What is the name of your state? VA. I have an employee who after over 2 years is unable to complete his daily paperwork. I spend more time trying to decipher his time than anyone else. Besides having the option of firing him, because I need the body, do I have any recourse in discipline? Can I deduct from his time the time that it takes me to analyze his time? I have other responsibilities that I have to accomplish. I realize it's a stretch, but I have to ask. I am at my wits end. Time off with no pay? Anything?
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Habitual failure to complete assigned daily tasks
- Thread starter Suzanne54
- Start date
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Just Blue
Senior Member
Seriously? Look for another employee and fire the guy. You must abide the employment laws for your state/federal government.
As I said, I know I can fire him, but right now I need the body
Just Blue
Senior Member
Well...It seems as if his "body" is causing more work than productivity.
True that!
I get it that is some organizations with freezes one has an incentive to preserves body count ....your post is unclear it this is your internal problem .
Agree with others, fire him .
You might try major task reassignment and other changes you predict will drive him out or cause him to violate a clear directive perhaps several times over ..or whatever it takes in your organization to justify a fire , if such is needed.
You are the boss and you should know what it takes in your organization ...we're not there .
Agree with others, fire him .
You might try major task reassignment and other changes you predict will drive him out or cause him to violate a clear directive perhaps several times over ..or whatever it takes in your organization to justify a fire , if such is needed.
You are the boss and you should know what it takes in your organization ...we're not there .
PayrollHRGuy
Senior Member
Your desire to keep a body in the chair is at odds with your desire to actually get work done.
A warm body that consumes resources and makes mistakes may be far worse that no body at all....and quite frankly if you put up with long substandard performance YOUR skills as a leader need to be called into question.
I've been places where there is institutional momentum against getting rid of deadwood....you sort out what it takes in your place !
I've been places where there is institutional momentum against getting rid of deadwood....you sort out what it takes in your place !
eerelations
Senior Member
Speaking as a senior HR professional with 30+ years' experience managing staff, and coaching other managers through their staff management issues, I can tell you that if this employee has not been able to make the cut by now, he never will. Whatever you do, whether it be legal or otherwise, is not going to work. So your choice here is either continue with the status quo, or fire him. And that's it. Really.
NeilTheCop
Member
Find another body, then fire him.
commentator
Senior Member
I can understand situations with staffing where losing the person means losing the position, and no manager of a department wants to give up a position. But as a manager, your time is being consumed and YOUR effectiveness is being compromised by this defective employer.
My suggestion is that you carefully analyze what you have going on here. I know there are some wonderful experienced HR professionals here who can offer a lot of suggestions, but here are a few of mine.
What exactly, though, do you mean by "decipher his time"? I spent many years watching people in the private sector try to terminate people for productivity issues. I also worked with many people who were "untouchable" in the civil service sector who turned out perhaps one eighth of the work that others in the same position were producing, (try managing around that) It's bad for morale, bad for your nerves, bad for the overall workplace.
But there are some constructive things I'm sure you've tried or you might try. One question that comes quickly to mind is, is this employee incapable, or is he just a slacker? He is "unable to complete his daily paperwork" you say. As a supervisor, you have to determine if is this because of the amount of paperwork, his failure of competence, in that he just doesn't know how to do it, or is he deliberately slacking, spending too much time away from his desk, making careless mistakes, etc. A program of progressive discipline comes to my mind, in which you try to figure out exactly why this person (after two years) isn't up to snuff and either encourage him to improve that performance or let him "fire himself."
If he is actually terminated for poor performance, the unemployment system would first look at whether or not he was adequately trained, then whether or not the work load is reasonable to expect of him. A VERY important question is "Was there ever a time when this employee was meeting performance standards?" That would indicate that he is capable of doing better but is voluntarily choosing not to do what he is asked to do by his employer with the accuracy that is asked for. That's a real good firing offense.
The unemployment system, (filing for and perhaps being approved for unemployment is the only recourse this employee would have in termination ) would try to determine if the employee was just slow and stupid and really unable to do the work, though he showed up every day and tried his best, or if he is a goof-off who's passing work on to others by his failure to meet performance standards. Or maybe he's just passive aggressive and enjoys aggravating the hell out of his manager, you. I would suspect that instead of outright firing this person right away, that if you have not already done so, you begin a serious, well thought out program of progressive discipline for performance issues, at the same time you have involved your HR in the situation. Your employee might feel that he was being harassed and self terminate, and perhaps you'd be able to replace him. But if no improvement is forthcoming, you can spend more time and perhaps have cooperation from your management in replacing this employee with a more competent one.
My suggestion is that you carefully analyze what you have going on here. I know there are some wonderful experienced HR professionals here who can offer a lot of suggestions, but here are a few of mine.
What exactly, though, do you mean by "decipher his time"? I spent many years watching people in the private sector try to terminate people for productivity issues. I also worked with many people who were "untouchable" in the civil service sector who turned out perhaps one eighth of the work that others in the same position were producing, (try managing around that) It's bad for morale, bad for your nerves, bad for the overall workplace.
But there are some constructive things I'm sure you've tried or you might try. One question that comes quickly to mind is, is this employee incapable, or is he just a slacker? He is "unable to complete his daily paperwork" you say. As a supervisor, you have to determine if is this because of the amount of paperwork, his failure of competence, in that he just doesn't know how to do it, or is he deliberately slacking, spending too much time away from his desk, making careless mistakes, etc. A program of progressive discipline comes to my mind, in which you try to figure out exactly why this person (after two years) isn't up to snuff and either encourage him to improve that performance or let him "fire himself."
If he is actually terminated for poor performance, the unemployment system would first look at whether or not he was adequately trained, then whether or not the work load is reasonable to expect of him. A VERY important question is "Was there ever a time when this employee was meeting performance standards?" That would indicate that he is capable of doing better but is voluntarily choosing not to do what he is asked to do by his employer with the accuracy that is asked for. That's a real good firing offense.
The unemployment system, (filing for and perhaps being approved for unemployment is the only recourse this employee would have in termination ) would try to determine if the employee was just slow and stupid and really unable to do the work, though he showed up every day and tried his best, or if he is a goof-off who's passing work on to others by his failure to meet performance standards. Or maybe he's just passive aggressive and enjoys aggravating the hell out of his manager, you. I would suspect that instead of outright firing this person right away, that if you have not already done so, you begin a serious, well thought out program of progressive discipline for performance issues, at the same time you have involved your HR in the situation. Your employee might feel that he was being harassed and self terminate, and perhaps you'd be able to replace him. But if no improvement is forthcoming, you can spend more time and perhaps have cooperation from your management in replacing this employee with a more competent one.
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