Dumpster Fire - insurance fraud?

[dumpsterfire]

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? WI

I rented a dumpster a few months ago and had it delivered in front of my house. It was left on a city street, NOT on my property. It caught on fire when I wasn't home, so my neighbor called the fire department to have them put the fire out.
The dumpster company has billed me $400 for the fire damage to the dumpster, saying that this is the cost to sandblast and repaint it. I asked them if their business had insurance to cover this and they told me "Yes, but we don't feel that we should be responsible for our dumpster while it's on your site, and we don't want our insurance rates to go up. This is the way we've always dealt with it, so you'll just have to pay."
To me, this implies that they are trying to get $400 for free out of me. They could easily collect $400 from me and pocket it, and then report it to their insurance company and have them pay it as well. Also, they haven't given me an outside estimate, this figure is just what they feel the damage is going to cost.

To make an analogy: If I were running a snowplow business and my transmission failed while I was plowing someone's driveway, I would eat the cost, not my customer. That is the cost of doing business. I think that if you want to rent out a dumpster, that you have to be prepared to incur unexpected costs - that is why you have insurance, right?

In my opinion, this company is cheating the system and does not have the right to keep sending me bills for this. They are now threating to turn the bill over to a collections agency.

My questions are as follows:
1. Do they have the right to do this? I know it is common for people to settle auto accidents outside of the insurance companies to avoid getting higher rates, but this is only if both parties agree. In this case, I totally disagree with them and would prefer that they settle this through insurance.
2. If the dumpster was on a public road, shouldn't they be going after the city instead?
3. If the city is responsible, will they end up billing or assessing me for the cost anyways?
4. If what they are billing me for is illegal, will a collection agency even be able to help them?
5. I really don't have $400 to shell out for this, but if I really am potentially responsible for paying this, I'm wondering if it's just easier to pay the money and be done with it. If I let them take me to small claims court is it even worth the amount of time I'll have to waste?

 

[JETX]

Do they have the right to do this?

If the dumpster was damaged as a result of YOUR action, then yes, they have the right to expect you to pay for their damage. The fact that insurance may or may not cover the damage is NOT your issue.

In this case, I totally disagree with them and would prefer that they settle this through insurance.

Even if their insurance paid for the damage, the insurance company would still go after you for the costs that they had to pay... due to YOUR actions.

If the dumpster was on a public road, shouldn't they be going after the city instead?

That depends on what caused the fire. If your at fault, you pay.

If the city is responsible, will they end up billing or assessing me for the cost anyways?

Again, if you are at fault, yes.

If what they are billing me for is illegal, will a collection agency even be able to help them?

It is not illegal.

I really don't have $400 to shell out for this, but if I really am potentially responsible for paying this, I'm wondering if it's just easier to pay the money and be done with it. If I let them take me to small claims court is it even worth the amount of time I'll have to waste?

That is your decision.

 

[dumpsterfire]

ad ignorantiam

As I stated, I wasn't home when the fire happened. I do not know the cause of the fire, nor does my neighbor, the fire department or anyone else. The owner of the dumpster feels that someone must be responsible though, so they blame me. It seems like I'm being automatically condemned for being the cause of this simply because there is no evidence to prove that I am not the one who caused the fire. That would be the fallacy known as appeal to ignorance.

I don't understand what reason the dumpster company has to believe that I am the one who caused the fire other than the fact that I was the one who rented the dumpster. Am I guilty simply because I chose to do business with them?

Judging from your response, which seems to make the assumption that I am indeed the one who caused the fire, I'm guessing that this "Guilty until proven innocent" mentality is fairly common in cases like this. I'm not attacking you by saying this, it's merely an observation. I do feel that my argument is a sound one, but perhaps philosophy isn't as relevant as
I would hope it to be in our legal system.

I appreciate being able to see my situation viewed through someone else's eyes, thank you for your quick response.

 

[claimlaw]

I would tell them that dumpsters catch fire. Could be arson, a ciggy butt, spontaneous combustion...who knows.

Only a complete corporate moron would sue you for $400. In most states a corporation is required to be represented by counsel. It will require time, money and effort with no guarantee to them.

Tell them to pound sand, nicely.

This is an economic answer, not a legal one. Although, the legal one is also likely to support your position pretty well.

Claimlaw

 

[dumpsterfire]

A complete corporate moron is sueing me for $400

Claimlaw -

I can't believe they're actually wasting their money on this. My mother got the summons from an angry sherriff today(probably because he had to drive 3 hours to drop it off). Here's what it says:

We delivered a rolloff box to "DUDE" on "SOME DAY" to his address at "SOME PLACE, WI." When we picked it up on "ANOTHER DAY" there had been a fire in it. We billed him for sandblasting and repainting and he refuses to pay for damages.

Is it possible that there are any unusual hidden laws that could turn this around on me, or should I just go to court and explain the story?

I can probably get my neighbor to sign a statement saying that he was the one who called the fire department. He said there was no sign of a fire at 11:00 P.M when he went to bed, and that he noticed the fire at about midnight when he woke up to go to the bathroom.

I had left the house at 7:00 P.M. and wasn't there at all for the next couple of days. I didn't even know that it had caught on fire until they called me back demanding that I pay for the damage.

 

[stephenk]

unfortunately you will be ultimately responsible for the damages. the dumpster was given to you in a certain condition. while in your custody, care, and control it was damaged. it doesn't matter that you don't know how it caught fire, the point is that the dumpster was damaged to the tune of $400.

They will get their $400 plus court filing fees and the cost to serve the complaint. you may want to work out some type of settlement before the hearing.

was there a written rental agreement for the dumpster? If yes, read it carefully. There may be a provision for the company to get attorney fees if legal action is filed to enforce the contract - such as paying for damages to the dumpster.

 

[dumpsterfire]

Quote: was there a written rental agreement for the dumpster? If yes, read it carefully.

There was no written agreement, I paid for it over the phone with a credit card and they delivered it. Did I really "rent" the dumpster legally?
I can see how I would be responsible if I had gone and picked it up, but I'm paying them for a service: trash removal. It's just like if I had paid someone to clean my house and they left their car on the street as far as I'm concerned.


Quote: There may be a provision for the company to get attorney fees if legal action is filed to enforce the contract - such as paying for damages to the dumpster.

The summons has a box for that checked. I never signed or recieved any kind of rental agreement, just bills for $400 with nasty lovenotes on them!

 

[JETX]

After diligently reading all of your posts in this thread, it leads to only one conclusion.... you are 100% correct. Everyone else is wrong.
Now, you just have to convince the dumpster owner and the courts of your success.
I suggest you refuse to pay anything.... and then when/if you are sued, deliver a full printe out this entire thread to the court. Heck, with any luck, the court will agree with you and give you a summary judgment..... without even giving the plaintiff a chance to present their claim against you.
Good luck. You ARE a winner!!