Dad Passed

[wenchris]

My dad’s Will and Revocable Trust done by attorney in New Hampshire. After his wife died we moved him to assisted living on Long Island NY to be closer to 2 of 4 children. Dad just passed and the only assets without beneficiaries he has is a checking and savings account (approximately $300,000) that I am co-owner of. No cars no homes, no material things of any consequence, that was all taken care of 2 years ago. After all is said and done I want to divide his monies between my 3 siblings and me. There are no assets stated in the trust or will and his only request is that each grandchild receive $7000 of which there are 10.
His will states that each of his children receive the remaining monies equally split after the grandchildren receive their money. Spoke with an attorney and he says that there is no reason for probate as there is no material assets and everything has a beneficiary or is co-owned by me. Wanting to do the right thing by my siblings and avoid probate does anyone see any problems or tax liabilities in my future? I don’t foresee any problems from my siblings as long as everything is divided evenly.
Jimmy in New York on the Island of Long

 

[adjusterjack]

Please accept my condolences.

I see a couple of minor issues.

1 - You are co-owner of the checking and savings account totaling about $300,000. If that means "joint with right of survivorship" then that money became your money at the moment of your Dad's death. That means that any money you convey to others is not an inheritance but is a gift from you to them. Gifts over a certain amount have to be reported to the IRS. There is no tax payable by either you or the recipients because the total is within the life time gift tax exclusion.

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/gift-tax

That will also tell you if your Dad's estate needs to file an estate tax return. Again, no tax due to the estate tax exclusion.

2 - The lawyer is correct that you won't likely have to file probate. That is, until somebody says "Where are your court papers appointing you representative of the estate? We can't do anything for you without them." Banks have a nasty habit of doing that.

And my mother had a Mitchell-Lama co-op in the Bronx when she died. We had to file small estate just to get $12000 back. Wasn't much of a hassle.

 

[wenchris]

Please accept my condolences.

I see a couple of minor issues.

1 - You are co-owner of the checking and savings account totaling about $300,000. If that means "joint with right of survivorship" then that money became your money at the moment of your Dad's death. That means that any money you convey to others is not an inheritance but is a gift from you to them. Gifts over a certain amount have to be reported to the IRS. There is no tax payable by either you or the recipients because the total is within the life time gift tax exclusion.

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/gift-tax

That will also tell you if your Dad's estate needs to file an estate tax return. Again, no tax due to the estate tax exclusion.

2 - The lawyer is correct that you won't likely have to file probate. That is, until somebody says "Where are your court papers appointing you representative of the estate? We can't do anything for you without them." Banks have a nasty habit of doing that.

And my mother had a Mitchell-Lama co-op in the Bronx when she died. We had to file small estate just to get $12000 back. Wasn't much of a hassle.

Adjusterjak,
Thank you for your reply and the link. Good read and informative.
Thanx again, Jimmy

 

[zddoodah]

Dad just passed and the only assets without beneficiaries he has is a checking and savings account (approximately $300,000) that I am co-owner of.

That money now belongs to you and is not part of his estate.

does anyone see any problems or tax liabilities in my future?

No one here knows enough to opine intelligently about potential problems. As you've described it, because everything has a beneficiary or is jointly owned, there isn't any estate or anything to divide other than personal effects. Nevertheless, I'd suggest retaining an attorney to advise you.

 

[LdiJ]

My dad’s Will and Revocable Trust done by attorney in New Hampshire. After his wife died we moved him to assisted living on Long Island NY to be closer to 2 of 4 children. Dad just passed and the only assets without beneficiaries he has is a checking and savings account (approximately $300,000) that I am co-owner of. No cars no homes, no material things of any consequence, that was all taken care of 2 years ago. After all is said and done I want to divide his monies between my 3 siblings and me. There are no assets stated in the trust or will and his only request is that each grandchild receive $7000 of which there are 10.
His will states that each of his children receive the remaining monies equally split after the grandchildren receive their money. Spoke with an attorney and he says that there is no reason for probate as there is no material assets and everything has a beneficiary or is co-owned by me. Wanting to do the right thing by my siblings and avoid probate does anyone see any problems or tax liabilities in my future? I don’t foresee any problems from my siblings as long as everything is divided evenly.
Jimmy in New York on the Island of Long

Ok, so you said that your dad left 300,000 in an account that is co-owned by you. As you have already been told, its legally your money. The first thing that you need to do is make sure that any final expenses and bills of your dad's are paid, and that his final tax return and any taxes owed are paid before you do anything else. Then, after you have distributed the $7000 (actually gifted) to each of the grandchildren that will leave somewhere around 200 to 230k for the 4 of you to share. That amounts to 50,000 to 57500 to each of you.

The current annual gift tax exclusion amount is $19,000 per person. That means that you can give 19k each to as many people as you like without having to fill out and submit a gift tax return to the IRS. So, you could give each of your siblings 19k now, another 19k come January 1st, and the remaining amount 1 year from then without having to do anything or consult anyone.

If you prefer to distribute it all at one, you will need to submit a gift tax return to the IRS, but as you have already been told, there shouldn't be any actual tax at this point.

 

[wenchris]

Zddoodah, Ldij, thank you for your replies. Been very busy sorting things out, now I know why the executor gets a percentage of which I declined. Ok, going through my dad’s papers I found a Checking and a Savings account in a bank in Florida where he wintered. Not much $1700 in savings and $1600 in checking. These accounts are in my dads name and his late wife who pre-deceased him. My problem is his will was done in New Hampshire, he died in New York (where he moved after his wife died) and there is a Checking and Savings account in Florida. Called the bank and they said it needs to go through probate. NY has a Small Estate Affidavit for any estate under $50,000 which does me no good for the said accounts in Florida, looking for suggestions.
Once again Thank you!
Jimmy on The Island Of Long

 

[zddoodah]

I found a Checking and a Savings account in a bank in Florida where he wintered. Not much $1700 in savings and $1600 in checking. These accounts are in my dads name and his late wife who pre-deceased him. My problem is his will was done in New Hampshire, he died in New York (where he moved after his wife died) and there is a Checking and Savings account in Florida. Called the bank and they said it needs to go through probate.

So...I'm not in any of the states you mentioned (and it shouldn't matter where the will was prepared). I don't know any state that doesn't have a small estate affidavit process. It's possible that the bank's internal procedures will require that you be appointed as executor by the surrogate's court. It might be a stupid requirement, but you won't be able to get around it unless you hire a lawyer, which could end up costing more than the $3,300 in the two accounts. Nevertheless, I'd urge you at least to consult with a lawyer - possibly one in Florida. Unfortunately, it might be that it will cost you more than it is worth to get this money. The alternative is to play the long game. After several years, the bank will turn over the money to the state (through a process called escheatment), and you can then try to claim it.

 

[LdiJ]

Do a google search for "summary administration Florida". That is the simplified process for FL.

 

[wenchris]

Once again thank you both, may play the long game. Meeting with an attorney tomorrow.
Thanx Jimmy

 

[wenchris]

Once again thank you both, may play the long game. Meeting with an attorney tomorrow.
Thanx Jimmy

 

[wenchris]

Met with attorney and he’s going to file paperwork for a Summary Administration in Florida. He’s an acquaintance of mine so the cost is minimal.

My dad had a Life Estate where he could live in his wife’s (Pre Deceased my dad) house till he passed. We where in the process of turning the property over to her children when my dad died. He paid the taxes for the year and I am still paying the homeowners insurance monthly. The house is currently on the market and I don’t want to make any waves as her sons are difficult to deal with, but I don’t want to be paying for something that is her estates responsibility. My question is, when does the home become the property of her estate, was it upon my father’s death?
Once again thank you!!!!!
Jimmy on the Island of Long

 

[zddoodah]

My question is, when does the home become the property of her estate, was it upon my father’s death?

Yes.

 

[LdiJ]

Met with attorney and he’s going to file paperwork for a Summary Administration in Florida. He’s an acquaintance of mine so the cost is minimal.

My dad had a Life Estate where he could live in his wife’s (Pre Deceased my dad) house till he passed. We where in the process of turning the property over to her children when my dad died. He paid the taxes for the year and I am still paying the homeowners insurance monthly. The house is currently on the market and I don’t want to make any waves as her sons are difficult to deal with, but I don’t want to be paying for something that is her estates responsibility. My question is, when does the home become the property of her estate, was it upon my father’s death?
Once again thank you!!!!!
Jimmy on the Island of Long

It probably became the property of her heirs rather than her estate, but yes, it was upon your dad's death. You need to notify them that they need to get the homeowner's insurance changed over as you will be cancelling your father's policy as of xxx date.