My friend got expelled for serving alcohol at his house.

[NattensMadrigal]

Chicago, Illinois

I attend a private Catholic high school in Chicago. Our school play was performed on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. After the Sunday performance a good friend of mine invited all the play people over to his house. He had two cases of beer there, and upon laying eyes on them, one student left angrily. On Monday this student told the dean that my friend had alcohol at his "party" (There were at most 15 people there--not a party in my opinion). My friend got expelled today (no further action was taken on the other kids beyond calling their parents). I don't see how the school has the right to punish a student for something that is not only done outside of school boundaries, but something for which he did not receive punishment by the real authorities. The rulebook states, "...any student judged by the Dean of Students and/or the Administration to be found selling, using or possessing alcohol, or illegal substances on the school grounds, or at school sponsored functions, or arriving at school under the influence of alcohol or drugs...is liable to imediate expulsion or other disciplinary measures..." The cops never got involved. The "party" never got busted (and for those who don't live in a city like mine, when real, large high school parties get broken up by the cops, they just tell everyone to go home. The only time I've seen them do otherwise is when some black kids were smoking joints in front). The administration told our class that they were being compassionate by not notifying the authorities. Would this even do anything? There is no proof, no police officer saw anything, all they have is the word of a few kids.

But my real question is, does the school have the right to do this? It is going beyond what is stated in the handbook. What can he do? A friend of mine got kicked out for doing acid outside of school, but she hired a lawyer and got back in. Though I don't talk to her anymore so I'm not sure how she did this. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[seniorjudge]

Chicago, Illinois

I attend a private Catholic high school in Chicago. Our school play was performed on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. After the Sunday performance a good friend of mine invited all the play people over to his house. He had two cases of beer there, and upon laying eyes on them, one student left angrily. On Monday this student told the dean that my friend had alcohol at his "party" (There were at most 15 people there--not a party in my opinion). My friend got expelled today (no further action was taken on the other kids beyond calling their parents). I don't see how the school has the right to punish a student for something that is not only done outside of school boundaries, but something for which he did not receive punishment by the real authorities. The rulebook states, "...any student judged by the Dean of Students and/or the Administration to be found selling, using or possessing alcohol, or illegal substances on the school grounds, or at school sponsored functions, or arriving at school under the influence of alcohol or drugs...is liable to imediate expulsion or other disciplinary measures..." The cops never got involved. The "party" never got busted (and for those who don't live in a city like mine, when real, large high school parties get broken up by the cops, they just tell everyone to go home. The only time I've seen them do otherwise is when some black kids were smoking joints in front). The administration told our class that they were being compassionate by not notifying the authorities. Would this even do anything? There is no proof, no police officer saw anything, all they have is the word of a few kids.

But my real question is, does the school have the right to do this? It is going beyond what is stated in the handbook. What can he do? A friend of mine got kicked out for doing acid outside of school, but she hired a lawyer and got back in. Though I don't talk to her anymore so I'm not sure how she did this. Any help would be appreciated.

Q: But my real question is, does the school have the right to do this?

A: Yes. "I attend a private Catholic high school...."

 

[NattensMadrigal]

So it can punish students for things not listed in the rulebook? Why even list the rules if when it comes down to it a student can be punished for anything as long as an administrator decides to do so?

I don't want to sound like an idiot just complaining about his high school, but many ridiculous suspensions and even expulsions have happened under the deanship (if that is a word) of our newest dean.

For example one kid was expelled last year because on the way to school he felt sick and took the train back home. The dean later called the kid's home and arranged a meeting with his parents. The kid was expelled. Later the parents appealed to the Principal, and he hadn't even heard of the expulsion. I went down to the office to turn in some forms and I heard the dean being yelled at by the principal ("You can't just go around kicking out whomever you want without consulting us first!"). The situation was corrected, but the kid was officially expelled for over a week.

Seniorjudge, would your answer be different if it was a public school, or a private non-religious school? My friend with the acid went to a private secular high school.

 

[stealth2]

A private school can pretty well do as it likes. Hope your friend likes public school. I'm sure his parents will appreciate the money they're saving.

 

[cbg]

The operative word here is "private" school. A private school is not obligated to accept any student they don't choose to, and can dismiss any student they wish for any reason that they wish.

A public school, since is is funded by tax dollars, has more restrictions on expulsions.

Your friend is out of luck. The school was within their rights to expell him, whether you think 15 people equals a party or not. The cops don't have to have been involved for them to take action. It is ILLEGAL for high school students to be drinking beer, whether the cops came or not.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Perhaps you should be asking the parents of the 15 students what they think about their children being provided alcohol without their knowledge? What do your parents think? When you get a MIP will you parents rub and pat you on the back and say, "Don't worry Sonny/Missy we'll hire the best attorney money can buy to get you off and send you to another private school, we have $5-10K to throw away He11 here's a 5th of Wild Turkey for you now, we'll be sure to have a keger for your next birthday party "

 

[NattensMadrigal]

Ok, I didn't know the extent of private schools' power when it comes to expulsion. Thanks.

cbg--The only person who thought that it was a party was the kid who told. I talked to the Dean and he even said that it didn't sound much like a party. Not that it matters.

Of course I know that underage drinking is illegal. I just don't see why the school was involved at all. I'm just used to hearing about kids whose schools found out that they did drugs or something outside school yet were powerless to expell them. I figured out that my friend with the acid went to a private boarding school, and was considered property of the state, so the school could not expell her.

rmet4nzkx--I don't appreciate the sarcasm. But to answer your question, of course the parents were pissed. I was not drinking (I have an "only at a party" policy because I'd like to avoid bad habits), but my parents are mildly pissed (In all likelihood they're wondering what I've done when I was with him in the past). I don't blame the parents for being pissed, but if they wanted to complain to someone I think they should have gone to the parents. The school shouldn't be blamed for this. No one at the party got punished at all by the school. And what is an MIP?

---

Anyway, earlier in the day my friend came in with his parents and appealed the school's decision. After school I had a long conversation with the dean yesterday and he said that I brought up some good points. I brought up the fact that a junior got caught last year smoking weed in the bathroom but was allowed to finish the year. He said that the biggest problem was that the parents were angry. Since he didn't have to call any other parents when that kid was caught smoking up, the school was not the target of any criticism. When the principal gathered our class together and explained everything he said that he would have let the incident go if no one knew but the people involved in the "party" and their parents, but the whole school was talking about and there was even a rumor about a keg being there. The principal said that he didn't want the school's name to appear in the paper. The dean told me that he know that at least half the class has probably drank before, but the school wasn't getting attacked for it.

My friend was accepted back into school early today. The dean told him that he knows that there was only a case, and "you and your friends have probably killed several cases", but the problem was that the parents were mad. So the school admitted that it was trying to protect its reputation, but it probably realized that its name could have appeared in the paper for another reason, because the little snitch was receiving some real abuse, and it wasn't stopping (it probably still won't, actually). The dean asked him why he even invited the snitch (he knew that the kid doesn't have any friends). My friend said that it would be an ass-hole move to invite everyone except for him. The dean told him to be more selective next time.

So that's that.

 

[cbg]

And I suppose you think that means you were right all along, huh?

Boy, do I get tired of listening to you little brats who knowingly break the law and then figure you have a right to skate with no consequences. I'd have a lot more respect for the school if they'd stuck to their guns, regardless of their reasoning.

 

[Happy Trails]

Ok, I didn't know the extent of private schools' power when it comes to expulsion. Thanks.

cbg--The only person who thought that it was a party was the kid who told. I talked to the Dean and he even said that it didn't sound much like a party. Not that it matters.

Of course I know that underage drinking is illegal. I just don't see why the school was involved at all. I'm just used to hearing about kids whose schools found out that they did drugs or something outside school yet were powerless to expell them. I figured out that my friend with the acid went to a private boarding school, and was considered property of the state, so the school could not expell her.

rmet4nzkx--I don't appreciate the sarcasm. But to answer your question, of course the parents were pissed. I was not drinking (I have an "only at a party" policy because I'd like to avoid bad habits), but my parents are mildly pissed (In all likelihood they're wondering what I've done when I was with him in the past). I don't blame the parents for being pissed, but if they wanted to complain to someone I think they should have gone to the parents. The school shouldn't be blamed for this. No one at the party got punished at all by the school. And what is an MIP?

---

Anyway, earlier in the day my friend came in with his parents and appealed the school's decision. After school I had a long conversation with the dean yesterday and he said that I brought up some good points. I brought up the fact that a junior got caught last year smoking weed in the bathroom but was allowed to finish the year. He said that the biggest problem was that the parents were angry. Since he didn't have to call any other parents when that kid was caught smoking up, the school was not the target of any criticism. When the principal gathered our class together and explained everything he said that he would have let the incident go if no one knew but the people involved in the "party" and their parents, but the whole school was talking about and there was even a rumor about a keg being there. The principal said that he didn't want the school's name to appear in the paper. The dean told me that he know that at least half the class has probably drank before, but the school wasn't getting attacked for it.

My friend was accepted back into school early today. The dean told him that he knows that there was only a case, and "you and your friends have probably killed several cases", but the problem was that the parents were mad. So the school admitted that it was trying to protect its reputation, but it probably realized that its name could have appeared in the paper for another reason, because the little snitch was receiving some real abuse, and it wasn't stopping (it probably still won't, actually). The dean asked him why he even invited the snitch (he knew that the kid doesn't have any friends). My friend said that it would be an ass-hole move to invite everyone except for him. The dean told him to be more selective next time.

So that's that.

A MIP is a "minor in possession". Read some other posts running a search for it. The posts are about other teens that have been charged with a MIP just for being at a party even though they weren't drinking.

I didn't see any thing sarcastic in Rmetx post, just a heads up. (Well maybe a little sarcastic in the last sentence.)

All I see is a bunch of kids that are pi$$ing and moaning, maybe they should cut back on the beer.

 

[NattensMadrigal]

And I suppose you think that means you were right all along, huh?

Boy, do I get tired of listening to you little brats who knowingly break the law and then figure you have a right to skate with no consequences. I'd have a lot more respect for the school if they'd stuck to their guns, regardless of their reasoning.

Nowhere did I say that I think what he was doing was legal, or even right morally. If the cops were involved, I would have no objections at all. The involvement of the authorities would justify the involvement of the school in my eyes, but the lack thereof made me ask why the school was involved at all. I would have no objection to legal action if the cops did somehow find out, and break up this "party". And if that happened I couldn't argue with any punishment the school dealt.

Your judgement of my character based on my description of this one event is highly appreciated, however. I thirst for your precious insight and can only hope and pray that you may let me share more in your treasure trove of priceless knowledge.

 

[CdwJava]

Many religious based schools (Catholic and otherwise) have morals clauses that they often cite to expel students who commit "immoral" acts even away from campus. They have a great deal of latitude in admissions and expulsions. So simply having the activity (an illegal activity) brought to the attention of the administration could be sufficient for them to act on it.

And your friend should consider himself real lucky. The existence of previously lesser punishments does not make the current punishment wrong. I hope he sees this as his second chance to turn things around before he tries it again and something bad DOES happen.

- Carl

 

[NattensMadrigal]

Oh, trust me, he's definitely grateful that he was let back in.

I only mentioned the lesser punishments to show that there was more behind the school's action than getting rid of "bad seeds". A sophomore was found this year with a bottle of rum in his bag and all he got was five detentions. But no parents knew about this so it was okay. I would expect that the punishment would be more lenient for seniors months away from graduating, but I suppose the school's desire to remain spotless in the eyes of the parents takes priority.

 

[seniorjudge]

Oh, trust me, he's definitely grateful that he was let back in.

I only mentioned the lesser punishments to show that there was more behind the school's action than getting rid of "bad seeds". A sophomore was found this year with a bottle of rum in his bag and all he got was five detentions. But no parents knew about this so it was okay. I would expect that the punishment would be more lenient for seniors months away from graduating, but I suppose the school's desire to remain spotless in the eyes of the parents takes priority.

You are literate and articulate. Your posts are a pleasure to read (even if I may not agree with them).

 

[cbg]

So it's okay with you for him to have to take responsibility for his actions, as long as the cops are involved? But if they aren't, the school should just allow him to violate the law and take no action of their own?

My opinion stands.

 

[ENASNI]

You are literate and articulate. Your posts are a pleasure to read (even if I may not agree with them).

You are reading my mind again Judge