Complex situation, need pros advice

[nissandave]

What is the name of your state?NC

Okay, first off, we are renting a house in which we have a verbal agreement to buy for 90k. We started renting from our landlord in 5/03. She stated that when we decided to buy the house, the price would be 90k. We were discharged from a chapter 7 in 12/02. In the bankruptcy, a mortgage was included and we used the "keep current" option until we decided to let the house go back in 5/03. My wife and I want to buy the house we are in, and the landlord wants to sell to us. There are a few "situations" that are "complicating" this sale for us and we desperately need advice.
To start with, back in 7/04, we were ready to buy the house and started the process. After the appraisal came back, we got stopped dead in our tracks. Our landlord called and told us that her estate lawyer that handled her husband's case had mislead her. A couple years before we started renting from her, her husband died without a will. The estate lawyer said it would not be a problem if she ever wanted to sell the house. But when she called him back up in 7/04, he said differently. She now has to get a court order by petitioning the court to allow her to sell the house, all because her husband did not have a will and died in NC, so the house was legally split between the surviving spouse and child. Then she also states that the court will not let her sell the house much, if any, below appraised value. I am not an appraiser, but I believe (for reasons too detailed to get into) that the house will not appraise for more than 90k or so for the court.
Our credit reports do not list the foreclosure. We have told the brokers we are dealing with that we refuse to hide the foreclosure on our mortgage app. After all was said and done, we had one broker who could get the loan done.
We had found a broker who asked us to put our verbal agreement to buy into a Contract for Deed agreement, dated back to 5/03. That way, she got us approved for a refinance loan.
Oaky, now for the questions:

1 If in fact the court ordered appraisal comes in at 90k, which is 10k less that the broker ordered appraisal, will the court have a problem with the 10k difference in the appraisals?

2 Will the court have a problem with the landlord entering into a sale agreement in 5/03, which will be well before the dated court order the landlord has yet to obtain? Or will the court treat the date of the completed execution of the contract as the sale date?

 

[HomeGuru]

What is the name of your state?NC

Okay, first off, we are renting a house in which we have a verbal agreement to buy for 90k. We started renting from our landlord in 5/03. She stated that when we decided to buy the house, the price would be 90k. We were discharged from a chapter 7 in 12/02. In the bankruptcy, a mortgage was included and we used the "keep current" option until we decided to let the house go back in 5/03. My wife and I want to buy the house we are in, and the landlord wants to sell to us. There are a few "situations" that are "complicating" this sale for us and we desperately need advice.
To start with, back in 7/04, we were ready to buy the house and started the process. After the appraisal came back, we got stopped dead in our tracks. Our landlord called and told us that her estate lawyer that handled her husband's case had mislead her. A couple years before we started renting from her, her husband died without a will. The estate lawyer said it would not be a problem if she ever wanted to sell the house. But when she called him back up in 7/04, he said differently. She now has to get a court order by petitioning the court to allow her to sell the house, all because her husband did not have a will and died in NC, so the house was legally split between the surviving spouse and child. Then she also states that the court will not let her sell the house much, if any, below appraised value. I am not an appraiser, but I believe (for reasons too detailed to get into) that the house will not appraise for more than 90k or so for the court.
Our credit reports do not list the foreclosure. We have told the brokers we are dealing with that we refuse to hide the foreclosure on our mortgage app. After all was said and done, we had one broker who could get the loan done.
We had found a broker who asked us to put our verbal agreement to buy into a Contract for Deed agreement, dated back to 5/03. That way, she got us approved for a refinance loan.

**A: that is commiting fraud but of course you already knew that right?
*******
Oaky, now for the questions:

1 If in fact the court ordered appraisal comes in at 90k, which is 10k less that the broker ordered appraisal, will the court have a problem with the 10k difference in the appraisals?

**A: possibly.
*********

2 Will the court have a problem with the landlord entering into a sale agreement in 5/03, which will be well before the dated court order the landlord has yet to obtain?
**A: what do you think? The contract would be unenforceable since the Seller would have no right to sell.
*********
Or will the court treat the date of the completed execution of the contract as the sale date?

**A: it depends.........

 

[nissandave]

How would this be fraud if all we are doing is putting our verbal agreement in writing? Is there something I am missing?

"The contract would be unenforceable since the Seller would have no right to sell."

The seller does have a right to sell, but with stipulations. Would it be feasible to include a stipulation in the Contract for Deed that final sell is dependent upon court petition? Additionally, if we redid the written agreement to a Lease with Option to Buy, would the broker still be able to do a refinance on the Lease with Option to Buy?

In all honesty, I do not, neither will I, commit fraud. It is for this reason why I refuse to hide our past foreclosure. Please comment with details that are relevant.

 

[HomeGuru]

How would this be fraud if all we are doing is putting our verbal agreement in writing? Is there something I am missing?

**A: H-e-l-l-o, anyone home? BACKDATING a contract for deed? Tell me you are not on drugs.
********

"The contract would be unenforceable since the Seller would have no right to sell."

The seller does have a right to sell, but with stipulations.

**A: is that what is states in the COURT ORDER that you state you do not have?
*********
Would it be feasible to include a stipulation in the Contract for Deed that final sell is dependent upon court petition? Additionally, if we redid the written agreement to a Lease with Option to Buy, would the broker still be able to do a refinance on the Lease with Option to Buy?

In all honesty, I do not, neither will I, commit fraud. It is for this reason why I refuse to hide our past foreclosure. Please comment with details that are relevant.

**A: see above.

 

[nissandave]

"H-e-l-l-o, anyone home? BACKDATING a contract for deed? Tell me you are not on drugs."

Hello, are you blind? We already have an EXISTING VERBAL agreement. I honestly do not think a lender would loan on a VERBAL agreement, hence the agreement would need to be in writing.

If the bank has the title to your car and you are still making payments, do you have the right to sell your car? Is real estate any different?
Now back to the questions:
Would it be feasible to include a stipulation in the Contract for Deed that final sell is dependent upon court petition? Additionally, if we redid the written agreement to a Lease with Option to Buy, would the broker still be able to do a refinance on the Lease with Option to Buy?
Anybody else have any input?

 

[HomeGuru]

"H-e-l-l-o, anyone home? BACKDATING a contract for deed? Tell me you are not on drugs."

Hello, are you blind? We already have an EXISTING VERBAL agreement. I honestly do not think a lender would loan on a VERBAL agreement, hence the agreement would need to be in writing.

**A: you have been on this forum long enough to know that verbal agreements for the sale of real estate are not enforceable per the statutes of frauds. Read some of the other threads on this subject to refresh your memory. Hence, I am not blind, a verbal agreement means nothing and since you have nothing, there is nothing for any lender to loan on. Got it now?
*********
*******
If the bank has the title to your car and you are still making payments, do you have the right to sell your car?

**A: yes.
*********
Is real estate any different?

Yes, WAY WAY different since in this analogy and using your scenario, you do not have title to the car and you are not making payments on the car. What you have is a lease on the car.
******
Now back to the questions:
Would it be feasible to include a stipulation in the Contract for Deed that final sell is dependent upon court petition? Additionally, if we redid the written agreement to a Lease with Option to Buy, would the broker still be able to do a refinance on the Lease with Option to Buy?
Anybody else have any input?

**A: see above.