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Easements, trees, and another thing

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mike spence

Active Member
What is the name of your state? Pennsylvania

I've had a property partially taken by the state for a highway project. I've posted a few things about this in the past. It was a complete clown show that I might never get over.

I have new questions/problems now.

In addition to acquiring/taking land, they had a temporary construction easements around the house and some buildings there. The easement was to allow room for demolition.

On the property there were five large spruce trees. These were planted by my great-grandfather, and they'd basically be the only thing left on the remaining land. One of the trees was on the acquired land, three were on a temporary easement, one was not on either the acquired land or temporary easements.....they were all cut down!!

On another part of the property there was a large walnut tree on the edge of a channel easement......it was cut down too. I don't think they're even doing anything in that particular area.

My basic question is do they have a right to cut down these trees?

While I'm here, there's another issue. The state did not pay to use the driveway. I was told demolition was to be done from the highway (somehow). The company that's doing the job said they needed the driveway and have paid to do so. There is a stream crossing as part of the driveway. It's a large culvert, but was not wide enough for them. They are replacing the culvert, which I'm all for, but doing it in a substandard way.

The culvert there now (I say now, but it might have already been replaced) is seven feet in diameter, and they are putting two four foot diameter pipes in to replace it. By my math that's about a 33% reduction in cross-section. This is a small stream that turns into a raging river when it rains hard. I've seen the seven foot pipe with 5 or 6 feet of water in it many, many times in the past. I can see this culvert flooding out once every year or two. I also think the pipes will collect debris at the front, or worse, inside the pipes.

I believe this company will have to come back to me soon about digging a ditch on the remaining land. It's something that was not in the original plans. So I will be talking to them again.

What do I do? Thanks
 


adjusterjack

Senior Member
My basic question is do they have a right to cut down these trees?
What difference does it make? They DID cut them down. What you really want to know is whether you can get any money from the state for the loss of the trees. For an answer to that question you are going to have to ask an attorney.

The culvert there now (I say now, but it might have already been replaced) is seven feet in diameter, and they are putting two four foot diameter pipes in to replace it. By my math that's about a 33% reduction in cross-section. This is a small stream that turns into a raging river when it rains hard. I've seen the seven foot pipe with 5 or 6 feet of water in it many, many times in the past. I can see this culvert flooding out once every year or two. I also think the pipes will collect debris at the front, or worse, inside the pipes.
The math is complex. I have no idea if two 4' pipes are better than one 7' pipe or worse.
What do I do?
You have some complicated issues, not the least of which is potential litigation against a government entity.

I suggest that you consult an attorney.
 

quincy

Senior Member
mike spence, in your other threads you said you were working with an attorney but the attorney was not well-versed in eminent domain cases.

It was suggested at that time that you find an experienced attorney to replace the inexperienced one. Did you?

You have issues with the house and the land that require a personal review by an experienced professional in your area.
 

mike spence

Active Member
At the time I posted stuff here I wasn't too happy with my lawyer, but didn't yet understand that he was a moron that would screw up the whole thing. I also didn't have money to switch to a different lawyer at that point. I would've done it if I could.

I signed the deal last May. I didn't have many options, but that's a different story.

This stuff I'm talking about now has all happened recently, like in the past two weeks. I don't have a lawyer anymore as part of the deal with PennDOT.

As mentioned, the company has to deal with me again about digging a ditch. I don't know how much power I will have over this, but I will bring up the trees and the culverts. I'm just not sure what the law would say about these issues.
 

quincy

Senior Member
At the time I posted stuff here I wasn't too happy with my lawyer, but didn't yet understand that he was a moron that would screw up the whole thing. I also didn't have money to switch to a different lawyer at that point. I would've done it if I could.

I signed the deal last May. I didn't have many options, but that's a different story.

This stuff I'm talking about now has all happened recently, like in the past two weeks. I don't have a lawyer anymore as part of the deal with PennDOT.

As mentioned, the company has to deal with me again about digging a ditch. I don't know how much power I will have over this, but I will bring up the trees and the culverts. I'm just not sure what the law would say about these issues.
What sort of “deal” with PennDOT prevents you from having a lawyer?

If you signed an agreement that compensated you for your property, the agreement you reached would need to be read in its entirety to see if there is anything you can do now about the trees and the culvert.
 

mike spence

Active Member
Nothing prevents me from having a lawyer other than the cost/benefit of doing so.

PennDOT outsources just about everything. I think I'm just done dealing with them at this point. This is a private company that paid to use the driveway. They are the ones rebuilding the culvert and cutting down trees. They'll be demolishing structures, and I think they are the road builders as well.
 

quincy

Senior Member
Nothing prevents me from having a lawyer other than the cost/benefit of doing so.

PennDOT outsources just about everything. I think I'm just done dealing with them at this point. This is a private company that paid to use the driveway. They are the ones rebuilding the culvert and cutting down trees. They'll be demolishing structures, and I think they are the road builders as well.
The private company paid you for use of your driveway? What were the terms of that agreement?
 

mike spence

Active Member
Yes. PennDOT didn't pay for using the driveway. I was told demolition would happen from the highway, so they wouldn't need to use the driveway. The company doing everything said they couldn't do it from the highway so they're doing all of this now.

I have a short agreement with them. It says, paraphrased...

Owner will allow occupant access. Intended use is for construction material, trucks, and equipment.

Occupant will make improvements, blah, blah, blah, as well as widening the existing stream crossing. Improvements will become property of owner. Owner agrees to indemnify occupant for all events associated with the the property after completion of the project.

Term dates, liability insurance info....

Agreement shall be construed in accordance with the laws of the state of Pennsylvania
 

quincy

Senior Member
Yes. PennDOT didn't pay for using the driveway. I was told demolition would happen from the highway, so they wouldn't need to use the driveway. The company doing everything said they couldn't do it from the highway so they're doing all of this now.

I have a short agreement with them. It says, paraphrased...

Owner will allow occupant access. Intended use is for construction material, trucks, and equipment.

Occupant will make improvements, blah, blah, blah, as well as widening the existing stream crossing. Improvements will become property of owner. Owner agrees to indemnify occupant for all events associated with the the property after completion of the project.

Term dates, liability insurance info....

Agreement shall be construed in accordance with the laws of the state of Pennsylvania
Interesting. You will want an attorney if you decide to seek compensation for the trees and the culvert. The agreement needs to be read in full but I see some room for argument, like over the meaning of “improvement.”
 

mike spence

Active Member
I'm a slow typer so blah'ed it.

It says...

Occupant will make improvements to property in conjunction with its operations, including grading, compacting, and stoning accessways as well as widening the exisitng stream crossing.

They're widening the driveway a little bit.
 

quincy

Senior Member
I'm a slow typer so blah'ed it.

It says...

Occupant will make improvements to property in conjunction with its operations, including grading, compacting, and stoning accessways as well as widening the exisitng stream crossing.

They're widening the driveway a little bit.
I would think that what is not being “improved” needs to be returned to its previous condition.
 

mike spence

Active Member
No, and I'm sure they're not worth much. The trees around the house were spruce, and yard trees at that. They're probably worth nothing at it. It's a sentimental thing.

The walnut tree might've been worth a few hundred dollars.
 

quincy

Senior Member
No, and I'm sure they're not worth much. The trees around the house were spruce, and yard trees at that. They're probably worth nothing at it. It's a sentimental thing.

The walnut tree might've been worth a few hundred dollars.
You might be able to get some replacement trees but they probably would be young trees and, of course, would not have the sentimental value.

Again, I suggest you have the various and assorted agreements you have entered into personally reviewed in their entirety by a legal professional in your area. If there is a legal aid clinic or law school near you, you might find free assistance there. We are unable to personally review contracts on this forum.

Good luck.
 

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