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Is this ethical - estate/probate lawyers

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ShadyBrother

Junior Member
I have an ethical question regarding estate law in NY. My mom passed away last November. Four days after her death my brother filed for Letters of Administration, even though he was well aware that she had a will. I had a copy of her will but needed to find the original. I contacted the lawyer who wrote it and was able to obtain and file the will, which put the cabash on his letters of administration.

As I waited to file the will, my brother had jumped the gun. He had started to act as if he were already the administrator of her estate. He wrote me an email stating that he was going to be paying all of her bills until an estate account had been established. My moms will named her two sisters as executors. I notified them that I had filed the will and it took them over two months to file their petitions. During that time I was still under the impression that my mother's bills were being paid by my brother. My aunt's decided to use the same lawyer as my brother and they refuse to communicate with me and so I decided to contest the will and object to them being executors.

In the meanwhile, as we wait for our next court date to approach, my mom's car was repossessed. As you can imagine, I was shocked when I heard it had been repo'd, since my brother told me he was paying her car bill. I cannot see the bills because my brother apparently stopped the mail, or at least I thought. I called the financial institution that held her loan and they wouldn't give me any info. Since I know the email and passwords to some of my moms accounts I was able to get into her account for her loan. I still was unable to see anything regarding the loan. The only part of her account I was able to see was her billing information. I had noticed that someone had changed the billing address on her account. I looked up the account and sure enough the statements for the car loan were being mailed to my brother's lawyer's office.

Here's my question..... since there is no administrator or executor appointed at this point in time, is it ethical for the lawyer to have his office as the billing address on my mom's account? He is not representing the estate. He is representing my brother, an heir and my aunts as the proposed executors. Does the fact that their lawyer's address is on the account make him liable for the car? Is anyone liable for the car, at this point? Had I had access to the statements, I probably would've paid off the loan since there was only a small amount left. The car got repo'd and now I must chalk it up as a loss, even though I had no control over it.
 


Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
I have an ethical question regarding estate law in NY. My mom passed away last November. Four days after her death my brother filed for Letters of Administration, even though he was well aware that she had a will. I had a copy of her will but needed to find the original. I contacted the lawyer who wrote it and was able to obtain and file the will, which put the cabash on his letters of administration.

As I waited to file the will, my brother had jumped the gun. He had started to act as if he were already the administrator of her estate. He wrote me an email stating that he was going to be paying all of her bills until an estate account had been established. My moms will named her two sisters as executors. I notified them that I had filed the will and it took them over two months to file their petitions. During that time I was still under the impression that my mother's bills were being paid by my brother. My aunt's decided to use the same lawyer as my brother and they refuse to communicate with me and so I decided to contest the will and object to them being executors.

In the meanwhile, as we wait for our next court date to approach, my mom's car was repossessed. As you can imagine, I was shocked when I heard it had been repo'd, since my brother told me he was paying her car bill. I cannot see the bills because my brother apparently stopped the mail, or at least I thought. I called the financial institution that held her loan and they wouldn't give me any info. Since I know the email and passwords to some of my moms accounts I was able to get into her account for her loan. I still was unable to see anything regarding the loan. The only part of her account I was able to see was her billing information. I had noticed that someone had changed the billing address on her account. I looked up the account and sure enough the statements for the car loan were being mailed to my brother's lawyer's office.

Here's my question..... since there is no administrator or executor appointed at this point in time, is it ethical for the lawyer to have his office as the billing address on my mom's account? He is not representing the estate. He is representing my brother, an heir and my aunts as the proposed executors. Does the fact that their lawyer's address is on the account make him liable for the car? Is anyone liable for the car, at this point? Had I had access to the statements, I probably would've paid off the loan since there was only a small amount left. The car got repo'd and now I must chalk it up as a loss, even though I had no control over it.
Let's set aside the illegality and ethical concerns about you accessing her account without permission...

It sounds to me like the attorney may well be acting on behalf of the estate. Can you explain why you are contesting the will? You don't seem to have any grounds to do so...
 

quincy

Senior Member
I agree with Zigner that your post raises several questions that need answering before it can be determined if a lawyer acted unethically. I am not seeing it from what you have posted so far ... and I, too, have concerns about your seemingly unauthorized access to your mother's accounts.

Could you offer some explanations please? Thanks.
 

ShadyBrother

Junior Member
I'm not really sure what your question is. The attorney is NOT acting on behalf of the estate because the will has not even entered probate as of yet. My lawyer filed an objection based on the grounds that there is a conflict of interest in their representation. The lawyer represented my brother in his improper filing for letters of administration. My brother was aware that my mom had a will, (we have text messages to prove so) yet he signed an affidavit that said he did a diligent search for a will and determined that no will existed. Then in the same case, he is representing my aunts who are the proposed executors. I assume it's a valid objection since their attorney motioned to have it thrown out and the courts denied him and kept my objection. (Sorry if I am not using the proper terminology here). As of right now there is no one appointed as administrator/executor of the estate, because I filed the objection to my aunts being appointed as executors. Therefore all accounts, etc are frozen. My brother wrote an email stating that he was paying the bills for the estate (laying out the money in hopes of being reimbursed once probate begins). He wasn't obligated to do so. No one is because the will hasn't entered probate as of yet. Hope this answers your questions
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
I'm not really sure what your question is. The attorney is NOT acting on behalf of the estate because the will has not even entered probate as of yet. My lawyer filed an objection based on the grounds that there is a conflict of interest in their representation. The lawyer represented my brother in his improper filing for letters of administration. My brother was aware that my mom had a will, (we have text messages to prove so) yet he signed an affidavit that said he did a diligent search for a will and determined that no will existed. Then in the same case, he is representing my aunts who are the proposed executors. I assume it's a valid objection since their attorney motioned to have it thrown out and the courts denied him and kept my objection. (Sorry if I am not using the proper terminology here). As of right now there is no one appointed as administrator/executor of the estate, because I filed the objection to my aunts being appointed as executors. Therefore all accounts, etc are frozen. My brother wrote an email stating that he was paying the bills for the estate (laying out the money in hopes of being reimbursed once probate begins). He wasn't obligated to do so. No one is because the will hasn't entered probate as of yet. Hope this answers your questions
Please keep your posts in your original thread from January. Thank you.
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
I'm not really sure what your question is. The attorney is NOT acting on behalf of the estate because the will has not even entered probate as of yet. My lawyer filed an objection based on the grounds that there is a conflict of interest in their representation. The lawyer represented my brother in his improper filing for letters of administration. My brother was aware that my mom had a will, (we have text messages to prove so) yet he signed an affidavit that said he did a diligent search for a will and determined that no will existed. Then in the same case, he is representing my aunts who are the proposed executors. I assume it's a valid objection since their attorney motioned to have it thrown out and the courts denied him and kept my objection. (Sorry if I am not using the proper terminology here). As of right now there is no one appointed as administrator/executor of the estate, because I filed the objection to my aunts being appointed as executors. Therefore all accounts, etc are frozen. My brother wrote an email stating that he was paying the bills for the estate (laying out the money in hopes of being reimbursed once probate begins). He wasn't obligated to do so. No one is because the will hasn't entered probate as of yet. Hope this answers your questions
If you filed the will with the probate court, then probate has been opened. How was he supposed to find a will that was being kept in an attorney's office and thus their confidential files?
 

quincy

Senior Member
I'm not really sure what your question is. The attorney is NOT acting on behalf of the estate because the will has not even entered probate as of yet. My lawyer filed an objection based on the grounds that there is a conflict of interest in their representation. The lawyer represented my brother in his improper filing for letters of administration. My brother was aware that my mom had a will, (we have text messages to prove so) yet he signed an affidavit that said he did a diligent search for a will and determined that no will existed. Then in the same case, he is representing my aunts who are the proposed executors. I assume it's a valid objection since their attorney motioned to have it thrown out and the courts denied him and kept my objection. (Sorry if I am not using the proper terminology here). As of right now there is no one appointed as administrator/executor of the estate, because I filed the objection to my aunts being appointed as executors. Therefore all accounts, etc are frozen. My brother wrote an email stating that he was paying the bills for the estate (laying out the money in hopes of being reimbursed once probate begins). He wasn't obligated to do so. No one is because the will hasn't entered probate as of yet. Hope this answers your questions
If you have your own lawyer, it would be smart to address your concerns to him. Your attorney has available to him necessary information that we do not have.

I cannot tell from what you have posted, though, if your brother's attorney has acted unethically.
 

ShadyBrother

Junior Member
I should add, my personal reasons for my objection differ from my legal objection. I fear my brother and my aunts are going to make decisions with my mom's personal property that will be more beneficial towards my brother than me. For instance, they plan on having an estate sale, which I know my mother wouldn't want us to do and dividing up the profit from that. I would like to personally go through her home (with my brother) and divide up her belongings that way. My brother and I have been estranged for three years now and he refuses to speak to me. He was also semi estranged from my mother over the past three years too. He and his wife wanted control over the estate once my mom passed. My aunts (the proposed executors) told them they could go in the house and take whatever they wanted and they did so without discussing with or informing me. They had no authority to do so as they hadn't yet been appointed as executors and the will hasn't entered probate yet. Due to that, I do not trust that my aunts are acting in the best interest of me or the estate. (This part was also included in my affidavit for my objection).
 

quincy

Senior Member
I should add, my personal reasons for my objection differ from my legal objection. I fear my brother and my aunts are going to make decisions with my mom's personal property that will be more beneficial towards my brother than me. For instance, they plan on having an estate sale, which I know my mother wouldn't want us to do and dividing up the profit from that. I would like to personally go through her home (with my brother) and divide up her belongings that way. My brother and I have been estranged for three years now and he refuses to speak to me. He was also semi estranged from my mother over the past three years too. He and his wife wanted control over the estate once my mom passed. My aunts (the proposed executors) told them they could go in the house and take whatever they wanted and they did so without discussing with or informing me. They had no authority to do so as they hadn't yet been appointed as executors and the will hasn't entered probate yet. Due to that, I do not trust that my aunts are acting in the best interest of me or the estate. (This part was also included in my affidavit for my objection).
Again, if you have an attorney, your concerns should be addressed by him.
 

ShadyBrother

Junior Member
If you filed the will with the probate court, then probate has been opened. How was he supposed to find a will that was being kept in an attorney's office and thus their confidential files?
Ummmm the same way I did! He had copies of the will. He and his wife went into my mother's home while she was in the hospital dying, without her permission and took copies of all her paperwork. I wrote to the lawyer who wrote the will and asked if he could send it to me....he did. It was that simple. The will has not entered probate yet. Filing the will and entering it for probate are two separate things. I don't know what legal experience you have but it seems you don't understand how wills and probate work.
 

CTU

Meddlesome Priestess
I'm curious why you would be giving advice on a legal forum. If you don't understand probate law, then just say that. It's fine.
And I'm curious why you're here at all ... given that you have an attorney. You don't understand that, either?
 

quincy

Senior Member
I'm curious why you would be giving advice on a legal forum. If you don't understand probate law, then just say that. It's fine.
We don't second guess a poster's own attorney. It is not a matter of not knowing the law but in not having the same facts available to us that are available to your attorney.

Rely on your attorney's advice. And please stick to the thread you have in the Probate section if you have additional questions. Thanks.
 
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