GYM ACL ligament

[formerlsa]

What is the name of your state? MA

Hello, Today has been a bad day and I need some advice. My 14 almost 15 year old girl on December 15 was late for Gym because she is in band. She walked into gym and wasn't even changed into her clothes and the rest of the class was playing a game. The gym teacher told her to run so she did. Well, she heard a pop, then collapsed. Today I found out she needs surgery for an ACL torn ligament.

First of all, I was an athlete in my younger years. We stretched and warmed up and prepared for sports. I just got home from work. People are telling me this gym teacher is incompetent and that I should make the school pay for this operation. Let me say I am devastated at what my girl has to go through..ok its not terminal..it could be chronic, who knows yet? I am extremely angry**************

I am a divorced Mom with a $2600 mortgage and a disabled X-husband and presently on Mass Health because I cannot afford cobra and my company doesn't offer insurance. Sad state of affairs.

Should I let Mass Health pay for this? Should I talk to the school about my concerns? Are they responsible in any way for this?

I am not looking for anything. I just cannot believe that a gym teacher did not prepare a students body properly for running, remember most of these kids sit at their desks all day long and are very sedentary and that can pose a problem. Please tell me your opinion on this, my children and I have been very healthy and I have only been on Mass Health for a short time and I am constantly looking for a position with insurance, I have had Tufts my whole life until I decided to get a divorce, then th X became disabled**************.....yeah life is tough****************************please everyone**************.truth on what I should do because I am mad**************.Thanks

 

[stephenk]

You need the specific details on how she hurt herself. Just running forward will not tear the ACL of the knee. to tear the ACL requires a twisting motion, ie. when a football player gets tackled and his body goes one way and the knee another.

Stretching before running would not prevent a tear to the ACL if she twisted her knee while running.

If you have insurance let them pay for the surgery (if needed) and rehab.

 

[xylene]

Should I let Mass Health pay for this? Should I talk to the school about my concerns? Are they responsible in any way for this?

You are lucky to have Mass Health. Its a fine program. Of course you should "let" them pay for it. Hold your complaining for something that isn't covered. Your (ex-husbands) Tufts insurance would pay too, so its no different. What matters is the ability to pay your claim, not any level of prestige.

I hope you do talk to your school about your concerns. For starters if band time cuts into other classes time then- the band director needs to be instructed to let students out on time and/or a pass system utilized when band time runs over. The PE teacher must not castigate your child for being legitimately tardy. This did not cause or exacerbate our childs tragic injury, but it should be addressed

They are not responsible for the injury. ACL tears are not caused or exacerbated by not streching or being sedentary. They are caused by twisting under force, most commonly from a blow or aburpt lateral movement. In some persons presidiposition to ACL tears are caused by an inate hypoplasticity of the tissue.

 

[formerlsa]

thank you

Thanks agains for your replies....I'm still upset and a bit confused. I called the school. I explained my concerns, the principal asked me if he was the only one I had spoken to?? I think this means have I called a lawyer. He seem very concerned and is getting back to me. I talked to a neighbor and a paralegal , no lawyer. Both said there is some liabilty in this case.

I realize that an ACL tear is from twisting. My kid arrived late and was told to run in tight jeans. I still believe that she should of warmed up.This wouldn't of happened if she was on time and participated with the rest of the class most likely. It still happened on their property.

To clear things up, my X-husband has NO insurance anymore as he is on disability for the rest of his life and there is a 2 year wait for medicare. If he hadn't lost his job he would of had to follow the court order and provided the children with insurance still but it no longer applies.

My kid will have to go through physical therapy 2-3 times a week for 3 weeks to prepare for surgery. Then after that there is another 4-6 months of rehab therapy 2 times a week at least. This doesn't even mention the pain she has to go through, and what about possible complications like infections or leg stiffness or blood clots? What about transportation back and forth to school? Is she expected to jump on the bus like before?

I am not saying this is all their fault. But they do share some of it. If someone just fell in my yard for no reason my insurance would have to pay**************This could possibly be a LTD. She is needed to wear a brace for every sport for the rest of her life. This is if the surgery goes with no complications. I'm not sure if they will use a donor graft or her own tendon yet, I will be finding this out... It is rare for a 14 year old to get an ACL tear although it affects all age groups.

I'm still not sure on what to do, but I am hearing some very serious concerns about her future from intelligent people and my friend told me to call her law office....Not sure.....

I have to work 6 days a week to keep in my lifestyle meaning my house since I live in the Northeast and being a single mother I cannot see how I am going to do all this on my own. I don't have a single relative alive to help me out.

Thank you both

 

[formerlsa]

new info

Now I find out the real story. The kids were playing a game with towels and my kid slipped on a towel!!!! Now what do you all think?

 

[xylene]

I think this means have I called a lawyer.

Even if you had no case, if you planned to sue it would involve costs. He was just trying to 'head you off at the pass' If you do plan on pursuing this in court don't talk to him until you have consulted with your lawyer. That isn't a statement about the merits of your case

I realize that an ACL tear is from twisting. My kid arrived late and was told to run in tight jeans. I still believe that she should of warmed up.This wouldn't of happened if she was on time and participated with the rest of the class most likely. It still happened on their property.

I don't know. I do no that your belief is not evidence that will stand up in court. I think the way your band teacher, PE teacher and school administration policy handled your child is pretty bad. Pretty bad does not make them liable for the injury nor does the simple fact it occured on school property.

To clear things up, my X-husband has NO insurance anymore as he is on disability for the rest of his life and there is a 2 year wait for medicare. If he hadn't lost his job he would of had to follow the court order and provided the children with insurance still but it no longer applies.

I am very much opposed to the 2 year wait. I am sorry about your experience, it sound difficult. I was trying to make you feel good about the quite good coverage you have now under Mass Health.

My kid will have to go through physical therapy 2-3 times a week for 3 weeks to prepare for surgery. Then after that there is another 4-6 months of rehab therapy 2 times a week at least. This doesn't even mention the pain she has to go through, and what about possible complications like infections or leg stiffness or blood clots? What about transportation back and forth to school? Is she expected to jump on the bus like before?

If there is a settlement or successful lawsuit, physical therapy and pain and suffering could be inculded. 'Possiblities' are not covered unless they occur. If your daughter is disabled by the injury then she needs to be accomodated. If yes is not, then yes she needs to board the bus or secure alternate transportation.

I am not saying this is all their fault. But they do share some of it. If someone just fell in my yard for no reason my insurance would have to pay**************

Your assessment that they share some of the blame is not evidence of a legal 'leg to stand on'. There are far more variables involved in if you would be liable for an injury on your propery than just that it occured on your property. The same is true in your daughters case.

This could possibly be a LTD. She is needed to wear a brace for every sport for the rest of her life. This is if the surgery goes with no complications. I'm not sure if they will use a donor graft or her own tendon yet, I will be finding this out... It is rare for a 14 year old to get an ACL tear although it affects all age groups.

Again if she has long term issues, that would be included in a settlement. That does not mean an automatic case. The fact that ACL tears are rare in youth and the injury occured absent the standard causes (trauma or sports known to cause ACL injury) is not evidence that supports your case that it is the schools responsibility.

I'm still not sure on what to do, but I am hearing some very serious concerns about her future from intelligent people and my friend told me to call her law office....Not sure.....

People in the real world know more details than we can through the monitor. They however are involved in your life and are emotionally involved with you.

Having an injury like this will have life long impacts- even with the surgery. But your daughters life is not ruined.

If your friend wants you to talk to a lawyer- then what do you have to lose?

I would strongly suggest getting at least 2 legal opinions (opinions not connected to friends who work at that firm and whose views of the capability of the firm are not impartial) and only selecting a lawyer who works on contingency.

I have to work 6 days a week to keep in my lifestyle meaning my house since I live in the Northeast and being a single mother I cannot see how I am going to do all this on my own. I don't have a single relative alive to help me out.

Thank you both

That is why you need a lawyer who works on contingency.

You are welcome.

I hope that everything works out and that your daughter heals. Get second opinions, for the leg and for the lawyer.

Some people do fine with no surgery, or are able to delay surgery for many years, esp given her age.

 

[xylene]

Now I find out the real story. The kids were playing a game with towels and my kid slipped on a towel!!!! Now what do you all think?

This does change things somewhat. I think you need to talk to a lawyer. Don't talk to the school until you have. Do keep careful records.

If the school offers you a settlement- still talk to a lawyer.

BTW- the principal of the school is probably limited in what he can do. If you talk to anyone it should be the superintendant

 

[formerlsa]

thank you

Hi, I haven't talked to the school again although I have met 2 woman that the same thing has happened to their kids at the school. Both were playing after school sports which you need to sign a disclaimer for. One kid blew his ACL at home, had surgery, a year later joined football then it happened again and they still paid for everything.

It seems this school is used to things like this. Both Moms told me the school pays for the surgery, transportation to and from school in a special van, all physical therapy too. They work with the kids. They have 2 sets of books for them so they never have to carry backpacks. The athletics instructor will help them do their physical therapy during their gym spots, the couselors will make sure and help them get through with their problems if there are any with school work. The nurse is also a big help. They work as a team and care about their students.

So, I will be waiting for an answer and authorization and I will let you all know.

Thanks

 

[earnie the atty]

(Boston, MA) Glad to hear the school will, in all likelihood, will step up here and accomodate your daughter.

However, please be advised that the Massachusetts Tort Claims Act precludes many suits against public schools with its "discretionary function rule." Sect. 10(b) protects public employees for any decisions that are discretionary, and is quite often used successfully as a defense for claims involving negligent hiring and negligent supervision. Unfortunately, if this was a public school, unless the gym teacher violated a policy of the school, i.e. no towels or other slip/trip hazards on the floor, the actions of the gym teacher appear discretionary.

Even if you could establish liability, many Massachusetts lawyers are reluctant to take on these cases, as there are liability caps in place of $100,000 for public schools. Respectfully, I would not accept your case on these facts. But thats just one opinion, and you should call around for others.

Best of luck to you and your daughter.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Hi, I haven't talked to the school again although I have met 2 woman that the same thing has happened to their kids at the school. Both were playing after school sports which you need to sign a disclaimer for. One kid blew his ACL at home, had surgery, a year later joined football then it happened again and they still paid for everything.

It seems this school is used to things like this. Both Moms told me the school pays for the surgery, transportation to and from school in a special van, all physical therapy too. They work with the kids. They have 2 sets of books for them so they never have to carry backpacks. The athletics instructor will help them do their physical therapy during their gym spots, the couselors will make sure and help them get through with their problems if there are any with school work. The nurse is also a big help. They work as a team and care about their students.

So, I will be waiting for an answer and authorization and I will let you all know.

Thanks

Many of the items you describe are reasonable accommodaitons under ADA that the school is required to provide under Federal law, leaving the cost of treatment which they may or not cover depending of the insurance coverage at the school and school policies.

Don't rush to surgery if the injury will heal on it's own along with PT and other treatment. If surgery and other treatment is required, then use the MASS HEALTH plan you have to cover your child. While your ex is disabled, is he able to transport your child to appointments?

You and your child should look very closely at her choices in sports including but not limited to what is offered in school. My son wanted to be a professional wrestler at the same age and he had talent. One day during practice he was matched up with a much larger and inexperienced opponent, the result was my son's knee was dislocated. He had to go to pt and wear a brace for some time, it is amazing how well they get around once the initial pain is controlled and healing begins. He played football the next season wearing his brace with no problems and also participated in highland atheletic events with no problems winning first place in the caber toss. The next wrestling season he insisted on trying out for the wrestling team the next season and did so after clearance by his doctor. I got a call at the very first practice, his knee was out again and it was the end of his wrestling career, he still participated in highland events and he completed an enlistment in the USMC with all the physical activities and requirements, but wrestling is out because there is too much opportunity for twisting the knee.

Other questions you will be faced with are, was your daughter late because band got out late or because she was late due to talking or inattention? Did your daughter look at the floor and take into account the towels on the floor? Is your daughter accident inclined? Have the soles of her shoes examined for even or unusual wear paterns. Does she lift her feet or does she drag them?

 

[formerlsa]

thank you

Thank you again. Earnie, at this school they do have a rule that the kids need to be in their gym clothes to participate. My kid had a note, she was late because they were practicing for the Christmas concert that was to be performed that evening. So with that in mind the teacher made her jump in the game even when my child said she was not ready at all to participate.

The principal called and left a message that we can talk about her injury. I called Mass Health before this and told them of my concerns figuring the school had insurance liability. Now I am confused and apprehensive to call the princpal back, although, I'm sure he will give me news I want to hear.

No matter what, I will not sign anything, she is in PT for the next 3 weeks to prepare for the surgery and then the operation will happen. The doctor said if she doesn't get reconstruction she will never be able to run, play any type of sport ever again, her knee will always give out. So I will see and pray that all goes well especially after with the rehab of it all. This could be a LTD. Now if it is what do I do then???? Thanks to you all.