Hate Crime - civil recourse?

[Tamara_C]

This will be my 2nd thread about the problems I am experiencing. I live in Florida. Please see the last thread, entitled "Monetary damage due to slander" for the details. I am sure you can look up my user name and find it if you don't wish to search the pages for it.

To briefly recap I have been having a lot of problems with my neighbors. Namely they have stalked my ex room-mate until he moved out, slandered my husband and myself by claiming we are dealing drugs (I even had a strange woman asking me for them, saying she heard I could get her anything!), has cost us money by calling a club we were to perform at, again claiming we are drug dealers, etc., etc.,

Today we had to call the police on them yet again. My husband, my two NEW room-mates, and I were outside, talking (they were smoking, I don't allow smoking inside the house because of our child) when the female walks outside, to the house across the street (where they are moving to, from next door to us!). When she walks back to the house they live in now, she yelled "Watch it, or I'll get the gun, you ****ing spics!". We weren't speaking to her in any way. We were looking at her but not in a malicious manner (i.e. - making rude gestures or facial expressions).We all heard her, clearly. The police said there was no way, in Florida, to check to see if she, in fact, owns a gun.
-Since this is now a hate crime, do my chances of receiving punitive damages increase?
-What about concealed weapons permits?Can they check them to see if they own a gun that way?
-Can I now take them to a higher court (than small claims)?
-Does it even make a difference?

 

[JETX]

Wow, I can see another war heating up... both on the streets and on this forum, but here goes anyway....

Calling you names, rightly or wrongly, is NOT a hate crime.
Now, if they called you a "****ing spic" and then shot you, the police MIGHT be able to prosecute as a hate crime if they can show that they they had a pattern of abuse or treating all "****ing spics" that way. (BTW, these are your words, so don't presume any animosity in my using them).

So, to answer your questions:
Q1) "do my chances of receiving punitive damages increase?"
A1) No.

Q2) "What about concealed weapons permits? Can they check them to see if they own a gun that way?"
A2) Yes. Did you see a gun?? If no, then you do NOT have a right to know.

Q3) "Can I now take them to a higher court (than small claims)?"
A3) You always have the right of taking your claim to a higher court. You will need an attorney and LOTS (wheelbarrow... boatload??) of money. IMHO, no attorney will take you case on contingency, since you have ZERO chance of winning.

Q4) "Does it even make a difference?"
A4) Finally, the bottom line. IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE.

 

[Tamara_C]

You didn't look at the previous thread!

Obviously you did not read the other thread I have posted about these matters. The fact is these people are members of white supremecist groups, I am the only minority in my neighborhood, there have been SEVERAL other incidents, many of which are explained in the previous thread. I did mention at the beginning that the background of these incidents should be reviewed, perhaps you should have done so.

I am not trying to be rude but are you even a lawyer? I am asking because they teach 1st year law students that the CRIME of "assault" is defined as any threatening act which puts the victim in genuine fear of harm. This holds true whether or not a gun is visible. As far as having a right to know if someone who has made the threat of using a gun on me has a concealed weapons permit. I think it is on public record, correct? That makes it EVERYONE'S right to know. If you are a lawyer, do you specialize in criminal cases? My instinct is that you do not. Again, I am not trying to insult you but I need helpful advise from someone who is willing to look up the history through the previous thread (my only other than this one). I don't think you did that.

 

[I AM ALWAYS LIABLE]

My response:

See what happens when you play with fire, Steve ?

Our writer's response is the exact reason I left it alone. I could see it coming. You did too, but yet, somehow, you were drawn into it. Why, Steve, why ?

Do you like pain ?

You and I should go dancing. I've always enjoyed dancing the Masochistic Tango.

IAAL

[Edited by I AM ALWAYS LIABLE on 07-22-2001 at 01:59 AM]

 

[Tamara_C]

RE: I am always Liable

Funny, YOU were the one who, when reading the other thread I wrote, claimed it sounds like I had a great case? Why does the prejudicial aspect of it suddenly scare you? DOES NO ONE READ THEIR OWN RESPONSES TO PREVIOUS THREADS WHEN IT IS RECOMMENDED? Sad, sad, sad. Why does the "hate crime" aspect suddenly change your previous opinion? Perhaps you should reread that previous thread as well? In any case, I am NOT trying to start a war, I am simply trying to halt the seriuos harassmant my family and myself have suffered, we have lost money because of it and will likely have to move in order to feel safe in our own home You obviously have never been the target of such harassment and do not know how it feels to be unable to walk down your own street without being in fear for your safety, DESPITE the fact that we live in a very "safe" neighborhood! Some sensitivity, please! I thought this was a dispute over a shed blocking their view (despite the fact that it has been there for 20 years and they just moved in 6 months ago), Now I know the true reason for their nastiness. My advise to YOU, re-read the THREAD! YOU, YOURSELF RESPONDED TO IT IN A DIFFERENT MANNER THAN YOU JUST RESPONDED TO WHAT IS ESSENTIALLY THE SAME CASE!

 

[Tamara_C]

Here's tho OTHER THREAD, since no one was willing to look it up!

OAL THREAD:

I live in Florida. My neighbors have been copying down the lisence plates of my guests, using them to find out their names, addresses & then their phone numbers and have been calling them to leave nasty messages on their answering machines about me. They have also called a bar I was going to work at and made fraudulent statements that I am dealing drugs and am a bad influence. Of course, I am not dealing/using drugs, I'm a research assistant at a local university, am an officer in the national honor society for psychology (my major), Psi Chi, I donate plasma on a regular basis (they drug test each time someone donates, I have NEVER come up positive for ANYTHING!), and I will soon be volunteering with the elderly. I AM A GOOD PERSON! My entire neighborhood now believes I am some kind of degenerate and I have lost that job (I am a singer, this would have been for the whole summer) and all the income it would have provided. The bar owner says he'd come to court, as well as my mother (they left a message on HER machine on mother's day weekend - nice). My ex-roommate has been followed around town by these people and ended up moving out because of them so I have also lost that income (he wasn't on the lease). He says he'd be happy to testify as well. This issue has gone well beyond the scope of our neighborhood (this is a small town) and people I don't even know dislike me because of the viscious rumors they are spreading! They have even gone so far as to call the IRS, claiming that since my husband and I haven't worked in over 2 years, we must be dealing drugs (actually, my husband works in the summers, we live off student loans and my disability check). We've been investigated by Children & family resources for child neglect (we were cleared, of course but I wonder who called them...) And they have called Crimestoppers, claiming they have heard "Narcotics conversations" on our back porch! All of this is false and I am rather insulted at this apparent charactor assassination. Several of my professors would be willing to testify on my behalf in so far as character witnesses. The actual monetary damages exceed $5,000 but not by much. I may end up having to move, however because of all the trouble they are causing and this would bring that total up quite a bit. The police will do nothing. I have lost friends because of this as well as money. They both are involved and they both are listed as owning their home.
My questions-
1. would it be worth it to take them to court, given all my witnesses?
2. If I DO take this to court, do I file in small claims or reg. court?
3. Can I sue them for moving costs as well as slander?
4. If, by some stroke of luck I get a judgement against them, can I attach their house? Like a lean on an automobile? They are planning on selling the house and moving but they are only moving across the street so it doesn't solve my problem of their wild imaginations.
Sorry this was so long but I have actually left out quite a lot that they have done but the important info. is there.

RESPONSE FROM “I AM ALWAYS LIABLE”:

You have, what appears to be, a wonderful case. You're only problem is proving, exactly, who's doing this to you. You need more than a "strong suspicion". You need hard facts.

Not that it really matters, but do you know what the vendetta is about; i.e., why are they doing this to you ?

Why haven't you consulted an attorney ?

IAAL

MY RESPONSE TO HIM:

My husband, my room mate and I all heard the female bragging about her phone escapades on the day she made the calls. We rushed to the bar and spoke to the owner who confirmed that such a call was made. I told my mother about the message on her answering machine before she got home from vacation and I had no access to her machine prior to this incident. I even spoke to police about it before she was back from vacation. This can all be verified (cruise ticket date). I have spoken with lawyers, they all tell me it's not enough money for it to be worth their involvement. That is why I am considering small claims court. Also we overheard the male speaking on his phone (they like to talk on the phone in their garage with the door open, we can sometimes hear from our open window), he was telling whoever was on the other end that "oh, yeah, my neighbors are dealing like crazy, that house is hot, neither one of them has worked in over two years,...etc., etc." so we can tie it into who is doing it .
As far as to why this is occurring, we have a strange property line. Our property surrounds theirs on two sides, like an "L" shape. We live on a canal. We have a shed that blocks part of their view of the canal. It has been there for twenty years, they just moved in six months ago. They have been attempting in vain to have the city force us to remove it. It's legally there, they can't make us move it. The kicker? It's not even my property, it's my grandmother's! I'm renting from her! Had I not been related to her I doubt we'd be suffering all this harassment! These people are so vindictive and nasty they moved their fence over 6 inches to destroy a walkway. Granted, it was partially (3 inches) on their property and it was their right to do so but the fact that they spent all that money to do so, simply for spite, tells you something about how far they are going with this.

now maybe the respondants can be better informed to the situation.

 

[JETX]

Damn, I hope she has to pay her ISP by the minute. She will be broke by the end of the month.

IAAL: I only answered her as to her specifics on this ONE post, in the hope that she had learned that her babble is absolutely ridiculous. I see that she has learned nothing.

My suggestion deary, is that you go back and read your own posts.

Assault is "the crime or tort of threatening or attempting to inflict immediate offensive physical contact or bodily harm that one has the present ability to inflict and that puts the victim in fear of such harm or contact."

Your own post says that these people yelled, "Watch it, or I'll get the gun, you ****ing spics!".

Since this was a conditional statement, and you obviously were not in threatened with "immediate offensive physical contact or bodily harm", and that the person making the comment clearly didn't have the "present ability to inflict", and that you obviously weren't "in fear of such harm or contact", you were NOT assaulted.

Case closed. My original response stands. And, you Tamara, "are the weakest link.... good'by".

Sayonara, ciao, arivederci, au revoir, auf wiedersehen, adios!

Case dismissed with prejudice!

 

[Tamara_C]

re:Halket

That's funny, the police seem to think there's enough evidence of a crime to send it to the D.A., I guess it's up to HIM, NOT you to decide whether or not to prosecute (good thing). In any case, there is still plenty of other instances. Why do you, a recovery specialist in TEXAS presume to know ANYTHING about Florida law? If I am the weakest link, may I suggest that YOU are the MISSING link! I was polite to you in my posts, I see that curtesy isn't your strong suit.

I KNOW you were only responding to the ONE post, THAT IS WHY I POSTED THE PREVIOUS THREAD! I thought that much was obvious but apparently you are too wrapped up in your ignorance to read carefully. It even said to look at the other thread, I'm sorry you couldn't grasp the concept.

GOOD DAY, SIR and bother me with your lack of insight no more, please! I wish CONSTRUCTIVE advise, not ignorant ramblings!

 

[JETX]

Then if the police have sent it to the DA for possible prosecution, why the hell are you over here whining about it??

Let the professionals do their job.. and you can try to mind yours. I know that is a lot to ask, but try to do so for your own mental health.. and the good of the rest of us.

In summary, in your post on this thread, you asked three questions. I answered all of them.

In your replay of earlier drivel, you asked four questions.
It is not worth me going back to see if they were answered, but I offer them and my answers below:
Q1) "would it be worth it to take them to court, given all my witnesses?"
A1) No.

Q2) "If I DO take this to court, do I file in small claims or reg. court?"
A2) If your 'damages' are within the jurisdictional limit, use the small claims court system.

Q3) "Can I sue them for moving costs as well as slander?"
A3) No.

Q4) "If, by some stroke of luck I get a judgement against them, can I attach their house? Like a lean on an automobile?"
A4) No and No. Florida exempts houses from judgment seizure and, the cost of you attempting a LIEN on their car is prohibitive. For example, YOU have to post a bond of about $1,000.00 just to try to seize the car. And if the car already has a lien, they get paid first from any proceeds even if you were successful.

Now, I believe that all your questions have been answered. Goodbye!

And if you don't like the FREE ADVICE that you got, please feel free to fill out the 'Request full Refund' form by clicking on the link at the top of this page!

 

[Tamara_C]

Re:Halket

Obviously I am asking about civil recourse, the criminal aspect simply is a part of the situation. I wanted to know if the individual is convicted, how can I use this to strenghten my case? Apparently you don't understand too much in these matters. I noticed you never answered my question as to your status as an attorney. HMMM, I wonder why. If you are then I feel very sorry for your clients. Your opinion does NOT seem to match IAAL's, who is a law professor as well as an ACTUAL attorney. If you are so lacking in control that you must allow your emotions to govern your responses (to your employers detriment, I am sure), then perhaps you should seek a field where your contact with others is limited. In any case, you it's my opinion you should seek help for your lack of self control. Please don't bother me with your idiocy anymore, you are rather abrasive and, quite frankly, I am tired of dealing with someone whose only motive seems to be to argue. Try thinking for a change.

Bye-bye, now!