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BP and others guilty?

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HomeGuru

Senior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? numerous states.


Do you think that there should be civil and criminal investigations and the individuals responsible fined and thrown in prison?
 


justalayman

Senior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? numerous states.


Do you think that there should be civil and criminal investigations and the individuals responsible fined and thrown in prison?
Prison? No. They should be given little plastic toy shovels and a lot of paper towels and made to go clean up their mess.


From what is coming out in the news, I believe there should absolutely be at least investigations for civil wrongs. Criminal investigations; maybe. Obviously since they are much harder to prove, it may be a wasted endeavor but I would not be against such investigations if those with a lot more knowledge than I have about the situation deem it appropriate.
 
Do you think that there should be civil and criminal investigations
I am sure there will be, no matter what we think, and yes I do think such investigations are a good idea.
and the individuals responsible fined and thrown in prison?
If they are found guilty of violation of some law, they certainly should be fined and/or jailed.

But in the end industrial accidents like this happen and I think there is a reasonable chance no one is guilty of a crime. It will be easy once we understand what happened to Monday morning quarterback the thing and point out what should have been done, but no engineering venture is without risk and if we want to live in an industrialized world we have to accept risks like this. I am more concerned that we learn from this and reduce the chances it will happen again, and improve our technology to fix it if it does.
 

CourtClerk

Senior Member
Given the history of other violations, someone needs to go to jail on this one and fines so high, BP goes out of business.... tomorrow.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
But in the end industrial accidents like this happen and I think there is a reasonable chance no one is guilty of a crime. .
Really? 11 people died and there is a great probability it is due to the actions of those businesses involved and you think nobody is guilty of a crime?

You sound like the guy I want on my jury if I am ever a defendant in a criminal trial.
 

CourtClerk

Senior Member
But in the end industrial accidents like this happen and I think there is a reasonable chance no one is guilty of a crime.
Dude, this was no run of the mill OSHA violation... have you seen the devastation???

This is making the whole Exxon Valdez incident look like I dropped a bottle of Wesson oil on the kitchen floor.
 

atomizer

Senior Member
Given the history of other violations, someone needs to go to jail on this one and fines so high, BP goes out of business.... tomorrow.
Sure, run them out of business and have thousands of stock holders lose their investments. If you have a pension plan with your company, there is a good chance you own some BP stock. Obama by his inaction/lethargic response is as much to blame as anyone else. Dozens of nations have offered to help and he has declined their assistance. There are federal laws set in place during the Clinton administration that could have assisted in the cleanup, but he chose not to utilized them as well. I guess it was more important to concentrate of sending lawyers and starting lawsuits then to take direct action and providing assistance in capping the well/perform the cleanup.
 

tranquility

Senior Member
Investigations need to happen. Drilling so deep is an inherently dangerous activity and if there is merely negligence, I am uncertain as to if there should be criminal penalties. I mean, really, what is the DUTY here for even a negligence calculation? Who are you going to ask other than the people who were doing it? You're going to ask ME (If I were on a jury.) if using 6 centralizers as opposed to 21 is a breach of duty? Please.

Yet, because it is so dangerous, I have no problem of per se negligence standard and BP needs to pay for the damages proximately related. (Which, in my mind would not include the people who are out of work due to presidential fiat for no scientific reason.)

If, after a reasonable investigation, it is found that certain people were RECKLESS in their behavior or choices, then criminal responsibility for the death and destruction is entirely appropriate. Not for the officers of the corporation (Unless the reckless orders came from them.), but for the people involved.

Any other standard, and you might as well get your bikes lubed with vegetable shortening as you're not going to have enough gasoline to drive anywhere.

Info edit:
For one reason why international assistance is being refused, look at the Jones Act. Thanks again, unions! Of course, it could be waived by the administration. I wonder why it hasn't been done yet?
 
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atomizer

Senior Member
Well, BP has just agreed to give the Obama administration access to 20 billion dollars. Now, how much will be distributed to people that lost income due to Obama's ban on offshore drilling? How much of that cash will be siphoned off by the government for other than direct damage to the environment? I bet O's lawyers will make a killing! Acorn! put in your claim.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
Well, BP has just agreed to give the Obama administration access to 20 billion dollars. Now, how much will be distributed to people that lost income due to Obama's ban on offshore drilling? How much of that cash will be siphoned off by the government for other than direct damage to the environment? I bet O's lawyers will make a killing! Acorn! put in your claim.
**A: $20 billion is not enough but it's a start.
 

tranquility

Senior Member
**A: $20 billion is not enough but it's a start.
Attitudes such as this is why I think BP was foolish to agree to the escrow.

"Start"? There's lots of blame to go around. While the current pretend money of the administration makes $20 billion seem...irrelevant, the money and the future monies to be *demanded* of BP make it silly. Better to have agreed to a true 3rd party to decide.

This is real. This is something which hurts many. An "escrow" account is designed to further the goals of a political constituency and not designed to address the needs of those truly hurt.

I await the appointment of an Obama favored appointee. I would love the same scrutiny applied to the errors or crimes of BP be applied to those who distribute the money.
 

JustAPal00

Senior Member
That rig was inspected 10 days before the accident. The government passed it. They also gave BP exemptions on other inspections. This could have been due to the large amount of money they donated to President Obama's campaign. The government is to blame! Since we elected them, that makes us to blame! If BP was acting within the laws and guidelines set by our leaders then they should be responsible for the damage they caused only!
 

Banned_Princess

Senior Member
They should at least be giving away gas at super discount prices.

Like 1.25 per gallon.

I hope a hurricane in the gulf doesn't create fire rain on shore.
 
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