Getting clarification on a law Tennessee

[Awf]

General question, How do you request clarification on a law? I have corresponded with the state of Tennessee in many occasions trying to get clarification of laws, however generally I receive answers from people within individual departments as to their interpretation of the law, or the way their internal departments handle things. Do you actually have to raise suit to request a legal interpretation of a law?

For example, recently, I requested information on and the process for getting a non-photo license. I was told in no uncertain terms it is not possible. This is although there are provision in the code for non-photo licenses, and not to mention part religious freedom provisions elsewhere in code no information on how to get one though. They kept pointing to a fee statute as evidence that I do not qualify. The statute simply states there are alternative fees for people of an age getting a non photo license.

So unless someone feels like answering the non photo license question, this is more about how do you get a law interpreted by someone with actual legal training, not the clerk telling me as they see it? I am guessing only by hiring a lawyer, but if I wanted to pursue it on my own, how can that be done?

 

[adjusterjack]

this is more about how do you get a law interpreted by someone with actual legal training, not the clerk telling me as they see it? I am guessing only by hiring a lawyer, but if I wanted to pursue it on my own, how can that be done?

One option is to look up, and read, case decisions for how the courts interpret specific laws. You can do this on Google Scholar.

https://scholar.google.com/

Or you can go to court, either as a plaintiff or defendant. You can do this without a lawyer if you can figure out how.

answering the non photo license question

There doesn't have to be a law that you can't get a non-photo license. There only needs to be a law that you must have a photo license. In fact, there doesn't have to be a law saying that, there only needs to be a law saying that the state has the authority on deciding how licenses are issued.

there are provision in the code for non-photo licenses

What code? Please cite the statute number.

not to mention part religious freedom provisions elsewhere in code

What does religious freedom have to do with getting a license?

Are you a member of one of those primitive tribes that believe getting their photo taken steals their souls?

The statute simply states there are alternative fees for people of an age getting a non photo license.

Again, what statute? Cite the statute number.

There doesn't appear to be anything on the TN fee list for a non-photo license for anybody.

https://www.tn.gov/safety/driver-services/dllicensefees.html

 

[quincy]

You are not going to get a "legal" analysis of any law from anyone but a licensed attorney.

There is a nationwide exception to photo ids based on religious grounds.

 

[quincy]

Quick review turns up Jensen v. Quaring, 472 US 478 (1985):

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/conlaw/Quaring.html

 

[Awf]

I apologize in advance that I cannot get this to quote your questions, so I will paste questions with answers:
Awf said:
there are provision in the code for non-photo licenses

AJ: What code? Please cite the statute number.

AWF: Tenn. Code Ann. § 55-50-335
(a) All driver licenses shall bear a color photograph of the applicant furnished by the department or bear an endorsement that no photograph is required. No license issued shall be valid unless it bears this photograph or endorsement.


AJ: What does religious freedom have to do with getting a license?

Are you a member of one of those primitive tribes that believe getting their photo taken steals their souls?

AWF: Not that I need to defend my beliefs, but as I told the DMV - I have an objection to photographs, If I had known before of options I would have likely pressed the matter before, our society frowns on going against the grain and as young people we tend to avoid confrontations for a variety of reasons to our own personal detriment.

Awf said:
The statute simply states there are alternative fees for people of an age getting a non photo license.
AJ: Again, what statute? Cite the statute number.

AWF: Tenn. Code Ann. § 55-50-323

(K)
(i) For any person sixty (60) years of age or older who, on or after January 1, 2013, elects to renew a nonphoto bearing license, the fee for the license shall be fifteen dollars ($15.00); provided, that the license is an operator (Class D or M) with no endorsements;
(ii) No person sixty (60) years of age or older who, prior to January 1, 2013, elected to obtain a nonphoto bearing license shall be required to obtain a driver license with a color photograph on or after January 1, 2013...

This does not apply to me, I will gladly pay all fees....This is what they kept citing for a reason as me not being eligible. This is a fees statute, no a procedural or definition.

Hope this helps to clarify my questions.

 

[Awf]

Quick review turns up Jensen v. Quaring, 472 US 478 (1985):

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/conlaw/Quaring.html

What would be the appropriate process to raise these concerns on my own. Honestly, I do not have money for an attorney. Are there any sort of self directed actions that I can take for this matter, and secondly overall if a law is ambiguous, and I do not agree with the way it is being interpreted from an individual (not a judge, an administrative individual or department), can anyone clue me into what the course of action is short of hiring a lawyer.
I am good with carrying out the work, I just honestly do not know where to start to find a procedure.

Thank you all,

 

[NeilTheCop]

What does religious freedom have to do with getting a license?

Are you a member of one of those primitive tribes that believe getting their photo taken steals their souls?

He may be a Pastafarian

 

[quincy]

What would be the appropriate process to raise these concerns on my own. Honestly, I do not have money for an attorney. Are there any sort of self directed actions that I can take for this matter, and secondly overall if a law is ambiguous, and I do not agree with the way it is being interpreted from an individual (not a judge, an administrative individual or department), can anyone clue me into what the course of action is short of hiring a lawyer.
I am good with carrying out the work, I just honestly do not know where to start to find a procedure.

Thank you all,

If there is a legitimate religious objection to having a photo taken for a driver's license, it will almost always be up to the one asserting a religious right to defend this right.

A court determination is almost always required. You are not going to find the driver's license bureau analyzing the law for you (analysis is considered the practice of law) and you are not going to find the driver's license Bureau making this determination.

I suggest you contact your area ACLU.

 

[quincy]

For those who do not want to sign into Lexis, here is a direct link to Tennessee's 55-50-335:
https://law.justia.com/codes/tennessee/2017/title-55/chapter-50/part-3/section-55-50-335/

 

[Awf]

If there is a legitimate religious objection to having a photo taken for a driver's license, it will almost always be up to the one asserting a religious right to defend this right.

A court determination is almost always required. You are not going to find the driver's license bureau analyzing the law for you (analysis is considered the practice of law) and you are not going to find the driver's license Bureau making this determination.

I suggest you contact your area ACLU.

Thank you for your time and consideration. It is much appreciated. Seems as the ACLU is the appropriate action.

Do you happen to know if internal state departments generally post policies for the public to read? I know this would have to vary state to state, but has anyone ever seen a collection of this kind.
I understand there are the statutes that are publicly available, but curious as to operating procedures. (not in reference to their employment i.e employee handbook, but more of how they complete the job they are assigned.)

I have not been able to find anything of the sort. I appreciate would be a large collection of documentation, however feel that these sort of resources would be extremely useful to someone such as me.
I do not know if something like this is available under FOIA, or even how a request for that would be filled out.

 

[Awf]

I may have found part o:f my answer- not sure if this applies to my situation, will read through it more in depth, but looks like it defines how to petition:
https://publications.tnsosfiles.com/rules/1360/1360-04/1360-04-01.pdf

Wherein is this:
1360-04-01-.07 DECLARATORY ORDERS.
(1) Any affected person may petition an agency for a declaratory order as to the validity or the applicability of a statute, rule or order within the primary jurisdiction of the agency.
(2) The petition seeking a declaratory order shall be filed in writing with the agency.
(3) The form of such petitions shall be substantially as follows:
(a) Petition for Declaratory Order Before the (Division) of the (Agency).
1. Name of Petitioner _______________________________________________________________
2. Address of Petitioner _______________________________________________________________
3. Agency rule, order, or statutory provision on which declaratory order is sought _______________________________________________________________
4. Statement of the facts of the controversy and description of how this rule, order or statute affects or should affect the Petitioner.
5. Description of requested ruling _______________________________________ _______________________________________________________________ __________________ Signature of Petitioner __________________ Address __________________
This is linked from this resource - looks very interesting:
https://sos.tn.gov/effective-rules

 

[quincy]

I may have found part o:f my answer- not sure if this applies to my situation, will read through it more in depth, but looks like it defines how to petition:
https://publications.tnsosfiles.com/rules/1360/1360-04/1360-04-01.pdf

This is linked from this resource - looks very interesting:
https://sos.tn.gov/effective-rules

Good luck.

 

[adjusterjack]

Do you happen to know if internal state departments generally post policies for the public to read? I know this would have to vary state to state, but has anyone ever seen a collection of this kind.

Generally, a state's administrative code supplements its statutes. Tennessee's equivalent of an administrative code appears on the Secretary of State's website:

https://sos.tn.gov/rules-and-regulations

Wherein is this:
1360-04-01-.07 DECLARATORY ORDERS.

Yes, you can try that but my guess is that you'll get the same results "no license without a photo" unless you are prepared to defend your religious beliefs like Quaring did in her lawsuit:

She believes in a literal interpretation of the Second Commandment, which states, Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image or likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Exodus 20:4; Deuteronomy 5:8. Quaring believes that the Commandment is violated by creating a likeness of God's creation. Quaring's belief extends beyond her refusal to allow her photograph to appear on her driver's license. She believes the Second Commandment forbids her from possessing any image having a likeness of anything in creation. She possesses no photographs of her wedding or family, does not own a television set, and refuses to allow decorations in her home that depict flowers, animals, or other creations in nature. When she purchases foodstuffs displaying pictures on their labels, she either removes the label or obliterates the picture with a black marking pen.

Are your religious beliefs that comprehensive?

Not that I need to defend my beliefs. I have an objection to photographs

That alone isn't going to cut it. The US Supreme Court says you do have to defend your beliefs.

What would be the appropriate process to raise these concerns on my own. Honestly, I do not have money for an attorney. Are there any sort of self directed actions that I can take for this matter, and secondly overall if a law is ambiguous, and I do not agree with the way it is being interpreted from an individual (not a judge, an administrative individual or department), can anyone clue me into what the course of action is short of hiring a lawyer. I am good with carrying out the work, I just honestly do not know where to start to find a procedure.

Again, if you cannot convince the DMV to issue you a non-photo license (maybe you can print out the Quaring decision and show it at the DMV) then you will have sue and get a court order.

 

[Awf]

Generally, a state's administrative code supplements its statutes. Tennessee's equivalent of an administrative code appears on the Secretary of State's website:

https://sos.tn.gov/rules-and-regulations



Yes, you can try that but my guess is that you'll get the same results "no license without a photo" unless you are prepared to defend your religious beliefs like Quaring did in her lawsuit:



Are your religious beliefs that comprehensive?



That alone isn't going to cut it. The US Supreme Court says you do have to defend your beliefs.



Again, if you cannot convince the DMV to issue you a non-photo license (maybe you can print out the Quaring decision and show it at the DMV) then you will have sue and get a court order.

Thank you for your time, information and links - Sorry let me clarify - I just was not wanting to have to defend my beliefs here as I didn't see it as necessary - fully prepared to defend otherwise.

Much appreciative to all. Have a great New Year!

 

[quincy]

It is good that you are fully prepared to defend your religious rights. You can (and might be smart to) seek guidance from the ACLU if you find yourself struggling with how to best present your arguments.