CA camera ticket issued, out of state/wasn't driving

[jwr28s]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA (infraction) / CT (reside)

Hi everyone, I know this has been covered at length previously, so I will try to keep it brief!

My son ran a red light in Beverly Hills, CA (he lives in West LA) but his car is registered under my name to my address in Connecticut. I received the camera ticket in Connecticut under my name, and understand I have a few options to fight the ticket at this point on the basis of gender mismatch/identity mismatch (the included photo shows very clearly that it is not me - 22 y/o male vs 58 y/o female):

(1) Call the Beverly Hills PD and say "It's not me" and request they dismiss it

-How can I circumvent the "Who was it" question without lying, breaking the law, or angering any police officers?

-If they do decide to dismiss, how easy is it to look up my Connecticut address for other registered drivers and reissue the citation? His license is registered to our Connecticut address as well. Perhaps they don't explore the issue quite the same if licenses are out of state?

(2) Submitting a trial by declaration to plead not guilty and request dismissal of the ticket.

-What is the likelihood that I could receive a guilty decision despite the very obvious picture evidence? I cannot fly to California for an appealed trial de novo, nor do I want the points on my record.

-Same as above- how easy is it for them to track back to the CT address for other drivers and reissue the ticket?

I appreciate any help or experience you can offer us! The cost of this ticket ($445) is way too much for me or my son to handle right now...

 

[HighwayMan]

If it's your sons car then why is it registered to you? If he lives in California then why does he have a Connecticut license? Prepare for more issues if these are not corrected.

And I hope you realize that your insurance company will not be too happy if they find out that they are insuring a car they think is in Connecticut but is really on the opposite coast.

Someone is gong to have to pay up at some point - the infraction is recorded on camera.

 

[jwr28s]

Thanks for the quick reply.

If it's your sons car then why is it registered to you? If he lives in California then why does he have a Connecticut license? Prepare for more issues if these are not corrected.
Taxes, insurance rates, and convenience. I understand this may raise some issues with insurance, which will have to be dealt with later. Will this necessarily affect the outcome of the traffic infraction?


And I hope you realize that your insurance company will not be too happy if they find out that they are insuring a car they think is in Connecticut but is really on the opposite coast.
Correct.

Someone is gong to have to pay up at some point - the infraction is recorded on camera.
Do you have any experience with either of my two considerations relating to the gender mismatch between the driver versus the violator named on the ticket? More specifically, directly contacting the police department to request dismissal, or pleading via trial by declaration?

 

[I_Got_Banned]

First things first...
1. What was the date of the violation and the date the notice of infraction mailed?
2. Does the notice that you received have a "Do Not Contact The Court" or does it have an "appear/pay by" date?

(1) Call the Beverly Hills PD and say "It's not me" and request they dismiss it

-How can I circumvent the "Who was it" question without lying, breaking the law, or angering any police officers?

By simply saying that California law does not require you to reveal who the driver was... yes, that might upset the officer(s) but oh well, so what... You were charged with a violation that you are not guilty of committing and therefore, if that upsets them then... uhm... tough! they'll have to deal with it.

-If they do decide to dismiss, how easy is it to look up my Connecticut address for other registered drivers and reissue the citation?[/I]

I am not sure how easy it would be for them to research it, find out the address of other drivers from a different state... Think about it though... They were able to find your name and address by simply reading the license plate number off of the picture. So I would venture a guess that they do have some access to CT records. Whether they will put forth the effort to research it further... I don't know.

I would suggest that you not worry about that now. Deal with the current situation at hand and let them worry about finding the actual driver.

(2) Submitting a trial by declaration to plead not guilty and request dismissal of the ticket.

-What is the likelihood that I could receive a guilty decision despite the very obvious picture evidence?

If you were to provide valid proof showing that you were not the driver pictured on the citation, I see no reason why you would be found guilty. While there are some people who would suggest that defendants declarations aren't even looked at/reviewed, and that they are frequently "rubber stamped 'guilty'", I have a bit more faith in the legal justice system.

I cannot fly to California for an appealed trial de novo, nor do I want the points on my record.[/I]

Well, unfortunately, if you lose a TBD, then your only recourse would be to file a Trial De Novo and appear in court to have the matter adjudicated. The only other likely option would be to hire an attorney to appear on your behalf. And although that might cost you a pretty penny, it is an option nonetheless.

By the way, and just so that you can be ready, if BHPD refuses to dismiss the citation, and if you do choose to file a request for a TBD, most courts will require you to post the bail amount (the $445) along with your request (otherwise your request will be rejected and returned). The bail amount is held by the court and if you lose it is used to cover the fine amount, if you win, it is refunded to you in 6 to 8 weeks after the case is closed.

Good luck!

 

[demurringdude]

Someone is gong to have to pay up at some point - the infraction is recorded on camera.

That's not how it works in California. Only the driver can be charged, and if they don't know who that is, then nobody pays anything.

 

[Zigner]

That's not how it works in California. Only the driver can be charged, and if they don't know who that is, then nobody pays anything.

Well - you are OBVIOUSLY wrong. Otherwise our OP wouldn't be here in the first place, would she?

 

[demurringdude]

Well - you are OBVIOUSLY wrong. Otherwise our OP wouldn't be here in the first place, would she?

If you want to be pedantic about it, then I'll amend that to "only the driver should be charged". In contrast some to other states where the owner is liable no matter who is driving.

 

[Zigner]

If you want to be pedantic about it, then I'll amend that to "only the driver should be charged". In contrast some to other states where the owner is liable no matter who is driving.

In the law, the details matter. I'm sorry that YOU don't think it's important to actually give accurate information.

 

[demurringdude]

In the law, the details matter. I'm sorry that YOU don't think it's important to actually give accurate information.

I'm not trying to give an exhaustive legal analysis complete with every qualification and every detail. I'm just briefly correcting the post Highwayman made that this ticket is going to have to be paid by someone. It isn't. Assuming everyone does what they are supposed to do, etc etc.

You didn't bother to correct highwayman's error yourself, so I don't see why you need to jump all over my better information.

 

[Zigner]

You didn't bother to correct highwayman's error yourself, so I don't see why you need to jump all over my better information.

Would you like some cheese...?

 

[demurringdude]

Would you like some cheese...?

Do you have some legal advice for the poster, or are you just trolling for the fun of it?

 

[demurringdude]

-How can I circumvent the "Who was it" question without lying, breaking the law, or angering any police officers?

Call them at the police station and point out that they have obviously issued the ticket to the wrong person and you would like it withdrawn otherwise you will fight it and win in court. When they ask you who was driving, or tell you they won't cancel the ticket unless you tell them, just say you know perfectly well that you don't have to tell them that and you aren't going to discuss it. You have to be firm. I shouldn't imagine the police officer could care less about you possibly angering him, and nor should you. But you can bet he will try to get a name, so be firm but polite. You shouldn't tell any lies, just say you aren't discussing it. If they think you are clueless, they will push you. Don't give them that impression.

Given the difference in age and gender, that stands a good chance of working. However, they might just take the risk that you won't show up since you are out of state, so be prepared to get your TBD in on time, and you will win. No judge is going to rule against you on that one. Assuming the picture is as clear as you say.

 

[Zigner]

Call them at the police station and point out that they have obviously issued the ticket to the wrong person and you would like it withdrawn

That'll be good for a chuckle...

 

[demurringdude]

That'll be good for a chuckle...

No, that actually works sometimes. The police have better things to do than stand in front of a judge with a picture of a 20-something male and ask him to believe it's a 50-something female. So these gross errors can and do get torn up before getting to court. I know people who have successfully done that. It's easier than doing a TBD or showing up, especially if you are the other side of the country like this poster. And, dare I say it, it is courtesy to the police officer and a better use of his time to point this out early, rather than waiting to get to court.

 

[HighwayMan]

Taxes, insurance rates, and convenience. I understand this may raise some issues with insurance, which will have to be dealt with later.

It can be considered fraud. Why should anyone have to pay higher insurance rates because you (and others) choose to cheat the system?

You are also likely not to be happy when your son gets stopped and issued tickets for improper license and registration.