Claim Jurisdiction

[Asha B]

What is the name of your state? Hawaii

I have a very established wedding business in Hawaii and the couple that owes us money for their wedding live in California. They wrote us a check we deposited before the wedding, then after the wedding our bank notified us that it bounced. The couple was very happy with their wedding and we did everything we were contracted to do and beyond! When I told the bride the check bounced said she would send a bank check - which never came. Then she said on several occassions via email and text she would pay online, but she only paid a portion as she claimed her bank had a limit for online payments?! followed up on several occaisions with emails, calls and texts for the final balance but she never paid. The couple owes us 3200. I have never experienced anything like this in all my many years in this business.

Do we file small claims in Hawaii - where she got married and contracted with us, and where the business is based - OR California where they live? Is there really a change to get the money owed or will we just be out more money with filing fees? Will filing at least affect her credit? Any advise would be much appreciated! We worked very hard on this destination wedding and it's just not right

 

[adjusterjack]

Do we file small claims in Hawaii - where she got married and contracted with us, and where the business is based - OR California where they live?

The trouble with filing in Hawaii is they can ignore it, you'll get a default judgment and then have to enforce it in California anyway. Once you start trying that they can seek to get the judgment set aside for any number of reasons, even bogus reasons, but it's easy in small claims court because things are informal and judges prefer to hear cases on their merits. The trouble with filing in California is that you'll have to travel to California to testify and you don't get your travel costs or time off from work.

Is there really a change to get the money owed or will we just be out more money with filing fees?

There's always a chance. But let's face it. People who bounce checks are deadbeats and it's almost impossible to collect from deadbeats.

Will filing at least affect her credit?

Filing won't but a judgment will. If you did file in Hawaii and if you did get a default judgment and if you did register your judgment with their local court in California and if they didn't try to get it set aside you could go after their wages and bank account and record the judgment in their county of residence so it becomes a black mark on their credit. Whether any of that ever gets you any money is anybody's guess.

As a matter of strategy, you might mail them a demand letter with a completed (but not filed) small claims complaint form (to show you mean business) and give a deadline to pay. If they don't pay by the deadline, you file your lawsuit. Don't bluff. If you are threatening suit, be prepared to back it up.

You might also want to file a police report in the city where they live. Passing a bad check is a crime in California if there was intent to defraud:

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=476a.

Getting questioned by the police might scare them into paying.

 

[NeilTheCop]

Getting questioned by the police might scare them into paying.

Or to really scare them post on their Facebook or Twitter page (they will have one or both) that the check bounced and the bank check still hasn't arrived. DO NOT THREATEN ANYTHING, just state the facts that you can substantiate.

 

[quincy]

Or to really scare them post on their Facebook or Twitter page (they will have one or both) that the check bounced and the bank check still hasn't arrived. DO NOT THREATEN ANYTHING, just state the facts that you can substantiate.

Not a good idea. Nothing should be written online about the couple.

The suggestions by adjusterjack are good ones.

 

[Asha B]

The trouble with filing in Hawaii is they can ignore it, you'll get a default judgment and then have to enforce it in California anyway. Once you start trying that they can seek to get the judgment set aside for any number of reasons, even bogus reasons, but it's easy in small claims court because things are informal and judges prefer to hear cases on their merits. The trouble with filing in California is that you'll have to travel to California to testify and you don't get your travel costs or time off from work.



There's always a chance. But let's face it. People who bounce checks are deadbeats and it's almost impossible to collect from deadbeats.



Filing won't but a judgment will. If you did file in Hawaii and if you did get a default judgment and if you did register your judgment with their local court in California and if they didn't try to get it set aside you could go after their wages and bank account and record the judgment in their county of residence so it becomes a black mark on their credit. Whether any of that ever gets you any money is anybody's guess.

As a matter of strategy, you might mail them a demand letter with a completed (but not filed) small claims complaint form (to show you mean business) and give a deadline to pay. If they don't pay by the deadline, you file your lawsuit. Don't bluff. If you are threatening suit, be prepared to back it up.

You might also want to file a police report in the city where they live. Passing a bad check is a crime in California if there was intent to defraud:

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=476a.

Getting questioned by the police might scare them into paying.

Adjusterjack,

Thank you so much for the detailed response, it is extremely helpful! I think filing the police report is a great course of action and will do so tomorrow. I have a feeling this is something these people do on the regular, so the chances of success with small claims is problably slim and sounds like a lot more time consuming on our part than filing a police report. Mailing the form requesting payment before filing is good, but my sense is that it will be ignored.

Getting the money we are owed would be ideal. Holding them responsible for their slimy behavior is most important, we can't let people like this just walk away with no consequences.

Thank you again, deeply grateful for your advice,
Veronika

 

[adjusterjack]

Here's another suggestion. For the future wait for the checks to clear before you perform your services. Either that or require cash, money orders, or cashier's checks from out-of-state people and cash them quickly, or just don't do business with out-of-state people.

 

[Asha B]

Here's another suggestion. For the future wait for the checks to clear before you perform your services. Either that or require cash, money orders, or cashier's checks from out-of-state people and cash them quickly, or just don't do business with out-of-state people.

We are no longer accepting personal checks after this incident! I didn't even suspect that the check wouldn't clear when I deposited it as I have never had anyone do this before, and I couldn't imagine someone scamming on their own wedding - what a foundation for a marriage, right?

 

[adjusterjack]

I couldn't imagine someone scamming on their own wedding - what a foundation for a marriage, right?

Maybe they are both crooks and made for each other.

 

[Asha B]

The trouble with filing in Hawaii is they can ignore it, you'll get a default judgment and then have to enforce it in California anyway. Once you start trying that they can seek to get the judgment set aside for any number of reasons, even bogus reasons, but it's easy in small claims court because things are informal and judges prefer to hear cases on their merits. The trouble with filing in California is that you'll have to travel to California to testify and you don't get your travel costs or time off from work.



There's always a chance. But let's face it. People who bounce checks are deadbeats and it's almost impossible to collect from deadbeats.



Filing won't but a judgment will. If you did file in Hawaii and if you did get a default judgment and if you did register your judgment with their local court in California and if they didn't try to get it set aside you could go after their wages and bank account and record the judgment in their county of residence so it becomes a black mark on their credit. Whether any of that ever gets you any money is anybody's guess.

As a matter of strategy, you might mail them a demand letter with a completed (but not filed) small claims complaint form (to show you mean business) and give a deadline to pay. If they don't pay by the deadline, you file your lawsuit. Don't bluff. If you are threatening suit, be prepared to back it up.

You might also want to file a police report in the city where they live. Passing a bad check is a crime in California if there was intent to defraud:

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=476a.

Getting questioned by the police might scare them into paying.

UPDATE:

FYI - I contacted the CA police department and they told me I need to file the report in Hawaii. They said my local police will then take steps with California, so I contacted my local police and they are sending an officer to take a report today.

 

[FlyingRon]

Here's another suggestion. For the future wait for the checks to clear before you perform your services. Either that or require cash, money orders, or cashier's checks from out-of-state people and cash them quickly, or just don't do business with out-of-state people.

There is almost ZERO way of a depositor telling if a check clears. It can take several weeks for a check to "bounce."