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Court in a week. ors 811.147, 811.100

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saechao04

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Oregon

On 06/18/2008 I was pulled over on my way to the beach. There was a cop that had pulled someone over and appeared to be writing the person a ticket. Anyway, approximately 4 minutes later he caught up to me and pulled me over. Said I was doing 76 mph and the top of the hill and slowed down to 70 mph by the bottom of the hill. Wrote me a ticket for speeding (ors 811.100) and failure to keep a safe distance from an emergency vehicle (ors 811.147). One lane highway. My court date is 11/03/2008.

My argument is I was going with the flow of traffic, as everyone else was, so going slower would impede traffic (ors 811.130):

"811.130 Impeding traffic; penalty. (1) A person commits the offense of impeding traffic if the person drives a motor vehicle or a combination of motor vehicles in a manner that impedes or blocks the normal and reasonable movement of traffic."

I also don't think that he had his lights on when he was writing a ticket to the other car so:

"811.147 Failure to maintain safe distance from emergency vehicle or ambulance; penalty.
(1) A person operating a motor vehicle commits the offense of failure to maintain a safe distance from an emergency vehicle or ambulance if the person approaches an emergency vehicle or ambulance that is stopped and is displaying required warning lights and the person:

(a) On a highway having two or more lanes for traffic in a single direction, fails to:

(A) Make a lane change to a lane not adjacent to that of the emergency vehicle or ambulance; or

(B) Reduce the speed of the motor vehicle, if making a lane change is unsafe.

(b) On a two directional, two-lane highway, fails to reduce the speed of the motor vehicle.

(2) The offense described in this section, failure to maintain a safe distance from an emergency vehicle or ambulance, is a Class B traffic violation. [2003 c.42 §2]"


Officer was trained on using the radar in 1997
Certificate of Calibration date 01/16/2007 on a donated radar
Officer wrote 16 citations that day
 


FlyingRon

Senior Member
Going with the flow is *NOT* a defense. 811.130 isn't justification to violate other laws.

He most likely did have his lights on. It's standard procedure to have them on when making any sort of stop. You "don't think" also won't fly in court. Unless he admits to not using his lights or you have witnesses to the contrary.
 

Maestro64

Member
Your defense should be 4 minutes pass since he observed a car coming down the road that match your cars description and when he actually pulled you over. If you have a run of mill car he will not be able to say with 100% certainty the car he observed was in fact the one he actually pull over.

There is no way for you to prove his light were not on at the time and he did not observe a car doing what he claims. Now the officer will have hard time proving after 4 minutes of many cars on the road he actually found the right car. He lost sight of the car in questions once that happens his identification can be called into question.
 
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saechao04

Junior Member
"Going with the flow is *NOT* a defense. 811.130 isn't justification to violate other"

So you're saying I would have got a ticket no matter what? If I wasn't going with the flow, I would be in violation of 811.130.

I had 3 other people in the car with me at the time that will be writing an affidavit attesting to the 4 minutes passed and maybe the warning lights not being on, if we all agree that it wasn't flashing.

Anyway since I did slow down, maybe just not enough since it was a hill, I don't see how I be in violation of 811.147. He admitted that I slowed down, there wasn't another lane I can go go into. You think it will be enough to win?
 

FlyingRon

Senior Member
So you're saying I would have got a ticket no matter what? If I wasn't going with the flow, I would be in violation of 811.130.
No, I didn't say that. You're the one who's making that nonsense up. Your deluded in thinking they are going to write you up for going the speed limit.
I had 3 other people in the car with me at the time that will be writing an affidavit attesting to the 4 minutes passed and maybe the warning lights not being on, if we all agree that it wasn't flashing.
Affadavits are not going to be admitted. Their testimony is of dubious use even if givein in person.
Anyway since I did slow down, maybe just not enough since it was a hill, I don't see how I be in violation of 811.147. He admitted that I slowed down, there wasn't another lane I can go go into. You think it will be enough to win?
No, the argument is that you were speeding to begin with. If you had been driving at a legal and prudent speed, you could have substantially slowed down when you saw the emergency vehicle. No cop wants to be buzzed by someone doing 20 miles over the speed limit. They've been killed that way.

Maestro has given you your best shot. The only thing that may help further is to get a lawyer.
 

Maestro64

Member
Look, even if every car on the road was going over the speed limit, the office found a car of interest and decided to pursue that one car. If there is no bias on the officer's part, he is going to select a car on the road that appears to stand out someway form every other car on the road since he will not be able to pull everyone over. Face it, when a officer pulls one car out of the crowd it has a chilling effect on everyone around him so he does not have to ticket everyone to get the crowd to slow down.

In your case, a car was selected for the fact it was in the lane closet to him so he felt it was putting him at jeopardy. This made it a car of interest to him.

Like I said your best bet is the 4 minutes gap. however, you need to prove 4 minutes laps form the time you think he observed you and when he actually initiated the pull over. I would get the officer to state the mile marker he made the observation and the mile marker he made the pull over, how many mile between the two, then ask him how long it took for him to go that distance, assume he was traveling 60 mph. Also ask if he had the car in his site the entire time. Notice, never state it was you car he observer, he just saw a car similar to yours.

The other thing to attach is the radar cal, most state require calibration done yearly, see if Oregon has rules around this, also some states require a field test, see if he did that and how it was done, many time this is not done or done incorrectly so it brings in to question the actual speed measure.

No one on here is radar expert, if you want to learn how to defend against radar go to radardetectors.net. There is a few people who know the in and outs, and they can tell you everything the officer must do correctly.
 

njjean

Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Oregon

On 06/18/2008 I was pulled over on my way to the beach. There was a cop that had pulled someone over and appeared to be writing the person a ticket. Anyway, approximately 4 minutes later he caught up to me and pulled me over. Said I was doing 76 mph and the top of the hill and slowed down to 70 mph by the bottom of the hill. Wrote me a ticket for speeding (ors 811.100) and failure to keep a safe distance from an emergency vehicle (ors 811.147). One lane highway. My court date is 11/03/2008.

My argument is I was going with the flow of traffic, as everyone else was, so going slower would impede traffic (ors 811.130):

"811.130 Impeding traffic; penalty. (1) A person commits the offense of impeding traffic if the person drives a motor vehicle or a combination of motor vehicles in a manner that impedes or blocks the normal and reasonable movement of traffic."

I also don't think that he had his lights on when he was writing a ticket to the other car so:

"811.147 Failure to maintain safe distance from emergency vehicle or ambulance; penalty.
(1) A person operating a motor vehicle commits the offense of failure to maintain a safe distance from an emergency vehicle or ambulance if the person approaches an emergency vehicle or ambulance that is stopped and is displaying required warning lights and the person:

(a) On a highway having two or more lanes for traffic in a single direction, fails to:

(A) Make a lane change to a lane not adjacent to that of the emergency vehicle or ambulance; or

(B) Reduce the speed of the motor vehicle, if making a lane change is unsafe.

(b) On a two directional, two-lane highway, fails to reduce the speed of the motor vehicle.

(2) The offense described in this section, failure to maintain a safe distance from an emergency vehicle or ambulance, is a Class B traffic violation. [2003 c.42 §2]"


Officer was trained on using the radar in 1997
Certificate of Calibration date 01/16/2007 on a donated radar
Officer wrote 16 citations that day
I find that odd. You would have to break going downhill. Who does that?
Perhaps he got another car on radar at the top of the hill and yours at the bottom? Don't know if the speed difference makes a difference, but it could point towards a mistake in his id of your car to begin with.
 
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saechao04

Junior Member
I do believe that I will be going with the 4 minute gap defense and radar calibration and the fact that he was in the process of writing someone else up. I will have one of the passengers go as my witness to testify for the length of gap. I'm not sure how these radars are used mounted to a police vehicle, since it's mounted does he not have to push a button? Or hold a trigger?

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii229/nsaechao85/untitled.jpg
 

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