Buying a logo online

[Liza38]

Hello,

We just started a small non profit and we were looking for a logo. We picked the cheapest online and it was stating the files we were going to receive, the number of revisions and that we were going to get the ownership. We paid and after 3 weeks of back and forth emails the logo is finalized. That's when their legal team called me for the trademarking I did not ask for. And told me that I have to pay 800 of legal fees and government fees. When I said that I want the logo without trademark, their boss called me and said I can't and he can offer me the cheaper version: copyright for 250 dollars. It is written nowhere that I have to pay this and they said they don't have too as it is mandatory by law... Now, they say they can refund but I cannot use the logo or something that resemble it... Can we still use our idea with a more honest designer?
Thanks

 

[Just Blue]

Hello,

We just started a small non profit and we were looking for a logo. We picked the cheapest online and it was stating the files we were going to receive, the number of revisions and that we were going to get the ownership. We paid and after 3 weeks of back and forth emails the logo is finalized. That's when their legal team called me for the trademarking I did not ask for. And told me that I have to pay 800 of legal fees and government fees. When I said that I want the logo without trademark, their boss called me and said I can't and he can offer me the cheaper version: copyright for 250 dollars. It is written nowhere that I have to pay this and they said they don't have too as it is mandatory by law... Now, they say they can refund but I cannot use the logo or something that resemble it... Can we still use our idea with a more honest designer?
Thanks

What state?

 

[Liza38]

I am in Colorado but the business is in France. It is a californian company who designed the logo

 

[LdiJ]

I am in Colorado but the business is in France. It is a californian company who designed the logo

So where would you be using the logo?

 

[Liza38]

In France

 

[quincy]

I am in Colorado but the business is in France. It is a californian company who designed the logo

A logo is a trademark. There is a fee to have the logo registered with the United States Patent and Trademark Office (USPTO) and, if the design is original and creative enough, a smaller fee to register the design with the US Copyright Office.

There can also be a transfer of rights fee.

Right now, you apparently have no rights in the final logo design, absent any written and signed agreement to the contrary that expressly transfers these rights. The copyrights in the design rest with the creator of the logo.

Although registration of the trademark/copyright is not a requirement in the US, for a trademark to have protection under trademark laws in the US, the trademark/logo must first be used in commerce as an identifier for a company’s goods or services.

In the US, it will be the first to use the logo/trademark in commerce who will be the presumed owner of the trademark/logo. In other countries, like France, it will be the first to register the mark/logo who is the presumed owner.

So ... what does your existing contract with the French company say about the transfer of rights in the logo?

 

[LdiJ]

A logo is a trademark. There is a fee to have the logo registered with the United States Patent and Trademark Office (USPTO) and, if the design is original and creative enough, a smaller fee to register the design with the US Copyright Office.

There can also be a transfer of rights fee.

Right now, you apparently have no rights in the final logo design, absent any written and signed agreement to the contrary that expressly transfers these rights. The copyrights in the design rest with the creator of the logo.

Although registration of the trademark/copyright is not a requirement, for a trademark to have protection under trademark laws, the trademark/logo must first be used in commerce as an identifier for a company’s goods or services.

So ... what does your existing contract with the French company say about the transfer of rights in the logo?

The logo is going to be used in France, therefore US law does not really apply in terms of trademarking etc. I am uncertain as to whether or not I agree with you that they do not have the rights to the logo. It was never disclosed to them that they would have to pay an attorney for trademarking, particular trademarking that could be somewhat useless to them since the logo will be used in France.

I also disagree, vehemently with the design's company's statement that they do not have to disclose that they will force you to pay a fee for trademarking, because it's mandatory by law. It is certainly NOT mandatory. Wise perhaps, but not mandatory.

 

[Liza38]

I am the president of this company that is a association loi 1901 so we don't have any special contract. My concern is that I paid a service where it was said I will have 100% ownership of my logo with the package I bought, no mention of extra cost to get it at the end....

A logo is a trademark. There is a fee to have the logo registered with the United States Patent and Trademark Office (USPTO) and, if the design is original and creative enough, a smaller fee to register the design with the US Copyright Office.

There can also be a transfer of rights fee.

Right now, you apparently have no rights in the final logo design, absent any written and signed agreement to the contrary that expressly transfers these rights. The copyrights in the design rest with the creator of the logo.

Although registration of the trademark/copyright is not a requirement in the US, for a trademark to have protection under trademark laws in the US, the trademark/logo must first be used in commerce as an identifier for a company’s goods or services.

In the US, it will be the first to use the logo/trademark in commerce who will be the presumed owner of the trademark/logo. In other countries, like France, it will be the first to register the mark/logo who is the presumed owner.

So ... what does your existing contract with the French company say about the transfer of rights in the logo?

 

[LdiJ]

I am the president of this company that is a association loi 1901 so we don't have any special contract. My concern is that I paid a service where it was said I will have 100% ownership of my logo with the package I bought, no mention of extra cost to get it at the end....

Print out all of the documentation that says that you will 100% own your logo with the package you bought and put it somewhere safe. I think that you should go ahead and use your logo. You paid for it.

 

[quincy]

I am the president of this company that is a association loi 1901 so we don't have any special contract. My concern is that I paid a service where it was said I will have 100% ownership of my logo with the package I bought, no mention of extra cost to get it at the end....

You did not have a written contract?

I recommend you speak with an attorney in your area for a personal review of both the agreement you had with the California company and the service you hired in France.

I disagree with LdiJ. Registration of the logo for use in France is important. Your use of the trademark will fall under the IP laws of France, not the US.

 

[LdiJ]

You did not have a written contract?

I recommend you speak with an attorney in your area for a personal review of both the agreement you had with the California company and the service you hired in France.

I disagree with LdiJ. Registration of the logo for use in France is important.

Just in case, because you have said a couple of things that make it seem as though you are confused...

The OP's company who is going to use the logo is in France.

The design company that made the logo for the OP is in California.

The OP is in Colorado.

 

[Liza38]

Thank you

Print out all of the documentation that says that you will 100% own your logo with the package you bought and put it somewhere safe. I think that you should go ahead and use your logo. You paid for it.

 

[quincy]

Just in case, because you have said a couple of things that make it seem as though you are confused...

The OP's company who is going to use the logo is in France.

The design company that made the logo for the OP is in California.

The OP is in Colorado.

I am not confused. The rights to the logo design must be transferred in a written and signed transfer of rights agreement. The use of the logo as a company identifier in France will be governed by the IP laws of France. Despite Colorado being the state of residence, it does not play a role in the use of the logo in a foreign country.

 

[Liza38]

You did not have a written contract?

I recommend you speak with an attorney in your area for a personal review of both the agreement you had with the California company and the service you hired in France.

I disagree with LdiJ. Registration of the logo for use in France is important. Your use of the trademark will fall under the IP laws of France, not the US.

I just paid a package that said on the website that I will have 100% ownership, I had a receipt, no contract

 

[quincy]

I just paid a package that said on the website that I will have 100% ownership, I had a receipt, no contract

Not having a written contract was a mistake.

You will want this “package” you purchased personally reviewed by an IP attorney.

It is important to note that what you purchased in California might not be useable as a company identifier in France.

Are you marketing goods or services in France? Are there competing goods or services being offered in France under the same or similar name or logo? You have registered nothing?