimum protection" to begin with. You'll likely be paying an attorney as much as you would have paid in premiums. I carry a decent auto policy PLUS an umbrella.

 

[Rhio2k]

If we settle out of court, is there a limit to how stupid he can get with "pain and suffering"? I know most people go into litigious situations with the intent of never having to work again.

 

[FlyingRon]

People can be as stupid as they want. If you settle out of court, the get what they settled for. I can tell you in court in Florida, he'd get nothing for a transient injury. P&S awards are limited to "permanent injury within a reasonable degree of medical probability, other than scarring or disfigurement"

 

[Eekamouse]

If we settle out of court, is there a limit to how stupid he can get with "pain and suffering"? I know most people go into litigious situations with the intent of never having to work again.

How do you figure that? I know when I was hit by another driver on my bike, I didn't expect to come up on so much money I'd never have to work again. Never met anyone who's been in an accident that had that mindset.

 

[adjusterjack]

If we settle out of court, is there a limit to how stupid he can get with "pain and suffering"?

Not very.

FlyingRon is referring to Florida statute 627.737 which eliminates pain and suffering unless:

the injury or disease consists in whole or in part of:
(a) Significant and permanent loss of an important bodily function.
(b) Permanent injury within a reasonable degree of medical probability, other than scarring or disfigurement.
(c) Significant and permanent scarring or disfigurement.
(d) Death.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0600-0699/0627/Sections/0627.737.html
Further, Florida law requires that your claimant carry Personal Injury Protection in an amount not less than $10,000 to cover his medical bills and loss of earnings (referred to as special damages).

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0600-0699/0627/Sections/0627.737.html
If his special damages for a broken wrist don't exceed $10,000 you won't owe him a thing for his injury.

Again, whatever money he wants from you, get his medical records and bills to verify whether or not he's entitled to anything from you.

 

[Rhio2k]

Thanks for the info. He let slip that he's hired legal assistance, and my supervisor at work tells me that hiring an attorney before I get any sort of notice from whoever he might have representing him is pointless, as there's nothing to defend yet. Also, I've been calling around, and it seems like lawyers only wants to defend a claimant in cases like this, not a defendant. Also, I've been told that whatever assets I wish to protect, not to withdraw as per the free "legal" advice I had gotten earlier from that lawyer stated, but to simply place into a 401k account (and make sure it has "ERISA provisions"), but again, do it before getting word from the other side's defense. My employer has a Hancock retirement account, and I'm not sure I can even contribute to it, and I think it ONLY pertains to 401k accounts provided by employers, so I think that's out. I'm not trying to weasel out of making the other party whole again, but I don't want to leave him the ability to completely destroy me just because he can.

 

[FlyingRon]

You have to indicate that you are willing to PAY the attorney. There's nothing to be made on contingent fees when you are defending (without counterclaim). As we often state here "I was told" is a very dangerous thing to be relying on. First off, the contribution to a 401(k) is capped ($19,000 for this year unless you're over 50). A 401(k) has to be ERISA compliant so that's a stupid statement. A non-ERISA plan (such as an IRAs and some others) are indeed not by ERISA (federal)law, but they are exempt from attachment under Florida law. So, I suspect whoever you're "hearing things from" only has a tenuous grasp on the law.

So unless your net worth is only $19,000 (and you've not made any other 401(k) contributions), that's not much of a protection.

 

[Rhio2k]

Other party spoke about his medical outlook today: 6 weeks in a wrist cast, then weeks GOING TO rehab. ??? No nerve damage, yet having to leave home to do wrist rotation exercises you can do at home? I thought going to rehab was for back/leg/total limb/mobility issues. Hmm...

 

[not2cleverRed]

Other party spoke about his medical outlook today: 6 weeks in a wrist cast, then weeks GOING TO rehab. ??? No nerve damage, yet having to leave home to do wrist rotation exercises you can do at home? I thought going to rehab was for back/leg/total limb/mobility issues. Hmm...

What the heck do you think rehab is?

Yes, he can do exercises at home - after he sees the physical therapist and is evaluated. What? You think he should just come up with eercises on his own? Would you rather he have the PT eval at home?

There is a possibility that he may need no rehab, or that he might need a lot of rehab. It all depends on how it heals. They'll evaluate after he gets out of the cast.

By the way, having a broken wrist is very inconvenient. Like, more inconvenient than a broken 5th metacarpal - VOE.

 

[Rhio2k]

What the heck do you think rehab is?

Yes, he can do exercises at home - after he sees the physical therapist and is evaluated. What? You think he should just come up with eercises on his own? Would you rather he have the PT eval at home?

There is a possibility that he may need no rehab, or that he might need a lot of rehab. It all depends on how it heals. They'll evaluate after he gets out of the cast.

By the way, having a broken wrist is very inconvenient. Like, more inconvenient than a broken 5th metacarpal - VOE.

Ohhh, I see. Geez...once you realize there's so much you don't know that you don't know...