not responding to a motion to modify custody

[trnoon]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? michigan


I am actually asking this for a coworker who works in the shop and doesn't have access to a computer like I do. I know you guys don't normally like when someone posts for someone else, but he had asked me to look up information for him and I thought this might be a good place to get him some advice. I can speak to him during the day, so if there are any questions that need answering, I should be able to get that information. But I think he's mostly just looking for a general outcome or what might be kind of thing...


He filed a motion to change custody. His ex wife moved not too long ago and he was never given her new address. (they do pick up/drop offs at a gas station halfway between their houses) So he just used her last known address thinking it would get forwarded. He just got the papers back with the court date. FOC corrected the address he put down (I guess he wrote it wrong) to what must be the address they have for her.

The court date they have is not a hearing. I am guessing its more of a mediation type of deal. His papers say "meeting". It says that the other party (his ex wife) has 21 days to respond.

He thinks that if the papers did not get forwarded to her new address she wouldn't respond or show up to the "meeting". I think, if shes doesn't show, they will just reschedule. He thinks he will be granted what he is asking for.

What happens if she doesn't respond or show up?

 

[Zigner]

There are WAY too many variables here. The actual person involved really should log on.

ETA: With a copy of his paperwork in-hand.

 

[trnoon]

There are WAY too many variables here. The actual person involved really should log on.

ETA: With a copy of his paperwork in-hand.

Yeah I know. But he can't now. I don't even think he has internet service at home. He definitely doesn't have a smartphone or internet on a cell phone. I'm just trying to get him some help. I figured I'd get torn apart for even asking.

 

[Zigner]

Yeah I know. But he can't now. I don't even think he has internet service at home. He definitely doesn't have a smartphone or internet on a cell phone. I'm just trying to get him some help. I figured I'd get torn apart for even asking.

I'm not tearing you apart. It's just that this type of situation is exactly why we don't like dealing with 3rd parties. There is simply no way you could have the information that would be needed to helpfully advise.

 

[trnoon]

I'm not tearing you apart. It's just that this type of situation is exactly why we don't like dealing with 3rd parties. There is simply no way you could have the information that would be needed to helpfully advise.

no no, i didnt mean you were. I just figured someone would come in here guns a blazing being all disrespectful.

I can get information from him. Thats not a problem. I know its really not the same. And I know a lot about his sitch as well. I'm in a similar situation as well and him and I talk about these things together all the time. Though, still, its not the same.

What are the variables that youre referring to?

 

[TheGeekess]

Yeah I know. But he can't now. I don't even think he has internet service at home. He definitely doesn't have a smartphone or internet on a cell phone. I'm just trying to get him some help. I figured I'd get torn apart for even asking.

There's these buildings that have books in them. And interweb access. They're called libraries.

 

[LdiJ]

no no, i didnt mean you were. I just figured someone would come in here guns a blazing being all disrespectful.

I can get information from him. Thats not a problem. I know its really not the same. And I know a lot about his sitch as well. I'm in a similar situation as well and him and I talk about these things together all the time. Though, still, its not the same.

What are the variables that youre referring to?

One example would be what kind of documentation is he going to provide to the court to prove that he served mom? Is he going to perjure himself?

 

[trnoon]

One example would be what kind of documentation is he going to provide to the court to prove that he served mom? Is he going to perjure himself?

what do you mean perjure himself? how would he do that?
he doesnt have to serve his ex. here the court mails out all the paper work. its already been sent to her by mail. not even certified mail.

 

[gam]

what do you mean perjure himself? how would he do that?
he doesnt have to serve his ex. here the court mails out all the paper work. its already been sent to her by mail. not even certified mail.

Is he in Bay County to? Did he file through the Circuit court, pay fees to file? Or did he go through FOC? A meeting with whom? If it was mediation it would say mediation. They only set up mediation in Mi, if both parties agree to it.

It sounds to me like he went through FOC, FOC will use the address they have on record for mom. If mom didn't change her address with FOC, that is mom's problem. Most likely this would be for a custody investigation, which is done with an investigator, who will try to come to the best interest of the child and try and stay within middle of the road, if that is best interest.

Since he filed a motion to change custody, they might give mom another chance if she don't show or respond. They can try calling her right then(I've seen them do that plenty of times), he needs to plan on them giving about 1-2 hours of wait time for mom to show. They can also try to locate another address on mom. They could also just go ahead and investigate dads side, and then try contacting mom another time. Investigators do not have to have these meetings with both parties at the same time.

A recommendation will be written by the investigator and sent to the Judge of the case. Both parties will be mailed a copy of that recommendation and both parties have x amount of time(usually 21 or 28 days) to file an objection to that recommendation and have a hearing either before a Ref or Judge.

So no your co-worker is not going to walk out of there getting what he wants right off the bat. As I said above it will be decided on best interest of the child/ren.

What is his change of circumstance for changing custody?

 

[trnoon]

Is he in Bay County to? Did he file through the Circuit court, pay fees to file? Or did he go through FOC? A meeting with whom? If it was mediation it would say mediation. They only set up mediation in Mi, if both parties agree to it.

It sounds to me like he went through FOC, FOC will use the address they have on record for mom. If mom didn't change her address with FOC, that is mom's problem. Most likely this would be for a custody investigation, which is done with an investigator, who will try to come to the best interest of the child and try and stay within middle of the road, if that is best interest.

Since he filed a motion to change custody, they might give mom another chance if she don't show or respond. They can try calling her right then(I've seen them do that plenty of times), he needs to plan on them giving about 1-2 hours of wait time for mom to show. They can also try to locate another address on mom. They could also just go ahead and investigate dads side, and then try contacting mom another time. Investigators do not have to have these meetings with both parties at the same time.

A recommendation will be written by the investigator and sent to the Judge of the case. Both parties will be mailed a copy of that recommendation and both parties have x amount of time(usually 21 or 28 days) to file an objection to that recommendation and have a hearing either before a Ref or Judge.

So no your co-worker is not going to walk out of there getting what he wants right off the bat. As I said above it will be decided on best interest of the child/ren.

What is his change of circumstance for changing custody?

His case is in Kent County. He filed through circuit court with $150 fee. It doesn't say who the meeting is with. I had assumed it would be a mediation type deal as well because thats the same kind of paper I had gotten when my mediation was scheduled. And my ex and did not both agree to mediation, but the court still took that route. I will pass this answer along to him. Thank you.

His change of circumstance is the ex's new job. She is working 2 jobs now and the girls are in school (summer school) during the day and go to an over night baby sitter after that. He works from 8 am to 4 pm which is pretty close to the hours the girls are in school and then he his home during the evenings to be with them. he wants them to be with him most nights instead of going to daycare at night. He and his ex do get along so he figured he would just offer to take them. But she flat out told him it wouldn't happen because she didn't want to lose the child support and end up having to pay him support.

 

[gam]

His case is in Kent County. He filed through circuit court with $150 fee. It doesn't say who the meeting is with. I had assumed it would be a mediation type deal as well because thats the same kind of paper I had gotten when my mediation was scheduled. And my ex and did not both agree to mediation, but the court still took that route. I will pass this answer along to him. Thank you.

His change of circumstance is the ex's new job. She is working 2 jobs now and the girls are in school (summer school) during the day and go to an over night baby sitter after that. He works from 8 am to 4 pm which is pretty close to the hours the girls are in school and then he his home during the evenings to be with them. he wants them to be with him most nights instead of going to daycare at night. He and his ex do get along so he figured he would just offer to take them. But she flat out told him it wouldn't happen because she didn't want to lose the child support and end up having to pay him support.

I forgot you moved. It's either going to be a hearing with a Ref or what they call joint meeting(form of mediation), FOC does the joint meetings. I'm basing that on him filing through Circuit Court and that mom has 21 days to respond. Regular mediation in Kent County would have to be agreed upon or ordered by the Judge and there would not be 21 days for mom to respond on this letter he got. Either way, a recommendation may come out of this on that day, depending on if mom shows, or how the court deals with her not showing. But he needs to know that then either party can object to this recommendation, so mom will still have a chance. If either party files an objection then a hearing with the Judge will be scheduled.

Does mom work 5 days a week on her day time job? Does mom work 5 nights a week on her night time job? If dad were to have custody, can he get them to the existing day time care mom already has them in? Is the night time care a private caretaker, like a relative or is it a facility? Why did mom take this 2nd job and is this a temp job or does she plan on keeping this job after summer? When was the last time child support was done? How long has mom been the custodial parent? I don't care if you get these answers, it would be best for dad himself to come here. But pass them on to dad, cause these are questions the court will ask, and he needs answers and arguments why changing to him would be better.

Kent does not seem to have a standard parenting time online, but I have seen many orders coming from that side of the state, where they actually switch custody for the summer. NCP has them during the summer, CP has the standard one weeknight and EOW with some vacation time. Custody goes back to CP during school year and NCP resumes back to the standard of EOW and one weeknight. So this is a possibility if they don't want to change custody, as that is very hard to get them to change custody.

Another possibility for dad would be to get FROR in the order, where if mom is gone x amount of hours, then dad has first shot at having the kids, but that also will happen on dads time if he can't be with the kids for those x amount of hours. That side of the state likes this to.

Either of these mom will argue with as they can have an impact on child support. Dad also has to prepare that mom will quit this 2nd job.

 

[trnoon]

I forgot you moved. It's either going to be a hearing with a Ref or what they call joint meeting(form of mediation), FOC does the joint meetings. I'm basing that on him filing through Circuit Court and that mom has 21 days to respond. Regular mediation in Kent County would have to be agreed upon or ordered by the Judge and there would not be 21 days for mom to respond on this letter he got. Either way, a recommendation may come out of this on that day, depending on if mom shows, or how the court deals with her not showing. But he needs to know that then either party can object to this recommendation, so mom will still have a chance. If either party files an objection then a hearing with the Judge will be scheduled.

Does mom work 5 days a week on her day time job? Does mom work 5 nights a week on her night time job? If dad were to have custody, can he get them to the existing day time care mom already has them in? Is the night time care a private caretaker, like a relative or is it a facility? Why did mom take this 2nd job and is this a temp job or does she plan on keeping this job after summer? When was the last time child support was done? How long has mom been the custodial parent? I don't care if you get these answers, it would be best for dad himself to come here. But pass them on to dad, cause these are questions the court will ask, and he needs answers and arguments why changing to him would be better.

Kent does not seem to have a standard parenting time online, but I have seen many orders coming from that side of the state, where they actually switch custody for the summer. NCP has them during the summer, CP has the standard one weeknight and EOW with some vacation time. Custody goes back to CP during school year and NCP resumes back to the standard of EOW and one weeknight. So this is a possibility if they don't want to change custody, as that is very hard to get them to change custody.

Another possibility for dad would be to get FROR in the order, where if mom is gone x amount of hours, then dad has first shot at having the kids, but that also will happen on dads time if he can't be with the kids for those x amount of hours. That side of the state likes this to.

Either of these mom will argue with as they can have an impact on child support. Dad also has to prepare that mom will quit this 2nd job.

Ok, thats a long response. I am on the phone with the friend right now. This is his response:

The paper he got in the mail is a Notice to Appear. The date is Sept 5th. So summer will be over by the time they get to court.
"A meeting on the Motion Regarding Custody will be held on Thursday, September 5, 2013 at 10:00 am at the Kent County Friend of the Court office, before (name), Child Custody Investigator.
"The respondent should complete the enclosed Response to Motion Regarding Custody and return it to this office seven days prior to the meeting.
"Bring with you copies of your last two pay stubs and your income tax return for the past year, as it may be necessary to review support."

So that 21 days to respond isn't applicable yet..

His ex works 5 days a week 40 hours, Monday thru Friday at her day job. She gets out of work at 5, goes home, takes the girls to their great grandmothers, goes home and sleeps until 10, goes to the second job at 11, works till 2 or 3, goes home and sleeps until 6 when she wakes up to go get the girls, drive them to school and go to her day job. The night job she got is long term. she may even eventually quit her day job. its something he says she has always dreamed of doing. he doesn't want to disclose the profession online because it may shed a dimmer light on the mother of his children. she gets two night off a week but never on a weekend.
If my buddy were to have custody, he would have his wife get the girls off to school in the morning and she would be there when they got home. (he lives in the same school district as mom and the girls would take the bus) so they would not have to switch schools. he would get home about the same time the girls got off the bus, maybe a little after.
The night time care is his ex's grandmother. he says shes a very sweet woman, but she is so medicated she hardly knows whats up anymore. it would seem more logical if she went to the moms home to watch the girls at night, but the girls are going to her one bedroom apartment and sleeping on the floor in the living room. its a lot of unnecessary stuff just to keep from having to pay him child support.

She has saturday and sunday DAYS off of work, she could have the girls every weekend she wanted. and keep them over night the two nights a week she is off of the night job.

 

[gam]

Ok, thats a long response. I am on the phone with the friend right now. This is his response:

The paper he got in the mail is a Notice to Appear. The date is Sept 5th. So summer will be over by the time they get to court.
"A meeting on the Motion Regarding Custody will be held on Thursday, September 5, 2013 at 10:00 am at the Kent County Friend of the Court office, before (name), Child Custody Investigator.
"The respondent should complete the enclosed Response to Motion Regarding Custody and return it to this office seven days prior to the meeting.
"Bring with you copies of your last two pay stubs and your income tax return for the past year, as it may be necessary to review support."

So that 21 days to respond isn't applicable yet..

His ex works 5 days a week 40 hours, Monday thru Friday at her day job. She gets out of work at 5, goes home, takes the girls to their great grandmothers, goes home and sleeps until 10, goes to the second job at 11, works till 2 or 3, goes home and sleeps until 6 when she wakes up to go get the girls, drive them to school and go to her day job. The night job she got is long term. she may even eventually quit her day job. its something he says she has always dreamed of doing. he doesn't want to disclose the profession online because it may shed a dimmer light on the mother of his children. she gets two night off a week but never on a weekend.
If my buddy were to have custody, he would have his wife get the girls off to school in the morning and she would be there when they got home. (he lives in the same school district as mom and the girls would take the bus) so they would not have to switch schools. he would get home about the same time the girls got off the bus, maybe a little after.
The night time care is his ex's grandmother. he says shes a very sweet woman, but she is so medicated she hardly knows whats up anymore. it would seem more logical if she went to the moms home to watch the girls at night, but the girls are going to her one bedroom apartment and sleeping on the floor in the living room. its a lot of unnecessary stuff just to keep from having to pay him child support.

She has saturday and sunday DAYS off of work, she could have the girls every weekend she wanted. and keep them over night the two nights a week she is off of the night job.

See this is why one should post themselves as they have the correct info. So it's a custody evaluation. Some occur with both parents at the same time and some occur with only parent and the other parent goes at a different time. Time frame is about right for this to occur, the courts don't have many evaluators so it takes time. The evaluator can(it's up to the particular evaluator)treat this similar to mediation and try to come to a middle ground. He needs to fill those forms out and get them there prior, but he should make himself copies and take those copies with him, as often they never seem to arrive to the investigator prior. The investigator has x amount of time after the evaluation to send a recommendation to the Judge. Either party will have an opportunity to object to that recommendation, he will need to pay attention to that time frame(it varies in different courts in Mi). If neither party objects, often a party will have to file to have that recommendation become the judgment, some courts will automatically do this after the objection period is over, so he needs to check and see how his court will do this. The investigator should be able to tell him at the meeting. Both parties can agree to the recommendation at the time of the meeting and sign that recommendation, it will be sent signed to the Judge. But again some courts then will have the Judge sign off on it after the objection period is over or a party will have to file to have the recommendation entered as a Judgment order.

Some Judges will always take these recommendations as the decision, while others will not. Often worth the time of objecting to see how the Judge feels about the facts of the case and try to change their mind on the recommendation.

He has a change in circumstance, but no one can predict if it is enough. One thing that may be a problem, is mom is having a relative watch the child, part of dad having custody is going to have dad having a 3rd party watch the child(his wife). They can see this as why should custody be changed cause mom has a 3rd party watching the child and so will dad. So he needs to prepare good arguments on why there is a difference. A solution might be for dad to offer mom to pick up the children from his house in the morning after her work and she get them off to school, just like she does picking them up from grandma's house. It gives mom and kids extra time together, it avoids a 3rd party.

He needs to write out his parenting plan on paper if custody should change and take that with him to the investigation hearing. It's a good plan, except the noted problem above with the 3rd party getting the child off to school, when mom can do this still. The after school is not a huge deal, as dad comes home close to when the children get off the bus and mom is not available at that time anyways. It gives her weekly overnights and weekend overnights with her time off of her work schedule. Moms nighttime job may be well worth letting the investigator know. As I said before, plan on mom possibly losing one of these jobs by the time the investigation hearing takes place. If she keeps that night job, well dad still has a good case, but if she is available for the days, dad needs to plan that out in another parenting plan, that would for sure give mom those mornings and possible time after school and early evening, then taking back to dads for overnight. If mom quits that night job, I don't see dad getting custody changed.

Since the investigation letter refers to child support, like I said earlier plan on them looking into that. Perhaps if child support was done current, mom would not have the need for 2 jobs. Even if custody were to change, child support would be redone, and there is a chance that mom would not pay anything to dad in child support. Because mom would be having a lot of overnights still and income really would matter here to. If dad makes more then mom, he could still pay mom child support and have the children for these overnights while mom is working. Have dad read the Mi child support manual, it will give him the formula and all the factors they use in the formula. It can be found online and printed out for dad or dad could go get this from the library or possible that FOC could provide a copy of it.