Postal Service Blues

[camillia]

Postal Service Blues - unattainable landlord

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? Arizona

After moving out of our rented house (June 1st) we received from our landlord an itemized billing of damages in lieu of our security deposit, plus a bill for $150, all payable within 30 days. Much of the damages were present upon our move in, the rest, we feel were wear and tear. Moreover, we were denied a movein checklist, and a moveout inspection as required by arizona law. We have been in the house nearly two years, and during the second year, our landlords moved to alaska, leaving us only a PO Box.

So we sent them a dispute letter via express mail, demanding receipts for the work billed within 10 days (which they ballparked the labor and still have not done the work as of July 15th).The letter sat in their PO Box for a week and then came back to us. So we got just a little bit smarter and sent them the dispute letter again, this time via certified priority mail, with an attached note saying sorry that we missed them, they must of been on vacation etc.. (Though we knew they were not, because a fellow tenant had been in email correspondence during that time.) This letter has sat in their mail box for three days now.

My questions are: When have they officially received mail? Can we count ten days from when it landed in their mailbox or do they have to sign for it? Have we screwed up, even though we have all the tracking numbers and documentation, by not sending registered mail? When can we proceed in small claims court? Should we send to them a third time or is that useless?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Camillia

P.S. Our landlords have not set foot in the house since we vacated. They had a friend videotape the house and send it to them. If we go to court is his videotape admissable if he doesnt show up in court?

 

[camillia]

can anybody help me?? (NM)

Can anyone here help me?

camillia

 

[Who's Liable?]

Send the letter up to a fourth time via CRRR to their P.O. Box... After that you may proceed to small claims court... In AZ, a CRRR letter is deemed "delivered"(state statute) on the 5th day after it is sent regardless if someone signs for it or not. Plus you have the CRRR receipt as proof that you mailed it...

I hope you DID NOT open the returned letters! As they become evidence of your attempt to contact them. The judge will be very happy to open it and read what you said you wrote...

In each of the CRRR letters you send, make sure to cite the previous attempts that you have tried to contact them... Also cite the state statutes that you beleive you were denied, and write exactly how they denied you your rights as a tenant.

You kind of tripped over yourself and may have accidentlly given the LL extra time to return your deposit...

Send a separate CRRR letter statiung your most current address, and to send ALL correspondence to that address... Do this in writing as the LL may claim that he didn't NOT have your current address... It's hard to prove that you told them verbally of your new address...

Send another CRRR letter demanding your security deposit in full... This sets the clock ticking for how long the LL has in returning your deposit...

 

[camillia]

Whats a CRRR? If its a certified return receipt, I already sent one, they have legally (per your info five days is yesterday) received it, and the clock should be ticking on it.. but it does require their signature, they won't sign and will sit in their PO Box for two weeks before coming back to me. Does express mail count? If so, they are past their ten days on our first sending.. I have all documentation on both mailings so far.

Yes I have kept all returned mail unopened, and their itemized billing was sent to or current and correct address, so we have them there.

Thank you for your help.

Camillia

 

[Who's Liable?]

Whats a CRRR? If its a certified return receipt, I already sent one, they have legally (per your info five days is yesterday) received it, and the clock should be ticking on it.. but it does require their signature, they won't sign and will sit in their PO Box for two weeks before coming back to me. Does express mail count? If so, they are past their ten days on our first sending.. I have all documentation on both mailings so far.

Yes I have kept all returned mail unopened, and their itemized billing was sent to or current and correct address, so we have them there.

Thank you for your help.

Camillia

You misunderstood me... AZ statute maintains that a letter sent C-RRR(stands for Certified, & Return Reciept Requested(two separate charges)) DOES NOT have to be signed by the receiveing party in order for it to be recognized as "delivered"... The postal service may need a signature to PROVE TO YOU that it was signed, but AZ state statute DOES NOT!

certified mail are deemed received five days after you mail them. Reference A.R.S. § 33-1313(B).


Dammit... now you made me look for all the specific statutes!!!

ARTICLE 2. Landlord Obligations
§33-1321. Security deposits
D. Within fourteen days, excluding Saturdays, Sundays or other legal holidays, after termination of the tenancy and delivery of possession and demand by the tenant the landlord shall provide the tenant an itemized list of all deductions together with the amount due and payable to the tenant, if any. Unless other arrangements are made in writing by the tenant, the landlord shall mail, by regular mail, to the tenant’s last known place of residence.

E. If the landlord fails to comply with subsection D of this section the tenant may recover the property and money due the tenant together with damages in an amount equal to twice the amount wrongfully withheld.

So says the satute that you MUST DEMAND the security deposit... That is why you should send a separate CRRR letter DEMANDING the deposit be sent to your most current address...

One last thing... Keep a copy of ALL letters you send out!

 

[ENASNI]

um

You misunderstood me... AZ statute maintains that a letter sent C-RRR(stands for Certified, & Return Reciept Requested(two separate charges)) DOES NOT have to be signed by the receiveing party in order for it to be recognized as "delivered"... The postal service may need a signature to PROVE TO YOU that it was signed, but AZ state statute DOES NOT!

certified mail are deemed received five days after you mail them. Reference A.R.S. § 33-1313(B).


Dammit... now you made me look for all the specific statutes!!!

ARTICLE 2. Landlord Obligations
§33-1321. Security deposits
D. Within fourteen days, excluding Saturdays, Sundays or other legal holidays, after termination of the tenancy and delivery of possession and demand by the tenant the landlord shall provide the tenant an itemized list of all deductions together with the amount due and payable to the tenant, if any. Unless other arrangements are made in writing by the tenant, the landlord shall mail, by regular mail, to the tenant’s last known place of residence.

E. If the landlord fails to comply with subsection D of this section the tenant may recover the property and money due the tenant together with damages in an amount equal to twice the amount wrongfully withheld.

So says the satute that you MUST DEMAND the security deposit... That is why you should send a separate CRRR letter DEMANDING the deposit be sent to your most current address...

One last thing... Keep a copy of ALL letters you send out!

Whos L... does that count if it is sent to ALASKA?

 

[Who's Liable?]

33-1313. Notice

B. A person "notifies" or "gives" a notice or notification to another by taking steps reasonably calculated to inform the other in ordinary course whether or not the other actually comes to know of it. A person "receives" a notice or notification when it comes to his attention, or in the case of the landlord, it is delivered in hand or mailed by registered or certified mail to the place of business of the landlord through which the rental agreement was made or at any place held out by him as the place for receipt of the communication or delivered to any individual who is designated as an agent by section 33-1322 or, in the case of the tenant, it is delivered in hand to the tenant or mailed by registered or certified mail to him at the place held out by him as the place for receipt of the communication or, in the absence of such designation, to his last known place of residence. If notice is mailed by registered or certified mail, the tenant or landlord is deemed to have received such notice on the date the notice is actually received by him or five days after the date the notice is mailed, whichever occurs first.


break it down Kriss! I'm about to! Break it down Kriss! 'Cause that's what I was born to Do!

The LL told gave you an address in my home state... You have reason to believe that the address given to you is their new place of "business" since they sent you a letter with the deductions from your SD with their address in AK(further cementing the thought that the address given to you in AK is a new location for their "business")

Since the LL sent you a letter from AK, you have reason to believe that this is: place for receipt of the communication That said and done, you can read the last sentence which states: If notice is mailed by registered or certified mail, the tenant or landlord is deemed to have received such notice on the date the notice is actually received by him or five days after the date the notice is mailed, whichever occurs first.

 

[ENASNI]

Okay..

I am not sure if you are right or not .. but you did soo much research lovey. I am just saying good night.. because I am REALLY getting arm-wrestled for the computer from my daughter and cannot do reasearche... so...

Till another day..

I will be back..

Sarah conner...

 

[camillia]

Okay then. They have officially received it because I sent it certified six days ago, BUT, does it count if I required them to sign for it, and they didnt? If so I have to start all over again. My mistake may have been to make them sign for it, or does it matter?

CB

 

[dequeendistress]

I think the jest is that YOU have proof the letter was sent---that is ALL that is required --- screw the rest. What problem you do have is: Proving the damages in the house/apt. were pre existing and not beyond normal wear and tear---and that definition of NORMAL wear and tear will not be YOUR defintion but the judge's interpertation of said---if it indeed does go as far as a judge.

(by the way your post indicated you did not believe the landlord was on vacation because they had used e-mail---fyi you can use e-mail on vacation at locations other than your home---so drop the BS that does not matter and stick to the subject.)

 

[camillia]

Hey just to defend myself - The landlord not only has checked her email, but has cashed a fellow tenants rent checks sent to her address as well. Furthermore, the second round of certified mail has been delivered and yet to be claimed, as

As for the damages, I have admission from the LL by email that there are pre=existing damages, some even specific to what they charged us for. The reason they turned so sour on us was that they changed their security deposit in the second lease with outtelling us, and we requested an amount that we were shorted.

It goes something like this:

1st years lease security: $750 Refundable
$250 refundable pet deposit
_______

$1000 Refundable
They carried this over to:

2nd years lease security $750 Refundable
$150 NON refundable pet deposit.

Okay, all this is cool. We screwed up, didnt read the second years deposit part of the lease, and were surprised when they told us upon moveout we were only eligible for a $750 deposit. I will gladly forfeit the $150 nonrefundable pet deposit, but the outstanding $100 that just disappeared between the leases is a point of contention. They told us by email they would return our $750, we said that we thought they owed us $850, and they got so mad, they said we would get nothing, and sent us an itemized damages list.

The damages list took the damages out of $850. Fair enough. But we know the damages were pre-existing, and their listing of them was bourne out being upset with us for mentioning the $100.

But still, we have had no inspections, movein, moveout (requested) and between leases, all as requred by arizona law, so we think we have a good case, but are hoping it doesnt go that far.

How does that sound?? Am I right or wrong to ask for a $100 difference in carried over lease a year ago, is there a limitations on these things?

Thanks again all

Camillia