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Am I required to pay for repairs???

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belle54304

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Wisconsin

We have been renting a house for a little over a year. I recently turned on my self cleaning oven to clean itself as I have done monthly since we moved in and received an error code from my oven. I looked on the internet to find out what the error code meant and discovered that it needs a new heat sensor. I called my landlord this morning to inform them and was told that I cleaned the oven too much ( she recommends once a year) and that I would need to pay for the repairs on this. Now, nowhere in my lease does it say to clean it once a year and she claims to have told me this upon moving in over a year ago. From everything I have found on the internet in regards to a schedule for cleaning a self-cleaning oven it suggests once every 1-3 months or on an as needed basis. I was not provided with an owners manual for the oven and this oven is no longer being sold so I am not able to track down a copy on the internet (however I assume it is an early 90's model). I have also consulted with 2 people at appliance repair/sales shops and was given the same 1-3 months or as needed from them. Per our lease it state's the following regarding repairs:

Lessee shall make all required repairs to the plumbing, range, heating, apparatus, and electric and gas fixtures whenever damaged thereto shall have resulted from Lessee's misuse, waste or neglect. Major maintenance and repair of the leased premises, not due to the Lessee's misuse, waste, or neglect shall be the responsibility of Lessor.


****Could someone please tell me if I am responsible for the costs of these repairs.


More info: I use my oven quite frequently and at least once a week we have pizza which does usually drip cheese and I use a broiler pan a lot which also causes a lot of spillover. She also informed me that I should invest in new cookware to avoid spillage.

More info 09/23/08
I have spoken with 3 repair men now who have informed me that a heat sensor can go out for many reasons including an oven being older. I was also informed by another friend of mine who rents from the same LL that she was told at move in that she shouldn't use the oven a lot because the more use it gets the sooner it needs to be replaced.

My husband is planning on calling our LL today (because I would have to seriously bite my tongue if I did!) to inform her that she is responsible for the cost of the repair since we did not misuse the oven.

Any opinions????
 
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ecmst12

Senior Member
It doesn't sound like you were negligent, though monthly cleaning for an oven sounds way excessive to me, unless you use it constantly and spill stuff a lot.
 

FarmerJ

Senior Member
At the group homes I work in once a month is normal for cleaning , It is not excessive since the ovens are used once or twice a week and some of the stoves are pushing 10 yrs of service. Send your LL a letter via certified mail to back up the repair request and if the ll ignores it call your city /county govt center and ask to speak to housing inspections. sensors are around 75.00 for electric ovens , just had to replace one in the last month , it took more time to move and unplug the stove and clean under it than it did to install the sensor.
 

MIRAKALES

Senior Member
It would seem simple to invest in an oven mat to prevent unnecessary cleaning from spillage. The use of larger pans and even the placement of aluminum foil on the bottom of the oven would prevent spill contact with the actual oven. Now, with that said, the oven is about fifteen (15) or more years old which does not mean it requires replacement, but ovens do not require maintenance other than cleaning and rare heat setting calibration. The self-cleaning mode on the oven is the highest heat setting for the oven which cause exceptional wear on the oven. The regular use of the self-cleaning mode would likely cause the heat sensor to wear before the life expectancy. (This usually happens when tenants forget to turn the oven off which causes the heat sensor to malfunction.)
Same heat sensor wear may be true with regular use of self-cleaning mode.
 

ecmst12

Senior Member
If the manufacturer recommends cleaning every 1-3 months, then cleaning every month is not more then the oven is designed to handle. This is normal wear and tear and the tenant should NOT be required to pay for it.
 

FarmerJ

Senior Member
Mira wrote > but ovens do not require maintenance other than cleaning and rare heat setting calibration. < not true , gas ovens with glow plugs can have the glow plug burn out VERY easy as well as crack, Thermostats can fail, electric ovens elements and sensors go out easy enough and last but not least so do the damn computers in most newer stoves ! Bell, back up all phone and face to face conversations regarding repairs to any thing inc the stove in written form sent via confirmed mail delivery so you have the complaints backed up in a paper trail, Your LL can argue all they want saying you caused the problem BUT ultimately they will have to prove it ! thats a hard stretch to prove with your stoves problem.
 

MIRAKALES

Senior Member
The point that is being overlooked is tenant responsibility for the management and care of the rental. This would imply simply considerations, such as not allowing the appliances to become HABITUALLY FILTHY. This would avoid the need to habitually self-clean. When it does become dirty or stained try another invention, such as soap and water.

When a LL makes an investment in appliances it is presumed that the appliance will be cared for. The manufacturer presumes that the appliance will be maintained and used in accordance with normal function. To use the self-cleaning feature for an appliance EVERY month is ridiculous, plain and simple! Habitual appliance filth is abuse and neglect, that is not normal. Therefore, the &#8220;normal wear and tear&#8221; excuse is not reliable. This tenant has occupied the premises for only one year; if the appliance does not have a history of repair then most likely the problem is with tenant and abusive cleaning and negligent care.

Based in experience, tenants with major appliance issues tend to have multiple premise damage issues -- issues with multiple appliances (if not the refrigerator it&#8217;s the stove, if not the stove it&#8217;s the oven, if not the oven it&#8217;s the dishwasher, etc.). Without a doubt the other appliances are just as unclean. Then there are the notorious plumbing (toilets, sinks), electric (outlets, switches, sockets), etc. Never ending&#8230; When tenants receive bills for the damages, suddenly there are no more occurrences&#8230; miraculous? How quickly we learn when it cost us our own money.
 

belle54304

Junior Member
The point that is being overlooked is tenant responsibility for the management and care of the rental. This would imply simply considerations, such as not allowing the appliances to become HABITUALLY FILTHY. This would avoid the need to habitually self-clean. When it does become dirty or stained try another invention, such as soap and water.

When a LL makes an investment in appliances it is presumed that the appliance will be cared for. The manufacturer presumes that the appliance will be maintained and used in accordance with normal function. To use the self-cleaning feature for an appliance EVERY month is ridiculous, plain and simple! Habitual appliance filth is abuse and neglect, that is not normal. Therefore, the “normal wear and tear” excuse is not reliable. This tenant has occupied the premises for only one year; if the appliance does not have a history of repair then most likely the problem is with tenant and abusive cleaning and negligent care.

Based in experience, tenants with major appliance issues tend to have multiple premise damage issues -- issues with multiple appliances (if not the refrigerator it’s the stove, if not the stove it’s the oven, if not the oven it’s the dishwasher, etc.). Without a doubt the other appliances are just as unclean. Then there are the notorious plumbing (toilets, sinks), electric (outlets, switches, sockets), etc. Never ending… When tenants receive bills for the damages, suddenly there are no more occurrences… miraculous? How quickly we learn when it cost us our own money.



In response, let me begin by saying that I DO NOT let anything in my home become "HABITUALLY FILTHY"! I clean my oven when it needs to be cleaned. Have you over had something spill over when it was cooking and then it becomes baked on???? Well when that does happen soap and water do not do the trick and it needs to actually be cleaned!!!

Secondly, I probably have the most well kept appliance in a rental unit! I have never had to have any type of service work done in the 14 months that I have lived in this home. I have never had to call them for anything until the oven.

The oven in our home stopped being produced in 1995 and sold in 1996, it has been in this home since 1995 and was used by the homeowner and has since been used by multiple tenants. We are the 6th family to use this oven and we are the only renters who have stayed for over a year! (The previous owner lived in this home until 2001!)

From your response I take it you are a LL and have been burned one two many times by your tenants and I am sorry that has happened to you. We however, take very good care of our home and have the intentions of buying it from our LL in the next few years!
 

MIRAKALES

Senior Member
In response, let me begin by saying that I DO NOT let anything in my home become "HABITUALLY FILTHY"! I clean my oven when it needs to be cleaned. Every month is questionable and agreeably excessive. Have you over had something spill over when it was cooking and then it becomes baked on???? Well when that does happen soap and water do not do the trick and it needs to actually be cleaned!!! That's what oven mats and aluminum foil and appropriate cookware are for.

The oven in our home stopped being produced in 1995 and sold in 1996, it has been in this home since 1995 and was used by the homeowner and has since been used by multiple tenants. We are the 6th family to use this oven and we are the only renters who have stayed for over a year! (The previous owner lived in this home until 2001!) Purchased multiple appliances in 1996 that are still in remarkably good condition and working order.

From your response I take it you are a LL and have been burned one two many times by your tenants and I am sorry that has happened to you. We however, take very good care of our home and have the intentions of buying it from our LL in the next few years! Never had tenant damages with the exception of neglect. In the case of wall ovens, repeated failure of tenant to turn appliance off after use.
 

belle54304

Junior Member
In response, let me begin by saying that I DO NOT let anything in my home become "HABITUALLY FILTHY"! I clean my oven when it needs to be cleaned. Every month is questionable and agreeably excessive. Have you over had something spill over when it was cooking and then it becomes baked on???? Well when that does happen soap and water do not do the trick and it needs to actually be cleaned!!! That's what oven mats and aluminum foil and appropriate cookware are for.

The oven in our home stopped being produced in 1995 and sold in 1996, it has been in this home since 1995 and was used by the homeowner and has since been used by multiple tenants. We are the 6th family to use this oven and we are the only renters who have stayed for over a year! (The previous owner lived in this home until 2001!) Purchased multiple appliances in 1996 that are still in remarkably good condition and working order.

From your response I take it you are a LL and have been burned one two many times by your tenants and I am sorry that has happened to you. We however, take very good care of our home and have the intentions of buying it from our LL in the next few years! Never had tenant damages with the exception of neglect. In the case of wall ovens, repeated failure of tenant to turn appliance off after use.
In response to the oven mats or aluminum foil: We were informed by our LL when we moved in that she did not want such things in the oven.

As for the appliances age, from the research I have done online, I have found that it is not common for consumers to have problems with the oven that I currently have. I discovered on numerous sites that many people just like me have had the same issue whether they clean there oven once a month, every 3 months or once a year!

I would prefer if you would not respond to any of my posts in the future.
 

MIRAKALES

Senior Member
In response to the oven mats or aluminum foil: We were informed by our LL when we moved in that she did not want such things in the oven.
Does not make sense, therefore is not likely to be true. LL has vested interest in protecting their investment.

As for the appliances age, from the research I have done online, I have found that it is not common for consumers to have problems with the oven that I currently have. I discovered on numerous sites that many people just like me have had the same issue whether they clean there oven once a month, every 3 months or once a year! Apparently, these appliances have been functional for fifteen (15) years, until... this year's encounter with a particular tenant.

I would prefer if you would not respond to any of my posts in the future. Do not take posted responses personally in a public forum. More important, keep post focused on the topic and not directed to individuals.
 

ecmst12

Senior Member
Don't listen to Mirk, he knows what he's talking about so rarely that it has to be an accident when it happens. You did nothing wrong and you're not responsible to pay for any repairs that weren't caused by your negligence. If the landlord refuses to repair in a timely manner, I suggest you read up on your state's laws on repair & deduct.
 

MIRAKALES

Senior Member
Learn the legal difference between normal wear and tear and premise damage and negligence. Therein is where most tenants become misguided. It would be recommended not to follow the opinions of non-property owners. The thought processes tend to lead to non-lease related issues with LL and lease violations. People that own property and actually manage multiple rental units tend to be more versed than perpetual tenants and individual personal experiences.
LL probably has a Move-In Property Inspection Report signed and dated by tenant with purchase receipts for appliances.
 

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