Eviction Assistance - Tenant or Transient Occupant?

[Saxman]

Florida

Lost story short, in the midst of ongoing divorce litigation and the ex obtained exclusive use of the marital home. We own it together, I’m listed on the mortgage first, I’m ordered to pay 100% of the mortgage. Shortly after having me removed she allowed a family of three to also move in. Upon learning of this I immediately emailed my disapproval (we have a minor child in the home). She responded it was only temporary. My understanding is that since she has possession she can authorize transient occupants with little recourse on my end.

However, that was 18 months ago. The tenants have long outlived any transiency. Though the ex has sworn that they do not pay rent, I believe she is getting paid under the table by the occupants. Whether or not they pay rent, it would appear they are tenants none the less because of the length of time living there, they occupy multiple rooms, they receive mail there, etc.

If they are no longer considered transient occupants, and can legally be construed as tenants, would it not require my authorization as a landlord/co-owner for them to live there? How can I have them removed? Can I pursue retro-active rent payments if they are not paying rent?

 

[Zigner]

...would it not require my authorization as a landlord/co-owner for them to live there?

It would not require your authorization.

How can I have them removed?

You can go back to the court that your divorce is being heard in and ask for orders regarding the matter, but it's been 18 months, so you're not likely to get them.

Can I pursue retro-active rent payments if they are not paying rent?

No.

 

[LdiJ]

Florida

Lost story short, in the midst of ongoing divorce litigation and the ex obtained exclusive use of the marital home. We own it together, I’m listed on the mortgage first, I’m ordered to pay 100% of the mortgage. Shortly after having me removed she allowed a family of three to also move in. Upon learning of this I immediately emailed my disapproval (we have a minor child in the home). She responded it was only temporary. My understanding is that since she has possession she can authorize transient occupants with little recourse on my end.

However, that was 18 months ago. The tenants have long outlived any transiency. Though the ex has sworn that they do not pay rent, I believe she is getting paid under the table by the occupants. Whether or not they pay rent, it would appear they are tenants none the less because of the length of time living there, they occupy multiple rooms, they receive mail there, etc.

If they are no longer considered transient occupants, and can legally be construed as tenants, would it not require my authorization as a landlord/co-owner for them to live there? How can I have them removed? Can I pursue retro-active rent payments if they are not paying rent?

She received exclusive use of the marital home. She can let whomever she wants to live there, sorry. You no longer have any say at this point. When you get closer to finalizing the property settlement you may possibly have some leverage then, but in reality its probably just going to look like sour grapes on your part.

 

[Saxman]

It’s not so much as the living there as it is collecting unreported rental income. Her bank records don’t show cash in. Her spending habits and lifestyle would be impossible without the extra income (especially now that she’s been unemployed for 5 months). The only way to prove that would be subpoena the occupants’ bank records. Can the divorce judge compel production of documents from a non-party, or would have to file a separate claim?

 

[LdiJ]

It’s not so much as the living there as it is collecting unreported rental income. Her bank records don’t show cash in. Her spending habits and lifestyle would be impossible without the extra income (especially now that she’s been unemployed for 5 months). The only way to prove that would be subpoena the occupants’ bank records. Can the divorce judge compel production of documents from a non-party, or would have to file a separate claim?

What is it that you hope to accomplish here? You are articulating nothing so far other than general annoyance. She has exclusive use of the marital home right now, she doesn't have to justify anything to you or even to the court regarding what she does with it as long as she is not dissipating the asset.

 

[Saxman]

What is it that you hope to accomplish here? You are articulating nothing so far other than general annoyance. She has exclusive use of the marital home right now, she doesn't have to justify anything to you or even to the court regarding what she does with it as long as she is not dissipating the asset.

I can understand why it would appear that way. From the outset of the divorce she argued for exclusive use, saying she could afford the house if she rented out the other rooms. She moved for exclusive use and was denied. Judge ordered that I stay but pay 100% of the mortgage (even though we both made around 50k). So she filed for a completely false and unsubstantiated TRO to get me out of the home anyways. I believe the TRO was premeditated to get me out and also move in paying renters. I’m stuck paying for the house and crashing with my parents because I can’t afford separate housing for myself.

After finding out she had renters I moved for modification of temporary support; if she has renters she can afford the mortgage. Unfortunately the Court never heard it. That was 1.5 years ago. Being in the advantageous position they are in they’ve managed to stall and delay litigation at all costs, got the Court to cancel the trial that was set for a year ago on an improper ore tenus motion for continuance, refused to mediate even though the Court ordered us to mediate by July 21 of last year, refused to timely provide updated mandatory, and any/all other stalk tactics you can think of.

I should not be paying 100% of the mortgage if she is collecting rental income while living there. She has the ability to pay it and I cannot afford housing for myself otherwise. They have purposefully delayed litigation in an effort to harass me into agreeing to unreasonable demands for alimony and atty fees (I’m pro se because I can’t afford an atty AND pay the mortgage, her atty fees are 50k).

Generally annoyed is an accurate assessment .

 

[adjusterjack]

I’m pro se

Yeah, that's why you are losing.

Going up against an attorney without one of your own is like taking a rubber knife to a gunfight. You'll be the one on the ground bleeding.

She wants to keep the house at all costs and knows she has the upper hand with a lawyer who knows all the tricks.

I can’t afford an atty AND pay the mortgage

Then stop paying the mortgage and hire yourself an attorney. Yes, you'll be sanctioned, but it will bring things to a head. 18 months is way too long for a divorce to take. Time to go scorched earth.

I'm sympathetic. My ex pulled the same crap on me. Fake RO got me out of the house. Eventually, though, she choked on her lawyer fees and settled. Maybe your wife will do the same.

 

[Saxman]

Yeah, that's why you are losing.

Going up against an attorney without one of your own is like taking a rubber knife to a gunfight. You'll be the one on the ground bleeding.

She wants to keep the house at all costs and knows she has the upper hand with a lawyer who knows all the tricks.



Then stop paying the mortgage and hire yourself an attorney. Yes, you'll be sanctioned, but it will bring things to a head. 18 months is way too long for a divorce to take. Time to go scorched earth.

I'm sympathetic. My ex pulled the same crap on me. Fake RO got me out of the house. Eventually, though, she choked on her lawyer fees and settled. Maybe your wife will do the same.

I appreciate the sympathy. It’s been 18 months that she’s had “house guests.” The divorce has been going on 3 years. To be fair, I had a lawyer. Her lawyer ran the bill up so high it was cheaper to pay another retainer and let my first lawyer put a lien on the house. Went through 4 lawyers like that. They kept bailing when I couldn’t pay. Tried your tactic of paying a lawyer instead of the mortgage and the judge threatened to throw me in jail. Once I was on my own I had her disqualified, but the damage was already done.

I’m trying to find any way for this to come to a head, hence the post. Any little bit helps at this point.

 

[FarmerJ]

If she is not working is she drawing unemployment compensation ?

 

[LdiJ]

Yeah, that's why you are losing.

Going up against an attorney without one of your own is like taking a rubber knife to a gunfight. You'll be the one on the ground bleeding.

She wants to keep the house at all costs and knows she has the upper hand with a lawyer who knows all the tricks.



Then stop paying the mortgage and hire yourself an attorney. Yes, you'll be sanctioned, but it will bring things to a head. 18 months is way too long for a divorce to take. Time to go scorched earth.

I'm sympathetic. My ex pulled the same crap on me. Fake RO got me out of the house. Eventually, though, she choked on her lawyer fees and settled. Maybe your wife will do the same.

AJ I understand why you are giving the advice that you are giving but if he follows your advice he is going to trash his own credit. If you are going to give that kind of advice you really HAVE to acknowledge that.

 

[Saxman]

If she is not working is she drawing unemployment compensation ?

Yes, she is. The unemployment is enough to cover her car payment, cell phone bill, and not much else. She’s months behind on the household bills she’s ordered to pay.

 

[Saxman]

AJ I understand why you are giving the advice that you are giving but if he follows your advice he is going to trash his own credit. If you are going to give that kind of advice you really HAVE to acknowledge that.

All in good spirit, in 3 years worth of litigation she’s already destroyed my credit.

 

[justalayman]

I can understand why it would appear that way. From the outset of the divorce she argued for exclusive use, saying she could afford the house if she rented out the other rooms. She moved for exclusive use and was denied. Judge ordered that I stay but pay 100% of the mortgage (even though we both made around 50k). So she filed for a completely false and unsubstantiated TRO to get me out of the home anyways. I believe the TRO was premeditated to get me out and also move in paying renters. I’m stuck paying for the house and crashing with my parents because I can’t afford separate housing for myself.

After finding out she had renters I moved for modification of temporary support; if she has renters she can afford the mortgage. Unfortunately the Court never heard it. That was 1.5 years ago. Being in the advantageous position they are in they’ve managed to stall and delay litigation at all costs, got the Court to cancel the trial that was set for a year ago on an improper ore tenus motion for continuance, refused to mediate even though the Court ordered us to mediate by July 21 of last year, refused to timely provide updated mandatory, and any/all other stalk tactics you can think of.

I should not be paying 100% of the mortgage if she is collecting rental income while living there. She has the ability to pay it and I cannot afford housing for myself otherwise. They have purposefully delayed litigation in an effort to harass me into agreeing to unreasonable demands for alimony and atty fees (I’m pro se because I can’t afford an atty AND pay the mortgage, her atty fees are 50k).

Generally annoyed is an accurate assessment .

They? Who is they?

It’s obvious you need to find some way to hire an attorney. The fact this has taken this long alone is proof enough of this.

 

[Saxman]

They? Who is they?

It’s obvious you need to find some way to hire an attorney. The fact this has taken this long alone is proof enough of this.

They = The Ex and her Attorney. The attorney has flat out told me he had no problems hiking up his fees by dragging out litigation, and threatens o continue to do so if I don’t give what he wants.

Not that I don’t want to hire an attorney, I have no means of hiring an attorney. I’m not so naive as to think I can do it on my own. I’ve already maxed out loans and hit up family for the previous 4 attorneys. No options left, just in survival mode. I’ve put in a motion to sell the house, hoping that gets before the judge sometime soon. Then it’s moving for sanctions for purposefully delaying litigation countless times.

 

[justalayman]

previous 4 attorneys?

It sounds like you have a lot more problems than you’ve spoken of here. I can’t imagine how or why one would go through 4 attorneys for a divorce.