not handing over kids

[longsally111]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? South Carolina

I wrote an earlier thread about my friends divorce to a drug addicted woman. He won custody of their 2 year old, the house and the one car with no payment. He also won visitation with her 8 year old son that he did not adopt due to her unstable behavior. So,...now onto the question:

She broke the court order by taking everything in the house even though she was ordered not to take anything but her clothes and her sons personal things. She broke the court order tonight by not allowing visitation with the little boy. She refused to hand him over. My friend called the cops who said that they could not get involved and would not write a report but there would be an internal report when it was needed for court. My friend now states that he will not allow his ex to pick up their 2 year old for visitation, stating that he is afraid that since she keeps breaking court orders, she will not return the little girl. I told him that I thought it was a bad idea to violate the order. Any thoughts?

 

[mistoffolees]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? South Carolina

I wrote an earlier thread about my friends divorce to a drug addicted woman. He won custody of their 2 year old, the house and the one car with no payment. He also won visitation with her 8 year old son that he did not adopt due to her unstable behavior. So,...now onto the question:

She broke the court order by taking everything in the house even though she was ordered not to take anything but her clothes and her sons personal things. She broke the court order tonight by not allowing visitation with the little boy. She refused to hand him over. My friend called the cops who said that they could not get involved and would not write a report but there would be an internal report when it was needed for court. My friend now states that he will not allow his ex to pick up their 2 year old for visitation, stating that he is afraid that since she keeps breaking court orders, she will not return the little girl. I told him that I thought it was a bad idea to violate the order. Any thoughts?

You can't decide which court orders to follow - even if the other person violates some orders.

Your friend should be posting here himself. Who has custody and what does the visitation order say?

If he has custody and he's concerned about her giving the kids back, he should file a complaint asking for supervised visitation on her part. However, that's not likely to happen if she only gave him a hard time once (she obviously gave the child back since he later tried to keep her from having the child).

Oh, and they both need to grow up.

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? South Carolina

I wrote an earlier thread about my friends divorce to a drug addicted woman. He won custody of their 2 year old, the house and the one car with no payment. He also won visitation with her 8 year old son that he did not adopt due to her unstable behavior. So,...now onto the question:

She broke the court order by taking everything in the house even though she was ordered not to take anything but her clothes and her sons personal things. She broke the court order tonight by not allowing visitation with the little boy. She refused to hand him over. My friend called the cops who said that they could not get involved and would not write a report but there would be an internal report when it was needed for court. My friend now states that he will not allow his ex to pick up their 2 year old for visitation, stating that he is afraid that since she keeps breaking court orders, she will not return the little girl. I told him that I thought it was a bad idea to violate the order. Any thoughts?

If he breaks the court order by refusing to honor the visitation arrangements for their joint child, then he loses all credibility in trying to hold her in contempt for denying his court ordered visitation with HER child.

I am also not sure that the visitation with her child is enforceable.

 

[longsally111]

Mistoffolees, the court order states that he has physical custody of the baby and she gets every other weekend from Friday 6pm until Sunday 6pm. It also states that he gets the boy on the alternate weekends from Friday 6pm until Sunday 6pm.

ldij, I totally agree with your point of view. He shouldnt go so low, it looks bad on her in courtm not him. He is going to write his attorney Monday and ask for supervised visitation as she has broken 3 things the judge ordered by letter and by spirit and he is concerned about her driving with the baby while under the influence of these medications.

 

[mistoffolees]

Mistoffolees, the court order states that he has physical custody of the baby and she gets every other weekend from Friday 6pm until Sunday 6pm. It also states that he gets the boy on the alternate weekends from Friday 6pm until Sunday 6pm.

ldij, I totally agree with your point of view. He shouldnt go so low, it looks bad on her in courtm not him. He is going to write his attorney Monday and ask for supervised visitation as she has broken 3 things the judge ordered by letter and by spirit and he is concerned about her driving with the baby while under the influence of these medications.

If his court order is that specific (6 pm Sunday), then it is readily enforceable. However, it then becomes an issue of whether it's worthwhile. If she kept the baby until only 7 pm one time, forget it - he'll just look foolish. How late did she keep the child and how often?

As for 'broken 3 things ... by spirit', forget about the spirit. It is the letter of the agreement that is enforceable. An agreement doesn't really have a 'spirit'. If she is violating the judge's intent, that's a different matter, but he can't enforce intent. All he can do is go back to court to ask for clarification. But unless it's a serious matter, it's probably not worth pursuing.

The 'operating while medicated' is a different issue. If he has evidence that the mother is doing something which is unsafe, he should call CPS immediately. Do not wait for a court hearing. However, he'd better have a pretty good case.

If she is taking a medication which specifically states that you CAN NOT (not 'should not') drive while taking it, then he can then ask for a court order to keep her from driving. But his personal concern that there is some risk won't hold water. If it did, no one would be driving children any more. Go to your medicine chest and start reading labels at random. An overwhelming number of medications give warnings about driving or operating heavy machinery. In most cases, that's lawyer-speak for 'we're going to warn you of every possible scenario so you can't sue us'. Simply saying 'she's taking a medication which has the potential to impair her driving' is insufficient unless you want the courts to prevent anyone from ever taking antihistamines and then driving, driving with too little sleep, or having a single glass of wine with dinner. The courts can't address every single fear someone might have - nor should they.

 

[LdiJ]

I just went back and reviewed your previous thread...and now I am going to claim BS on you.

You made this statement:

Judge DID award him every other weekend with the little boy but he is taking a pass as his mother has the child saying all kinds of things to people and he is afraid the boy might start making false allegations against him and he wont take that chance.

I think dad is playing games, and you are helping him.

 

[longsally111]

No, not playing games. here is the exact wording of the court order.....Custody of XXXXX shall remain with the mother. The step-father shall have alternating weekend visitation from Friday 6pm until Sunday 6pm. Tha fathers visitation shall begin February 13, 2009.

His first chance for visitation, he changed his mind and decided to do it, hoping that once the child was here, away from his mother, he could see reason. Then the mothers grandfather died and she ( the ex) requested that the boy stay for the funeral which was on Thursday night and grieve with the out of town family for the weekend. His attorney told him that he could enforce visitation but it would make his seem like an ass so......

This time, he spoke with his ex by phone the day before and was told where to go to get him. They drove 2 1/2 hours, arrived early and called and the father in law answered and told them to come early. They arrived and were told that they could not have him. The police came and they stated they could not enforce the order. They left without him.

My friend now has written to his attorney asking him to go to the judge asking for supervised visitation as 1. she had another car accident ( 2nd in 8 months) and he was already paying high premiums due to her previous dui, 2. she did not let him have visitation 3. she calls him up to 18 times a day harassing him 4. she threatened the last visitation not to bring the child back.

In the mean time, he does not want her to pick up the child on Friday. I told him that until he went to the judge, he cannot cut off visitation and she is in contempy of court. He doesnt need the trouble.

 

[mistoffolees]

OK. By your story, she refused visitation twice - once for a family member's funeral and once for some other reason.

Unless you were a party to the conversation, you don't know what really transpired. Nor do you know if it was really as he stated. Nor do you know if she had some reason for not letting the child go with him.

HE should be posting here, not you. Your best bet is to stay out of it since it doesn't concern you.

It's unlikely that a judge is going to make much of an issue based on the facts above. She can say "he had alcohol on his breath and I didn't think it was safe to let the kids go with him" or something like that. Even without such a statement, it's just not a big enough issue for a judge to come down hard on her.

If he doesn't like her phone calls, he doesn't have to answer. Or he's free to hang up. He is also free to ignore her threats. Threatening to keep the kids doesn't mean anything legally.

As for the rest, he'd better be careful. Alleging that she's abusing drugs because she had 2 car accidents probably rises to the level of slander.

 

[longsally111]

well, alledging aside, she took a drug test for the court which showed the morphine, klonopin and Lortab's she is on. That isnt slander if it is true. He called his attorney on Monday and told him what happenned. The attorney contacted her attorney who didnt even know she didnt hand the boy over!!!!! He is no longer answering the phone and has decided not to be nice anymore since she is using her son as a "weapon" and the phone visitation is not court ordered.

 

[LdiJ]

well, alledging aside, she took a drug test for the court which showed the morphine, klonopin and Lortab's she is on. That isnt slander if it is true. He called his attorney on Monday and told him what happenned. The attorney contacted her attorney who didnt even know she didnt hand the boy over!!!!! He is no longer answering the phone and has decided not to be nice anymore since she is using her son as a "weapon" and the phone visitation is not court ordered.

Like I said, he is going to destroy his own credibility with the court if he keeps this up.

 

[longsally111]

forgot to mention that she was charged with contempt of court for not handing over the son for his visitation. Phone calls were NOT court ordered. He was doing it to be nice, as well as paying her car insurance for her and her last car payment for her ( she wont get a job). He has decided not to be just Mr. nice anymore.

 

[Ohiogal]

forgot to mention that she was charged with contempt of court for not handing over the son for his visitation. Phone calls were NOT court ordered. He was doing it to be nice, as well as paying her car insurance for her and her last car payment for her ( she wont get a job). He has decided not to be just Mr. nice anymore.

Allowing phone calls is FACILITATING the relationship. And being charged with contempt of court does NOT mean she will be found guilty. I agree with LD. He is playing with fire.

 

[mistoffolees]

Phone calls were NOT court ordered. He was doing it to be nice,

"Well, Your Honor, since you didn't order me to talk with my children, I stopped doing it when my ex was mean to me".

Great way to show the court how much you care for your kids.

 

[LdiJ]

"Well, Your Honor, since you didn't order me to talk with my children, I stopped doing it when my ex was mean to me".

Great way to show the court how much you care for your kids.

Actually Misto, its the other way around. "Your Honor, since you didn't order me to allow her to talk to our child (the one in his custody), I stopped allowing her to talk to the child because my ex was mean to me."

 

[mistoffolees]

Actually Misto, its the other way around. "Your Honor, since you didn't order me to allow her to talk to our child (the one in his custody), I stopped allowing her to talk to the child because my ex was mean to me."

You're right - although it could work both ways if the kids tried to call him - since he wasn't answering the phone, they wouldn't be able to reach him, either.