dress code discrimination?

[gateach]

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? Georgia
I'm a middle school teacher in Georgia and have some concerns over the whether or not our dress code is being enforced legally., without gender discrimination. In our handbook, it states that "all shirttails must be tucked in" and that "pants must be worn at the natural waistline". The problem is many teachers only write up boys for wearing their shirts untucked. A girl can have the SAME t-shirt on as a boy and the boy would receive a discipline referral but the girl would not. Many boys have a problem keeping their regular length shirts in because they wear their pants lower than their natural waistline (not below their butts though), but many of the girls also wear "hip hugger" jeans that are below their waistline and baby-ts that barely meet the tops of their pants -and show wayyyy too much in the back when they sit down. The boys are written up for this but not the girls. The handbook also states that "girls may wear shirts out if they are a part of a matching set". Many boys outfits are now matching top and bottom sets that are meant to be worn out. Boys are told they must tuck these in though.
I've spoken to my administrator about my discrimination concerns. She said that girls are built differently, so that's why the tucked shirttails and natural waistline rules aren't enforced on them. Many of my male students are overweight and are uncomfortable with the way they look with their shirtails tucked in though.
I believe that we do need some sort of dress code at our school, but I think it should be enforced fairly between the sexes by all of the teachers. God help us if we enforced the dress code differently for different races!

Is our dress code being discriminately enforced or not?

 

[I AM ALWAYS LIABLE]

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? Georgia
I'm a middle school teacher in Georgia and have some concerns over the whether or not our dress code is being enforced legally., without gender discrimination. In our handbook, it states that "all shirttails must be tucked in" and that "pants must be worn at the natural waistline". The problem is many teachers only write up boys for wearing their shirts untucked. A girl can have the SAME t-shirt on as a boy and the boy would receive a discipline referral but the girl would not. Many boys have a problem keeping their regular length shirts in because they wear their pants lower than their natural waistline (not below their butts though), but many of the girls also wear "hip hugger" jeans that are below their waistline and baby-ts that barely meet the tops of their pants -and show wayyyy too much in the back when they sit down. The boys are written up for this but not the girls. The handbook also states that "girls may wear shirts out if they are a part of a matching set". Many boys outfits are now matching top and bottom sets that are meant to be worn out. Boys are told they must tuck these in though.
I've spoken to my administrator about my discrimination concerns. She said that girls are built differently, so that's why the tucked shirttails and natural waistline rules aren't enforced on them. Many of my male students are overweight and are uncomfortable with the way they look with their shirtails tucked in though.
I believe that we do need some sort of dress code at our school, but I think it should be enforced fairly between the sexes by all of the teachers. God help us if we enforced the dress code differently for different races!

Is our dress code being discriminately enforced or not?

My response:

The school is merely attempting to dissuade and convince the rest of the country that the people in Georgia aren't a bunch of hillbilly trailer trash. Please . . . Fight against the school policy! We enjoy thinking of you hicks as the hillbilly, bib overall, trailer trash stereotype that you've fought so long to create!

Fight the school tooth and nail. We don't want you changing!

IAAL

 

[gateach]

Wonderful response

What a wonderful, helpful, and educated response to my question. I see by your bio that you love big busted redheads and are a graduate of Stanford. They must be sooooo proud to have you represent them so well. If you are practicing attorney of 24 years, I think you need a little more practice because you seem to have a great deal of time on your hands to answer an average of 18 posts per day and over 36,000 since 2000.
Oh, by the way, an expert on modern Georgia culture, you're not. If the rest of the country thinks of us as a bunch of hillbillies like you do, then what do you think the people of your wonderful state are generalized as? ... a bunch of pot smoking, lazy, surfers? What about your city? The TV stations out there seem to love showing all of the criminals being chased by the police in thrilling car chases.
If you can't give helpful advice then crawl back under the rock you stuck your head out of!!

 

[BelizeBreeze]

What a wonderful, helpful, and educated response to my question. I see by your bio that you love big busted redheads and are a graduate of Stanford. They must be sooooo proud to have you represent them so well. If you are practicing attorney of 24 years, I think you need a little more practice because you seem to have a great deal of time on your hands to answer an average of 18 posts per day and over 36,000 since 2000.
Oh, by the way, an expert on modern Georgia culture, you're not. If the rest of the country thinks of us as a bunch of hillbillies like you do, then what do you think the people of your wonderful state are generalized as? ... a bunch of pot smoking, lazy, surfers? What about your city? The TV stations out there seem to love showing all of the criminals being chased by the police in thrilling car chases.
If you can't give helpful advice then crawl back under the rock you stuck your head out of!!

If you don't like the policy then start wearing a dress.

 

[I AM ALWAYS LIABLE]

What a wonderful, helpful, and educated response to my question. I see by your bio that you love big busted redheads and are a graduate of Stanford. They must be sooooo proud to have you represent them so well. If you are practicing attorney of 24 years, I think you need a little more practice because you seem to have a great deal of time on your hands to answer an average of 18 posts per day and over 36,000 since 2000.
Oh, by the way, an expert on modern Georgia culture, you're not. If the rest of the country thinks of us as a bunch of hillbillies like you do, then what do you think the people of your wonderful state are generalized as? ... a bunch of pot smoking, lazy, surfers? What about your city? The TV stations out there seem to love showing all of the criminals being chased by the police in thrilling car chases.
If you can't give helpful advice then crawl back under the rock you stuck your head out of!!

"If you can't give helpful advice then crawl back under the rock you stuck your head out of!!"

Is that the type of teaching you do - - ending a sentence with a preposition?

No wonder you southern jerks are stereotyped.

IAAL

 

[gateach]

Good one

I'm not an English teacher just like you aren't a lawyer of all types of law. Don't act like a know-it-all, if you don't. The 13 year olds I teach are more mature than you are. If correcting my grammar was the only come back that you could give then you must agree with everything else.
In my best southern twang possible "Sweetie, have a nice day".

 

[stealth2]

I'm not an English teacher just like you aren't a lawyer of all types of law. Don't act like a know-it-all, if you don't. The 13 year olds I teach are more mature than you are. If correcting my grammar was the only come back that you could give then you must agree with everything else.
In my best southern twang possible "Sweetie, have a nice day".

Slightly o/t..... As a parent, I don't care if a teacher is an English teacher or not. I expect that they are able to communicate in proper English, using proper grammar and proper spelling at all times. Just as I expect that a non-Math teacher won't tell my kid 2+2=5, and then say "tee hee, I'm not a math teacher" when called on it. I'm fed up with getting misspelled crap home. Fed up enough that I send it back redlined. And God help the teacher that penalizes my kid for it.

 

[gateach]

comments but no advice

So far, I've gotten several sweet comments, but still no advice. I think that this site is named incorrectly. It should be called FreeBashing instead of FreeAdvice.
I find it amazing that so many lawyers believe they are perfect and make no mistakes when they do their jobs, but hey, that's what your secretary is for, right? - to check behind you and correct your mistakes! The last time I checked, there wasn't a teacher in this country who had a secretary. Homeschooling may be the best option for your children .... if you hate teachers so much. I'm sure your children are a delight to have if they are anything like you.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

So far, I've gotten several sweet comments, but still no advice. I think that this site is named incorrectly. It should be called FreeBashing instead of FreeAdvice.
I find it amazing that so many lawyers believe they are perfect and make no mistakes when they do their jobs, but hey, that's what your secretary is for, right? - to check behind you and correct your mistakes! The last time I checked, there wasn't a teacher in this country who had a secretary. Homeschooling may be the best option for your children .... if you hate teachers so much. I'm sure your children are a delight to have if they are anything like you.

Then you're here to find someone who will tell you there is a case here which is NOT the correct answer.

You have no course of LEGAL action. PERIOD.

 

[gateach]

answer

Thank you Belizebreeze for responding.
I wasn't looking for someone to tell me if I had a case or not. As a teacher, I'm fascinated with the history of educational law and whether or not what I described earlier would be consdidered gender discrimination against my male students. If it isn't, why not?
For the past 4 years, I've been the sponsor of the school's student council. The double standard dress code is always an issue with the council members. I told the kids I would write this site for some possible advice on whether or not they could do something to get the dress code changed or at least enforced equally.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

Thank you Belizebreeze for responding.
I wasn't looking for someone to tell me if I had a case or not. As a teacher, I'm fascinated with the history of educational law and whether or not what I described earlier would be consdidered gender discrimination against my male students. If it isn't, why not?
For the past 4 years, I've been the sponsor of the school's student council. The double standard dress code is always an issue with the council members. I told the kids I would write this site for some possible advice on whether or not they could do something to get the dress code changed or at least enforced equally.

Are you willing to go all the way? For example, are your 'boys' willing to wear tampons once a month?

This is not discrimination. Go to any workplace and you will find the same thing, a dress code that is required and may not be regulated by law.

It WOULD be discrimination if, on the basis of sex, certain classes were limited or opportunities for advancement into honors classes was limited to only girls. But clothing is gender specific and not open to discrimination unless one class is specifically targeted (i.e., Only girls had a dress code requirement and boys could wear what they wanted.)

This is not happening in your situation. So you can tell your student council that this is a hill not worth dying on.

 

[gateach]

So, it is not discrimination if a teacher "writes up" a boy for having his shirttail out but doesn't "write up" a girl that is dressed exactly like him - even though the handbook says that "all shirttails must be tucked in at all times"?
What if a teacher only "wrote up" black kids and not white kids? Would that be considered discrimination?

 

[BelizeBreeze]

So, it is not discrimination if a teacher "writes up" a boy for having his shirttail out but doesn't "write up" a girl that is dressed exactly like him - even though the handbook says that "all shirttails must be tucked in at all times"?

That would depend entirely on the manner of dress. There are skirts and blouses made for girls which have belts that cross the ouside blouse that would be acceptable.

What you are talking about here is manner of dress, not a protected right.

What if a teacher only "wrote up" black kids and not white kids? Would that be considered discrimination?

I don't think I need to answer that. Unless you're just playing now.

If you want to understand the issue better then read the following.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=6th&navby=case&no=01a0064p

Tinker decision

And I mean REALLY read them. Don't just pull out what you think will support your cause but why the decisions were made the way they were and the underlying constitutional protections, what is protected and what is NOT.

 

[notsmartmark]

My concerns about some dress codes is not about the law; instead, it is about setting different expectations for boys and girls, that girls dress for style and social purposes and boys dress for business and education. Many private, religious schools dress codes set this standard. There absolutely must be dress standards in our schools; I only hope they are not inadvertently setting different expectations for the sexes.

 

[Crazed98]

My concerns about some dress codes is not about the law; instead, it is about setting different expectations for boys and girls, that girls dress for style and social purposes and boys dress for business and education. Many private, religious schools dress codes set this standard. There absolutely must be dress standards in our schools; I only hope they are not inadvertently setting different expectations for the sexes.

Men and women are not 100% equal. Why should they be treated the same exact way?