Does Tenant Owe Insurance Deductible?

[LandlordVictim]

Name of state: Alaska

Roommate had a kitchen fire that caused slight damage (square ft in size) to a hallway carpet. Carpet was over 20 yrs old and was due for replacement. Landlord had a remnant so it was agreed that I would use it as a cut and replace patch at minimal expense. Then landlord filed a damage claim on homeowner’s insurance policy to get new carpet. Insurance adjuster agreed to replace the hallway, living room and dining room carpet. Homeowner has required tenant to absorb the $500 deductible. The landlord is getting new carpet at no expense for carpet that had exhausted its use-life and probably had depreciated to zero. Is tenant responsible for landlord's $500 deductible?

 

[BL]

Name of state: Alaska

Roommate had a kitchen fire that caused slight damage (square ft in size) to a hallway carpet. Carpet was over 20 yrs old and was due for replacement. Landlord had a remnant so it was agreed that I would use it as a cut and replace patch at minimal expense. Then landlord filed a damage claim on homeowner’s insurance policy to get new carpet. Insurance adjuster agreed to replace the hallway, living room and dining room carpet. Homeowner has required tenant to absorb the $500 deductible. The landlord is getting new carpet at no expense for carpet that had exhausted its use-life and probably had depreciated to zero. Is tenant responsible for landlord's $500 deductible?

There was a kitchen fire . This post makes NO sense . Unless you care to explain why ONLY a small area of carpet in the hallway was burnt .

 

[LandlordVictim]

To clarify my previous post. I was not a witness to the incident. However, the roommate reported to me that the pan of hot grease spilled onto the carpet as she was trying to take the pan outside. She decided not to put the pan in the sink because water and hot oil don't mix.

 

[PghREA]

To clarify my previous post. I was not a witness to the incident. However, the roommate reported to me that the pan of hot grease spilled onto the carpet as she was trying to take the pan outside. She decided not to put the pan in the sink because water and hot oil don't mix.

I think it is fair to expect the tenent to pick up the deductible for a fire she caused. Not only is the landlord getting new carpet in a unit HE OWNS but does not live in paid for from the insurance premiums HE pays, you and your roommate get to ENJOY the new carpeting. Where is your renters insurance?

 

[LandlordVictim]

My renter's insurance wouldn't kick in because I did not cause the damage, the roommate did. Also, I was told by my insurance company that my policy covers my belongings not landlord's property. Besides, my deductible is $500, the same deductible as the owner's policy.

Unlike auto insurance, that considers depreciation of a vehicle, homeowner's insurance covers replacement at current market value. The carpet had no value - it was dirty, worn out, and over 20 years old. It needed to be replaced and there had been correspondence about this between myself and owner since day one of my tenancy. (I had to pay for and arrange for its cleaning before I moved in; it was stained, dirty, and worn at that time. This is a separate issue that relates to owner not taking responsibility for maintenace costs of the dwelling.) The damage to the carpet by hot oil was about one square foot in size and could have been repaired with a remnant patch that I had obtained from the owner. So my question is, should I be responsible for the owners deductible on replacing carpet that had no value? Is there any case law on this?

By the way, I don't live there anymore. I was inconvenienced and had to miss work while new carpet was installed. (There was a lot of dirt under the carpet which is evidence of its age and use). Then the owner refused to renew my one year lease and gave me 15 days to vacate. I did not receive a refund on my security deposit of $600 plus $40 key deposit. The roommate who accidentally caused the damage was a graduate student with a low paying teaching assistantship, so I didn't require that she share the cost of the security deposit. I realize that this put me at risk.

 

[JETX]

Is tenant responsible for landlord's $500 deductible?

Simple answer... yes.
The tenant is responsible for the FULL cost of the damages incurred due to his/her negligence. The fact that the landlord had insurance to cover part of the loss is not relevant to the claim. In fact, it is very likely that the insurance company will come back to the tenant to recover THEIR damages (the amount that they had to pay to cover their policyholders claim).

Oh, and by the way.... your claim that "The landlord is getting new carpet at no expense" is NOT true. The landlord had to pay insurance premiums.... just for cases like this.

 

[Just Blue]

My renter's insurance wouldn't kick in because I did not cause the damage, the roommate did. Also, I was told by my insurance company that my policy covers my belongings not landlord's property. Besides, my deductible is $500, the same deductible as the owner's policy.

Unlike auto insurance, that considers depreciation of a vehicle, homeowner's insurance covers replacement at current market value. The carpet had no value - it was dirty, worn out, and over 20 years old. It needed to be replaced and there had been correspondence about this between myself and owner since day one of my tenancy. (I had to pay for and arrange for its cleaning before I moved in; it was stained, dirty, and worn at that time. This is a separate issue that relates to owner not taking responsibility for maintenace costs of the dwelling.) The damage to the carpet by hot oil was about one square foot in size and could have been repaired with a remnant patch that I had obtained from the owner. So my question is, should I be responsible for the owners deductible on replacing carpet that had no value? Is there any case law on this?

By the way, I don't live there anymore. I was inconvenienced and had to miss work while new carpet was installed. (There was a lot of dirt under the carpet which is evidence of its age and use). Then the owner refused to renew my one year lease and gave me 15 days to vacate. I did not receive a refund on my security deposit of $600 plus $40 key deposit. The roommate who accidentally caused the damage was a graduate student with a low paying teaching assistantship, so I didn't require that she share the cost of the security deposit. I realize that this put me at risk.

You need to sue the roommate, for the money you are out due to her negligence..

 

[LandlordVictim]

I would be interested in receiving more dialog on this and if anyone knows any case law it would be helpful.

The damage was so minior it could have been remedied by a small carpet patch not replacement of the entire wall-to-wall carpeting. The carpet was old and crudy and had no value. Why should tenant pay for something that had no value? I think that the owner got a great deal with her insurance company. If she did not have insurance then the small patch would have sufficed. She probably would have had to replace the carpet anyway when I moved out because it would be difficult to rent the place with carpet like that.

 

[Just Blue]

I would be interested in receiving more dialog on this and if anyone knows any case law it would be helpful.

The damage was so minior it could have been remedied by a small carpet patch not replacement of the entire wall-to-wall carpeting. The carpet was old and crudy and had no value. Why should tenant pay for something that had no value? I think that the owner got a great deal with her insurance company. If she did not have insurance then the small patch would have sufficed. She probably would have had to replace the carpet anyway when I moved out because it would be difficult to rent the place with carpet like that.

LL is not obligated to "patch" the carpet because your rm burned it...he did what the law allows...and I bet if you were him you would have done the same thing!

If you were asking for case law to sue your rm...I don't have it....google is not my friend today ....if you go to court, bring all paper work, receipts and photo's....that should do ya!

Good luck!...

 

[LandlordVictim]

Dear baystategirl,

I'm a LL in another state and I would not have required my tenant to pay my insurance deposit if s/he damaged something of mine that had no value. It wouldn't be justified even if the law was on my side as a LL.

You say that LL did what the law allows. I'd like to know what the law allows. Please elaborate.

I am interested in case law regarding the landlord-tenant relationship regarding damage to property that had no value - in this stuation, grubby, stained,worn out, wall to wall carpet from the early 80's. Previous tenants had a dog, and ones before that had a household with four kids. so this carpet was due for replacement.

I have other concerns regarding the LL, such as entering without advance notice, not taking care of maintenance repairs, retaliation, harassment, etc. I'm just trying to get my ducks in a row and decide if a suit is worth pursuing.

I'm not interested in case law to sue the roommate. If I don't recover my security deposit from LL I will likely try getting it from the roommate through a payment schedule. We have already discussed this.


Thanks for your interest and response.

 

[JETX]

Thanks for your interest and response.

Sorry, but this is a LEGAL advice forum. The law is clear in that a landlord (or any other damaged party) can recover those damages from a liable party.

Your moral assumption of no charge is just that... YOUR decision. Some will agree with you... some don't. Get over it.

 

[LandlordVictim]

The damage was insignificant because the property (carpet) had no value. I'd like to know what case law deals with this issue. Sure, the law may allow LL to recover damages from a liable party. However, let's consider the defintion of damage and how it is remedied. The AK Landlord-Tenant Act states that the tenant is responsible to "repair damage". A small hole in an old cruddy wall-to-wall carpet could have been repaired with a patch and that is all the tenant is liable for. I believe that in this situation, carpet replacement was not warranted, but if the LL chose to file an insurance claim to have the existing carpet replaced with new carpet, then that was LL's prerogative. The LL should the pay insurance deductible minus whatever it would cost to simply repair the damage with a patch, and then the tenant can absorb that cost. This is what I will argue if I go to court. If anyone has input, I'd appreciate it.

Note to JETX: You emphasize that this is a LEGAL advice forum and that my moral assumption is irrelevant. It may not be relevant when it comes to the legal arena, however my previous post was a response to Baystategirl regarding what I would do if I was in LL's shoes. I was simply stating my ethics. I would not require my tenant to pay my insurance deductible for replacement, unless my deductible was less than the cost to repair
the damage (not replace the carpet).

 

[LandlordVictim]

I am re-posting this to see if there is interest in more dialog on the issue, and also because there has been a similar recent post regarding carpet damage. I will reply to that post as well.

I will likely resolve my case by filing in small claims court.

Working toward peace, justice, and a happier, healthier new year.