gmoneyjive
Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Colorado
Hi,
First off, sorry if this is too long. I've been fighting this for two months and am really struggling. If you don't have much time but could skip down and answer any of the questions at the bottom off the top of your head I'd appreciate it; I don't want to make too much work for anyone.
I recently applied for disability insurance through Principal. I went through the short phone interview but was so exhausted I left a few things out. They came back and said there were some prescriptions I didn't mention, and after talking with my doc we guessed the only ones on record here in Colorado are narcotics like Percocet (taken after hernia & once in a while when I tweak my back), Xanax (had a script since '03 but hardly take it as I don't have attacks anymore), and Adderall (have mildish ADHD, but take it when I’m overbooked and have deadlines with consequences) as they are required to be reported to the Prescription Drug Monitoring Program (PDMP - later I would find out PDMP doesn’t release any info). So I gave them those and explained the situation in the best way possible (Percocet & Xanax rare, which is true, and we said Xanax was only for high pressure situations like public speaking or when I really couldn't fall asleep), and Adderall to help concentrate but not every day and I've gone months without it. They requested med records from my doc, and I told him I only wanted to release certain info, which he agreed to.
They came back and said the doc had left out some records, and after a while of trying unsuccessfully to get them they offered a policy, but with a few exclusions. Some of them made sense (back pain), but some did not (depression). Considering I’ll be paying thousands of dollars over the years I would like to avoid as many exclusions as possible, especially ones that don’t make sense. So, Principal is a no-go, next up is Guardian and a few others, but I want to make sure I give myself the best possible chance of getting a policy before applying elsewhere.
But all this got me wondering: where are they getting their info, and wasn’t HIPAA supposed to protect my information? I started with my doctor, pharmacy and insurance company, all who denied sharing information. I opted out of Electronic Health Records (EHR), said I thought my identity may have been stolen and froze/password protected or otherwise locked down and prevented release of info there.
I then found out they requested info from MIB (formerly Medical Information Bureau - they keep a database of medical information and provide risk analysis for underwriters), so I got my disclosure and they had nothing on me. That started a two-month long dive down the rabbit hole of Specialty Consumer Reporting Agencies (CRAs), especially the medical ones such as Intelliscript, ExamOne (Scriptcheck, formerly OptumInsight/MedPoint/Ingenix), along with dozens of other CRAs. They apparently get their info from Pharmacy Benefit Managers (PBMs) and data clearinghouses. Thus far only Intelliscript has had info on me, and they have everything. I’ve been researching ways to lock that data down, but there doesn’t appear to be a way unless you know of one. I’ve gotten disclosure from everywhere possible until I ran out of gas and asked to opt out/freeze/password protect or otherwise prevent release of medical info to varying degrees of success. Some have come back asking for a police report and other things, but I fear if I lock everything down - if that’s even possible - it’ll prevent me from getting disability insurance. I’ve also heard of medical information data miners/brokers such as SAS Business Analytics and Insurity Inc., but haven’t gotten that far yet.
Sorry for the long email, but if you have quick answers to the following questions - or at least some off the top of your head as I don’t want to make extra work for you - please let me know:
1. Is there any point in trying to track down the rest of the data clearinghouses, medical information data miners/brokers to get disclosure, opt out, freeze, etc. information or is a) what’s already out there is out there, and b) would I be doing more harm than good by trying to limit a disability underwriter’s access to information, especially if they found out that’s what I’m trying to do?
2. Is there any way to prevent disability insurance underwriters from getting this information, or at least some of it? Especially Intelliscript.
3. If I freeze medical Data, will I be denied?
4. I’m guessing there’s no point in filing a HIPAA complaint, correct?
5. Would applying for lower payouts vs. max aka a “middle of the road plan” would make them less inclined to dig up everything about me? Logic says it should, but I’m not sure it works that way.
6. Would applying for both life & disability would help raise less red flags as that seems more like someone taking care of future family vs. quickly cashing out on a policy… thoughts? For what it’s worth on the last two questions, only Intelliscript had info on me (and they had everything), MIB & ExamOne didn’t have anything. Or so they claimed.
7. Know of any plans (Fed Advantage?) that won’t dig too deep into underwriting and won’t have exclusions?
8. Will it hurt me to apply for a bunch at once like I’ve heard with life insurance? I came across a story where a guy had applied for ~130ish life policies and received something like 80 of them then killed himself - it was on one of the CRA’s sites about the importance of underwriting as the ~50 insurers that did proper underwriting didn’t’ get screwed like the rest. However, it seems this isn’t the case with disability. I can also use one of the dozens of brokers and apply everywhere at once, saying I’m going to pick the best one.
Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated!
Hi,
First off, sorry if this is too long. I've been fighting this for two months and am really struggling. If you don't have much time but could skip down and answer any of the questions at the bottom off the top of your head I'd appreciate it; I don't want to make too much work for anyone.
I recently applied for disability insurance through Principal. I went through the short phone interview but was so exhausted I left a few things out. They came back and said there were some prescriptions I didn't mention, and after talking with my doc we guessed the only ones on record here in Colorado are narcotics like Percocet (taken after hernia & once in a while when I tweak my back), Xanax (had a script since '03 but hardly take it as I don't have attacks anymore), and Adderall (have mildish ADHD, but take it when I’m overbooked and have deadlines with consequences) as they are required to be reported to the Prescription Drug Monitoring Program (PDMP - later I would find out PDMP doesn’t release any info). So I gave them those and explained the situation in the best way possible (Percocet & Xanax rare, which is true, and we said Xanax was only for high pressure situations like public speaking or when I really couldn't fall asleep), and Adderall to help concentrate but not every day and I've gone months without it. They requested med records from my doc, and I told him I only wanted to release certain info, which he agreed to.
They came back and said the doc had left out some records, and after a while of trying unsuccessfully to get them they offered a policy, but with a few exclusions. Some of them made sense (back pain), but some did not (depression). Considering I’ll be paying thousands of dollars over the years I would like to avoid as many exclusions as possible, especially ones that don’t make sense. So, Principal is a no-go, next up is Guardian and a few others, but I want to make sure I give myself the best possible chance of getting a policy before applying elsewhere.
But all this got me wondering: where are they getting their info, and wasn’t HIPAA supposed to protect my information? I started with my doctor, pharmacy and insurance company, all who denied sharing information. I opted out of Electronic Health Records (EHR), said I thought my identity may have been stolen and froze/password protected or otherwise locked down and prevented release of info there.
I then found out they requested info from MIB (formerly Medical Information Bureau - they keep a database of medical information and provide risk analysis for underwriters), so I got my disclosure and they had nothing on me. That started a two-month long dive down the rabbit hole of Specialty Consumer Reporting Agencies (CRAs), especially the medical ones such as Intelliscript, ExamOne (Scriptcheck, formerly OptumInsight/MedPoint/Ingenix), along with dozens of other CRAs. They apparently get their info from Pharmacy Benefit Managers (PBMs) and data clearinghouses. Thus far only Intelliscript has had info on me, and they have everything. I’ve been researching ways to lock that data down, but there doesn’t appear to be a way unless you know of one. I’ve gotten disclosure from everywhere possible until I ran out of gas and asked to opt out/freeze/password protect or otherwise prevent release of medical info to varying degrees of success. Some have come back asking for a police report and other things, but I fear if I lock everything down - if that’s even possible - it’ll prevent me from getting disability insurance. I’ve also heard of medical information data miners/brokers such as SAS Business Analytics and Insurity Inc., but haven’t gotten that far yet.
Sorry for the long email, but if you have quick answers to the following questions - or at least some off the top of your head as I don’t want to make extra work for you - please let me know:
1. Is there any point in trying to track down the rest of the data clearinghouses, medical information data miners/brokers to get disclosure, opt out, freeze, etc. information or is a) what’s already out there is out there, and b) would I be doing more harm than good by trying to limit a disability underwriter’s access to information, especially if they found out that’s what I’m trying to do?
2. Is there any way to prevent disability insurance underwriters from getting this information, or at least some of it? Especially Intelliscript.
3. If I freeze medical Data, will I be denied?
4. I’m guessing there’s no point in filing a HIPAA complaint, correct?
5. Would applying for lower payouts vs. max aka a “middle of the road plan” would make them less inclined to dig up everything about me? Logic says it should, but I’m not sure it works that way.
6. Would applying for both life & disability would help raise less red flags as that seems more like someone taking care of future family vs. quickly cashing out on a policy… thoughts? For what it’s worth on the last two questions, only Intelliscript had info on me (and they had everything), MIB & ExamOne didn’t have anything. Or so they claimed.
7. Know of any plans (Fed Advantage?) that won’t dig too deep into underwriting and won’t have exclusions?
8. Will it hurt me to apply for a bunch at once like I’ve heard with life insurance? I came across a story where a guy had applied for ~130ish life policies and received something like 80 of them then killed himself - it was on one of the CRA’s sites about the importance of underwriting as the ~50 insurers that did proper underwriting didn’t’ get screwed like the rest. However, it seems this isn’t the case with disability. I can also use one of the dozens of brokers and apply everywhere at once, saying I’m going to pick the best one.
Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated!