Off the clock training

[milk man]

What is the name of your state? Kansas

I'm employed as a HVAC service mechanic. I've passed the certification requirements and hold a Master Mechanic license. A Journeyman's license or higher is required to install equipment in the areas that I work. I was a Master when I was hired and required to maintain my license.

Kansas now requires 12 hours of continuing education every two years to maintain my license.

I have always believed in continuing education and have willingly attended many after hours classes with no pay. Many of these classes have had nominal fees, usually to cover meals which have always been paid by my employers.

I've been paid for every class I've attended during regular business hours. (For continuing education and non continuing education)

Here are my questions, so I can guide younger techs that don't see the personal value of staying current with continually changing technology. Many classes are given after hours.

Should continuing education classes weather during business or after hours be compensated for a license holder? (Remembering that I'm required to maintain at least a Journeyman's License)

Should "non mandatory" (Dealer's Training) classes (not for continuing education) after hours be compensated. (Everyone is invited)?

 

[pylgrym]

Lisenced Journeyman HVAC Guy.....

... you should be in a union, yes? Here in Atlanta at GA Tech, I have just been raised to $16 + change, effective Jan. 2008 - and I get paid on the job to take classes and am reimbursed for off-campus classed in my HVAC field in the STRAP program... maybe you should come down here...?? See:
'
http://www.orgdev.gatech.edu/tuition/?page=faq
'
Too, the only lisence we need is USEPA refrigerant recovery. RSES course. Hope this helps?
'
paul

 

[pattytx]

Forget whether or not a union is preferable.

The law provides an exception for training that is required by a state licensing agency to legally do your job, in that it does NOT need to be considered as "work time". Hence, it's not compensable by law.

 

[milk man]

Forget whether or not a union is preferable.

The law provides an exception for training that is required by a state licensing agency to legally do your job, in that it does NOT need to be considered as "work time". Hence, it's not compensable by law.

Good. My employer goes beyond what he is required to do. He pays his license holders to attend the mandatory continuing education classes.

I've always seen value in attending Dealer Training classes. I actually look forward to them. But what I hear from the younger (fresh techs) are complaints for not being paid for these classes. These are the guys that do not hold licenses and are not required by law to attend continuing ed classes.

Lets talk about solely Dealer Training. (Not continuing education)

A flyer is posted in the office listing the class and date. If a guy wants to attend that class he signs up and the nominal fee is paid to the distributor. Some guys feel pressure to attend these classes even though they are not mandatory. If a non license holder attends a class should he be paid?

 

[milk man]

I would also like to talk about a certain instance with an employer I was with only a short time. Bad move on my part to join his company.

Dealer training was set for half an hour earlier than our normal start time, and we where required to report to the shop that morning. It was a company required training session.

Should that have been paid? BTW, it was the way the company ordered us to the meeting the chapped my behind.

 

[ecmst12]

If it's company-required training, it should be considered "time worked". If the class is optional, it would not have to be considered time worked.

 

[milk man]

... you should be in a union, yes? Here in Atlanta at GA Tech, I have just been raised to $16 + change, effective Jan. 2008 - and I get paid on the job to take classes and am reimbursed for off-campus classed in my HVAC field in the STRAP program... maybe you should come down here...?? See:
'
http://www.orgdev.gatech.edu/tuition/?page=faq
'
Too, the only lisence we need is USEPA refrigerant recovery. RSES course. Hope this helps?
'
paul

What year are you? There are several people in the Union that attend these continuing ed classes. I don't think the municipalities substitute Union training for licenses in this area.

 

[milk man]

If it's company-required training, it should be considered "time worked". If the class is optional, it would not have to be considered time worked.

Thanks. I'll explain that the classes are not required. There will always be some guys that will complain about anything. Usually they just stop attending once they realize that they were never really required to attend in the first place.

 

[VeronicaLodge]

whoa, wait, you are NOT a milk man???

 

[milk man]

whoa, wait, you are NOT a milk man???

Now why would you thing I was a milk man?

It's an inside joke, goes along with a dry sence of humor I have.

I thought most people thought I was a good looking male stripper.

 

[pattytx]

If it's company-required training, it should be considered "time worked". If the class is optional, it would not have to be considered time worked.

Not necessarily.

Attendance is not voluntary, of course, if it is required by the
employer. It is not voluntary in fact if the employee is given to
understand or led to believe that his present working conditions or the
continuance of his employment would be adversely affected by
nonattendance.

http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_785/29CFR785.28.htm