[FRAUD] Doctor's note to Federal Judge...is this even believable?

[caycee38]

It isn't a legal question. It seems to be a jerk looking to get an ex-employee deported and for some strange reason came here, to a legal advice site, posted under the "Other Crimes- Federal or State" forum, seeking "other opinions not in the medical field". I guess to see if others agree with the dental hygienist uber qualified opinions to call the ex-employee a fraud.

Exactly, except I'm an orthodontist, and not a jerk . Not really a legal question, but I'm open to any advice.

Didn't want to take it off topic, but elsewhere she mentions her husband is a known terr!orist and that the host country is afraid to prosecute him, turning this into an Asylum - that the host country is unable or unwilling to protect her. I am looking at the husband's facebook page, he has thousands of photos and has been living in the states for the past decade. I think the women is lying about him being a terr!orist, but nonetheless this needs to be looked into. Sorry if you think I'm a "jerk" for reporting potential terr!orist.

I don't want to get into other things, but I'll mention one, countless times in her asylum she claims her parents to be deceased. This is not true. The women approached me years ago claiming her mother was in poor health and she could not visit her due to her VISA and that she wanted to sponsor her mother to visit her and needed some documents from me such as proof of employment, business records, etc., and I helped.
Eventually the mom visited, she would bring her mom into work for a month claiming her house was empty with the kids at school and her mom didn't understand any thing on TV (i.e. English). I didn't mind as long as she got her job done. About two years after, her mom passed, the employee took some time off work, our office sent her flowers and a card we all signed. Yet, her asylum claims both of her parents died when she was a small child and she was raised by her grandfather, who protected her until he fell ill and passed to put forth this narrative that she has no one to protect her if her asylum is not granted and she has to return. Also the mother's name on her birth certificate in her Asylum is not same mother's name that she sponsored to visit her.

 

[stealth2]

Exactly, except I'm an orthodontist, and not a jerk . Not really a legal question, but I'm open to any advice.

Didn't want to take it off topic, but elsewhere she mentions her husband is a known terr!orist and that the host country is afraid to prosecute him, turning this into an Asylum - that the host country is unable or unwilling to protect her. I am looking at the husband's facebook page, he has thousands of photos and has been living in the states for the past decade. I think the women is lying about him being a terr!orist, but nonetheless this needs to be looked into. Sorry if you think I'm a "jerk" for reporting potential terr!orist.

I don't want to get into other things, but I'll mention one, countless times in her asylum she claims her parents to be deceased. This is not true. The women approached me years ago claiming her mother was in poor health and she could not visit her due to her VISA and that she wanted to sponsor her mother to visit her and needed some documents from me such as proof of employment, business records, etc., and I helped.
Eventually the mom visited, she would bring her mom into work for a month claiming her house was empty with the kids at school and her mom didn't understand any thing on TV (i.e. English). I didn't mind as long as she got her job done. About two years after, her mom passed, the employee took some time off work, our office sent her flowers and a card we all signed. Yet, her asylum claims both of her parents died when she was a small child and she was raised by her grandfather, who protected her until he fell ill and passed to put forth this narrative that she has no one to protect her if her asylum is not granted and she has to return. Also the mother's name on her birth certificate in her Asylum is not same mother's name that she sponsored to visit her.

I’m going to hazard a guess that OP votes Red. Mind your own, hun.

ETA: this is oddly reminiscent of an older post/er on a divorce thread, mais non?

 

[cbg]

I still don't know what the legal question is.

Is it, To whom do I report this?

Is it , should I report this?

Is it something else?

Is it, does this letter sound like rambling nonsense that I should ignore?

What was your purpose for coming here?

 

[quincy]

Exactly, except I'm an orthodontist, and not a jerk . Not really a legal question, but I'm open to any advice.

Didn't want to take it off topic, but elsewhere she mentions her husband is a known terr!orist and that the host country is afraid to prosecute him, turning this into an Asylum - that the host country is unable or unwilling to protect her. I am looking at the husband's facebook page, he has thousands of photos and has been living in the states for the past decade. I think the women is lying about him being a terr!orist, but nonetheless this needs to be looked into. Sorry if you think I'm a "jerk" for reporting potential terr!orist.

I don't want to get into other things, but I'll mention one, countless times in her asylum she claims her parents to be deceased. This is not true. The women approached me years ago claiming her mother was in poor health and she could not visit her due to her VISA and that she wanted to sponsor her mother to visit her and needed some documents from me such as proof of employment, business records, etc., and I helped.
Eventually the mom visited, she would bring her mom into work for a month claiming her house was empty with the kids at school and her mom didn't understand any thing on TV (i.e. English). I didn't mind as long as she got her job done. About two years after, her mom passed, the employee took some time off work, our office sent her flowers and a card we all signed. Yet, her asylum claims both of her parents died when she was a small child and she was raised by her grandfather, who protected her until he fell ill and passed to put forth this narrative that she has no one to protect her if her asylum is not granted and she has to return. Also the mother's name on her birth certificate in her Asylum is not same mother's name that she sponsored to visit her.

My advice is that you do not call anyone a terrorist unless you have proof of the truth of that statement (which you don’t appear to have). It is defamatory if false.

As for the letter, send it to your former employee if you know how to reach her. Because it is private medical information, you should know (as an orthodontist) that the information in the letter should not be publicly disclosed. I am surprised that you published it here and am glad that it now has been removed from this thread.

My impression is that your sole intent is to cause harm to your former employee and her family. If so, you should do some serious soul-searching - and re-read your oath as a dental professional.

 

[LdiJ]

I’m going to hazard a guess that OP votes Red. Mind your own, hun.

ETA: this is oddly reminiscent of an older post/er on a divorce thread, mais non?

I was just thinking that myself!

 

[quincy]

Both the content and the username have a certain familiarity. But, whether caycee is a former poster or a new poster, this caycee should not act on the discovered letter in the way s/he proposes, certainly not without consulting with a local attorney who can personally advise on the wisdom (or lack thereof) of doing so. The potential harm is not only to the employee but also to caycee’s professional license.

 

[caycee38]

I’m going to hazard a guess that OP votes Red. Mind your own, hun.

ETA: this is oddly reminiscent of an older post/er on a divorce thread, mais non?

Yes, vote red but can't vote for Trump. I sat out the past election. I hope the republican party returns to core values.

I still don't know what the legal question is.

Is it, To whom do I report this?

Is it , should I report this?

Is it something else?

Is it, does this letter sound like rambling nonsense that I should ignore?

What was your purpose for coming here?

Is it, To whom do I report this? I am reporting her to USCIS, reporting the doctor to the medical board. The lawyer to the law board. I am reporting the husband to DHS. I am going to attempt to talk to the judge. I am open to any other suggestions.

My advice is that you do not call anyone a terrorist unless you have proof of the truth of that statement (which you don’t appear to have). It is defamatory if false.

As for the letter, send it to your former employee if you know how to reach her. Because it is private medical information, you should know (as an orthodontist) that the information in the letter should not be publicly disclosed. I am surprised that you published it here and am glad that it now has been removed from this thread.

My impression is that your sole intent is to cause harm to your former employee and her family. If so, you should do some serious soul-searching - and re-read your oath as a dental professional.

I didn't call her husband a terro!ist. I stated the women did multiple times under oath on her Asylum. I stated the husband has been living in the US the past decade and if he is in fact a terro!ist he should NOT be inside the US. Clearly the proper authority needs due it's due diligence and verify if he is a threat.
The doctor was not a previous employee. I am at an orthodontist office, he works as a rehab doctor.
Your opinion doesn't change the fact that this is a very serious crime lying in federal court. It undermines the asylum process for actual victims. I am not convinced that this women is even who she claims to be because her birth certificate has fake names.

Both the content and the username have a certain familiarity. But, whether caycee is a former poster or a new poster, this caycee should not act on the discovered letter in the way s/he proposes, certainly not without consulting with a local attorney who can personally advise on the wisdom (or lack thereof) of doing so. The potential harm is not only to the employee but also to caycee’s professional license.

I spoke to an attorney.
"I can't tell you if you any liability to report this without seeing the documents, but I would certainly report this and it seems like you are."
"I help bring people into this country, not kick people out, HAHAHAHA"
"I'd charge minimum $500 for a letter, but to be candid it wouldn't accomplish any thing more than if you were to report it yourself."

 

[Zigner]

What evidence do you have that the doctor did anything wrong?
What evidence do you have that the lawyer did anything wrong?

I suggest that you find a hobby. Maybe take up bird watching (while you can) or astronomy...

 

[caycee38]

***UPDATE***

I spoke to the doctor over the phone.

Before I begin, any doctor that didn't write the letter would most likely just hang up immediately. Or, ask a lot of questions: What are you talking about? What letter? Letter for who? Read me the letter, etc.

This doctor refused to hang up the phone. Mostly remained silent. And he didn't ask a single question. He was clearly frightened and stunned.

The million dollar question asked to him is : how can you write a letter claiming you are able to visibly look at a healed scar with your bare eyes and determine: WHO caused the scars "secondary to spousal and religious fundamentalist abuse" and WHY the scars occurred "she sustained numerous injuries...triggered [by] her modern believes, view of life, desire for freedom, equal right and equal opportunity for women in her native homeland".

The doctor had no answer. He remained silent, after a while, he said "I never wrote anything for a judge or asylum". I asked him how he knows the attorney. [I didn't mention it here, but the women, the attorney and the doctor are all from the same country. I don't want to mention the country but it's a country notorious for fraud]. Surprisingly the doctor answered "I know him", I asked how, and he said "he's an attorney and would send people with injuries". I didn't ask, but why is an immigration attorney sending multiple people to a physical medicine and rehab (PM&R) doctor?

I re-asked the million dollar question above and he remained silent this time. After literally five minutes of silence I told him the notary stamp and his three USMLE scores on his CV are prima facie evidence you are involved. He told me "someone could have added the notary stamp", and confirmed his USMLE scores "those are my scores, and I put those on my CV". USMLE are standardized tests you take in med school, it's private information. It's like a attorney's CV that contains his SAT, LSAT and Bar scores. It's unusual to put on a CV but nonetheless, if the scores are correct, as is the case here, you suspect some involvment since those scores are private.

My opinion: It appears that this doctor was involved. I know he didn't write this letter, no doctor would ever write a letter like this, the letter appears like a pursavie essay someone in high school would write. I do think the doctor signed and notorized the document. I do think he was paid for it. I fear there are other letters he did the same with. I don't think he was aware it was being sent to a federal court for an asylum case, perhaps he was lied to and was told it was for a far less severe crime.

 

[stealth2]

***UPDATE***

I spoke to the doctor over the phone.

Before I begin, any doctor that didn't write the letter would most likely just hang up immediately. Or, ask a lot of questions: What are you talking about? What letter? Letter for who? Read me the letter, etc.

This doctor refused to hang up the phone. Mostly remained silent. And he didn't ask a single question. He was clearly frightened and stunned.

The million dollar question asked to him is : how can you write a letter claiming you are able to visibly look at a healed scar with your bare eyes and determine: WHO caused the scars "secondary to spousal and religious fundamentalist abuse" and WHY the scars occurred "she sustained numerous injuries...triggered [by] her modern believes, view of life, desire for freedom, equal right and equal opportunity for women in her native homeland".

The doctor had no answer. He remained silent, after a while, he said "I never wrote anything for a judge or asylum". I asked him how he knows the attorney. [I didn't mention it here, but the women, the attorney and the doctor are all from the same country. I don't want to mention the country but it's a country notorious for fraud]. Surprisingly the doctor answered "I know him", I asked how, and he said "he's an attorney and would send people with injuries". I didn't ask, but why is an immigration attorney sending multiple people to a physical medicine and rehab (PM&R) doctor?

I re-asked the million dollar question above and he remained silent this time. After literally five minutes of silence I told him the notary stamp and his three USMLE scores on his CV are prima facie evidence you are involved. He told me "someone could have added the notary stamp", and confirmed his USMLE scores "those are my scores, and I put those on my CV". USMLE are standardized tests you take in med school, it's private information. It's like a attorney's CV that contains his SAT, LSAT and Bar scores. It's unusual to put on a CV but nonetheless, if the scores are correct, as is the case here, you suspect some involvment since those scores are private.

My opinion: It appears that this doctor was involved. I know he didn't write this letter, no doctor would ever write a letter like this, the letter appears like a pursavie essay someone in high school would write. I do think the doctor signed and notorized the document. I do think he was paid for it. I fear there are other letters he did the same with. I don't think he was aware it was being sent to a federal court for an asylum case, perhaps he was lied to and was told it was for a far less severe crime.

Why is this any of your business?

 

[quincy]

***UPDATE***

I spoke to the doctor over the phone.

Before I begin, any doctor that didn't write the letter would most likely just hang up immediately. Or, ask a lot of questions: What are you talking about? What letter? Letter for who? Read me the letter, etc.

This doctor refused to hang up the phone. Mostly remained silent. And he didn't ask a single question. He was clearly frightened and stunned.

The million dollar question asked to him is : how can you write a letter claiming you are able to visibly look at a healed scar with your bare eyes and determine: WHO caused the scars "secondary to spousal and religious fundamentalist abuse" and WHY the scars occurred "she sustained numerous injuries...triggered [by] her modern believes, view of life, desire for freedom, equal right and equal opportunity for women in her native homeland".

The doctor had no answer. He remained silent, after a while, he said "I never wrote anything for a judge or asylum". I asked him how he knows the attorney. [I didn't mention it here, but the women, the attorney and the doctor are all from the same country. I don't want to mention the country but it's a country notorious for fraud]. Surprisingly the doctor answered "I know him", I asked how, and he said "he's an attorney and would send people with injuries". I didn't ask, but why is an immigration attorney sending multiple people to a physical medicine and rehab (PM&R) doctor?

I re-asked the million dollar question above and he remained silent this time. After literally five minutes of silence I told him the notary stamp and his three USMLE scores on his CV are prima facie evidence you are involved. He told me "someone could have added the notary stamp", and confirmed his USMLE scores "those are my scores, and I put those on my CV". USMLE are standardized tests you take in med school, it's private information. It's like a attorney's CV that contains his SAT, LSAT and Bar scores. It's unusual to put on a CV but nonetheless, if the scores are correct, as is the case here, you suspect some involvment since those scores are private.

My opinion: It appears that this doctor was involved. I know he didn't write this letter, no doctor would ever write a letter like this, the letter appears like a pursavie essay someone in high school would write. I do think the doctor signed and notorized the document. I do think he was paid for it. I fear there are other letters he did the same with. I don't think he was aware it was being sent to a federal court for an asylum case, perhaps he was lied to and was told it was for a far less severe crime.

It sounds as if you intend to do what you want to do, regardless of what any of us have to say, and you seem to have in mind exactly who you want to contact. I don’t see that adding additional names or agencies to your list will be of any benefit, especially since it doesn’t appear any of us believe you should be contacting anyone in the first place.

I agree with Zigner that there are a whole host of better things you could do with your time.

Edit to add, for those who were curious: caycee38 was the author of the thread titled, “How Do I Verify a Notary Document,” once appearing in this section of the forum.

 

[not2cleverRed]

***UPDATE***

I spoke to the doctor over the phone.

Before I begin, any doctor that didn't write the letter would most likely just hang up immediately. Or, ask a lot of questions: What are you talking about? What letter? Letter for who? Read me the letter, etc.

This doctor refused to hang up the phone. Mostly remained silent. And he didn't ask a single question. He was clearly frightened and stunned.

The million dollar question asked to him is : how can you write a letter claiming you are able to visibly look at a healed scar with your bare eyes and determine: WHO caused the scars "secondary to spousal and religious fundamentalist abuse" and WHY the scars occurred "she sustained numerous injuries...triggered [by] her modern believes, view of life, desire for freedom, equal right and equal opportunity for women in her native homeland".

The doctor had no answer. He remained silent, after a while, he said "I never wrote anything for a judge or asylum". I asked him how he knows the attorney. [I didn't mention it here, but the women, the attorney and the doctor are all from the same country. I don't want to mention the country but it's a country notorious for fraud]. Surprisingly the doctor answered "I know him", I asked how, and he said "he's an attorney and would send people with injuries". I didn't ask, but why is an immigration attorney sending multiple people to a physical medicine and rehab (PM&R) doctor?

I re-asked the million dollar question above and he remained silent this time. After literally five minutes of silence I told him the notary stamp and his three USMLE scores on his CV are prima facie evidence you are involved. He told me "someone could have added the notary stamp", and confirmed his USMLE scores "those are my scores, and I put those on my CV". USMLE are standardized tests you take in med school, it's private information. It's like a attorney's CV that contains his SAT, LSAT and Bar scores. It's unusual to put on a CV but nonetheless, if the scores are correct, as is the case here, you suspect some involvment since those scores are private.

My opinion: It appears that this doctor was involved. I know he didn't write this letter, no doctor would ever write a letter like this, the letter appears like a pursavie essay someone in high school would write. I do think the doctor signed and notorized the document. I do think he was paid for it. I fear there are other letters he did the same with. I don't think he was aware it was being sent to a federal court for an asylum case, perhaps he was lied to and was told it was for a far less severe crime.

I don't know about the doctor, but I do know from this that you shouldn't be working in any dental profession, because you clearly need to update your HIPAA training.

The questions you were asking the doctor were completely inappropriate.

If the stuff you found were actually used in an asylum case, then somebody has already evaluated the documents and was satisfied.

 

[LdiJ]

I don't know about the doctor, but I do know from this that you shouldn't be working in any dental profession, because you clearly need to update your HIPAA training.

The questions you were asking the doctor were completely inappropriate.

If the stuff you found were actually used in an asylum case, then somebody has already evaluated the documents and was satisfied.

Which may be why the doctor was so stunned and didn't know how to respond.

 

[quincy]

Exactly, except I'm an orthodontist, and not a jerk …

Obviously these are not mutually exclusive.

 

[caycee38]

What evidence do you have that the doctor did anything wrong?
What evidence do you have that the lawyer did anything wrong?

I suggest that you find a hobby. Maybe take up bird watching (while you can) or astronomy...

A doctor doesn't have the purview to claim he's able to look at a healed scar and claim who caused it and the motive. He's using his license to deceive and defraud a federal court.

In her asylum she claims to be a "leader" of a small radical party, who is being persecuted by the dominate religious party. In this letter she claims she was handing out contraceptive that the religious party did not like, so they kidnapped her and drove her two hours away and raped her, when she returned home, she claims her husband (who is a leader of the religious party) orchestrated the rape.

Her asylum was actually DENIED. Looks like an asylum officer asked her about her job, believes of this minor party she is a leader of, how she returned home after she was raped and the women couldn't answer any of these simple questions. Looks like the federal immigration judge was more of an appeal. This time she just brought a ton of signed affidavits. I only mention the doctors note since it's the only thing the judge mentioned, but the women has about 10 affidavits all from her country from family, friends and co-workers all of them are obviously fake. Literally the same three paragraph format, the same exact adjectives are used, clearly every one was written by the same person. Every letter ends by saying if she returns she will be killed. It's the judge's job to determine if she will be harmed if she returns. When every letter ends by explicitly saying she will be killed if she returns, even an dummy can tell you are trying way too hard to sell me something.

The lawyer had a bunch of old news paper articles to convince the judge that the left liberal party was being killed/tortured by the dominate religious party. All news paper articles were translated into English, signed and notarized about 8 years before this women's asylum. Seems like the lawyer is recycling old documents.

It sounds as if you intend to do what you want to do, regardless of what any of us have to say, and you seem to have in mind exactly who you want to contact. I don’t see that adding additional names or agencies to your list will be of any benefit, especially since it doesn’t appear any of us believe you should be contacting anyone in the first place.

I agree with Zigner that there are a whole host of better things you could do with your time.

Edit to add, for those who were curious: caycee38 was the author of the thread titled, “How Do I Verify a Notary Document,” once appearing in this section of the forum.

Yeah, I have a motive, I don't want to get into it. It's beyond the scope of this thread. And yes, I made a thread about verifying notaries because I wanted to know if that doctor actually signed the document. But that state doesn't provide contact information from notaries, so I gave up on verifying the signature.

I don't know about the doctor, but I do know from this that you shouldn't be working in any dental profession, because you clearly need to update your HIPAA training.

The questions you were asking the doctor were completely inappropriate.

If the stuff you found were actually used in an asylum case, then somebody has already evaluated the documents and was satisfied.

The letter from the doctor is not plausible to me and that is the purpose of the thread: is the letter believable?
Keep in mind there is no defender if Asylum cases. The judge probably just half scanned the letter and shrugged and said "I guess, I'm not a doctor so I'll just take his word on it".

Which may be why the doctor was so stunned and didn't know how to respond.

I wanted to reach out to the doctor, in case he was innocent, I wouldn't want to report it and have him dig himself out of a hole.
The doctor is 100% involved as he stated, but I do believe him when he tried to deny some involvement.

I am almost certain: He is friends with this attorney and the attorney sent him many letters to sign for money and he never saw any of these patients.
50/50 if he signed this exact letter: I don't know if he blindly signed letters or if he signed another letter and the attorney copied the signature and notary stamp onto this letter.
I am almost certain: The doctor did not know his letter was being used in a federal court to convince a judge of a fraud asylum. I do believe him he denied that aspect. His attorney friend probably lied to him about where the letter was being used.