PTFA- Back Rent Payment

[easuttle]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Alabama

I am currently living in a home that went through foreclosure at the beginning of this year. The foreclosure sale took place on February 18, and therefore the last rent payment I made to the previous owners was in January of this year. In the days following the foreclosure sale I sent a letter with a copy of my lease to the bank who previously mortgaged the house and bought it at the auction, as well as the law firm who is handling the foreclosure for the bank. I received no response. In the following month a storm downed a tree in the backyard and damaged the fencing. I made some very minor repairs to these issues and again attempted to contact the bank and law firm, with again no response. In July someone came to serve a summons to the previous owner, I notified him they no long lived her and he became very rude trying to tell me we were trespassing, however he left without much issue. We then received a letter around 2 weeks later outlining our rights under PTFA. This said they would be contacting us with more information soon. Two weeks ago I received a questionnaire asking for:
-A copy of the lease
-Evidence of rent payments
(I included a letter for the real estate agency who handled the lease)
-Any issues with the property
(I included photos of the downed tree and damage to the fence)
-If we were interested in purchasing the property/if so a prequalification letter
(I included this as well)
Then today I recieved a call from the real estate company who handled the lease. She stated the law firm handling this had contacted her to confirm I had not paid rent since January. The lawyer then stated to realtor that we would likely be liable for the back rent. Most of this is to ask, do I have any defense to not pay the back rent? I feel that the bank has not served their role as a landlord by leaving multiple issues wrong with the house and being unavailable to me as the tenant. I was also wondering if any of you are familiar with this type of situation and whether I may be able to purchase the home without having to leave. Thank you all for taking the time I know this is a somewhat lengthy post but just wanted to include all the details possible.

-Ethan

 

[TigerD]

You will likely be evicted for nonpayment of rent. You may also face a judgment for the back rent and damages to the property.

You knew where to send the rent. You sent a copy of your lease. But you chose to not send the rent payment.

DC

 

[Eekamouse]

Do you have all your unpaid rent saved up in your bank account?

 

[easuttle]

debtcollector
I don't know if I was unclear in my original post or not. I contacted both the bank and the legal firm that is handling the foreclosure on behalf of the bank WITHIN 3 DAYS of the the foreclosure sale, requesting information on where to send the rent. Bear in mind this is ME contacting THEM, and received no response. They have absolutely no basis to evict me at this point for non payment because of the fact they have not responded to any of my correspondence. They still have yet to provide me with any information on where I should send the rent. Furthermore the damage to the property was caused by an act of nature, I am not sure where you got the idea that I could be held liable for storm blowing over a tree. This is something that would normally be covered by the homeowners insurance, However I am not sure that the bank (The homeowner at the time the tree was downed) had homeowners insurance. Are you familiar with any PTFA cases?

 

[easuttle]

eekamouse, I have the back rent, However at this point I would much rather put it towards a down payment on the home than to pay back rent if that is possible

 

[FarmerJ]

I have a hard time imagining that if you were to make a valid offer thru your own realtor that it would be refused unless there was a reasonable offer by another party for more money. As far as non payment issues , if you have the money set aside even if they did not respond to your contacting them Im curious did you ever get letters telling you where to send your rent ? ( as well as a explanation to you that the home had a new owner and who it was ?) Im not saying that would give you any wiggle room Its reasonable to say you owed someone rent but i too think it may have been a bit more fair if you had been told in writing who to pay)

 

[TheGeekess]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Alabama

I am currently living in a home that went through foreclosure at the beginning of this year. The foreclosure sale took place on February 18, and therefore the last rent payment I made to the previous owners was in January of this year. In the days following the foreclosure sale I sent a letter with a copy of my lease to the bank who previously mortgaged the house and bought it at the auction, as well as the law firm who is handling the foreclosure for the bank. I received no response. In the following month a storm downed a tree in the backyard and damaged the fencing. I made some very minor repairs to these issues and again attempted to contact the bank and law firm, with again no response. In July someone came to serve a summons to the previous owner, I notified him they no long lived her and he became very rude trying to tell me we were trespassing, however he left without much issue. We then received a letter around 2 weeks later outlining our rights under PTFA. This said they would be contacting us with more information soon. Two weeks ago I received a questionnaire asking for:
-A copy of the lease
-Evidence of rent payments
(I included a letter for the real estate agency who handled the lease)
-Any issues with the property
(I included photos of the downed tree and damage to the fence)
-If we were interested in purchasing the property/if so a prequalification letter
(I included this as well)
Then today I recieved a call from the real estate company who handled the lease. She stated the law firm handling this had contacted her to confirm I had not paid rent since January. The lawyer then stated to realtor that we would likely be liable for the back rent. Most of this is to ask, do I have any defense to not pay the back rent? I feel that the bank has not served their role as a landlord by leaving multiple issues wrong with the house and being unavailable to me as the tenant. I was also wondering if any of you are familiar with this type of situation and whether I may be able to purchase the home without having to leave. Thank you all for taking the time I know this is a somewhat lengthy post but just wanted to include all the details possible.

-Ethan

I don't know if I was unclear in my original post or not. I contacted both the bank and the legal firm that is handling the foreclosure on behalf of the bank WITHIN 3 DAYS of the the foreclosure sale, requesting information on where to send the rent. Bear in mind this is ME contacting THEM, and received no response. They have absolutely no basis to evict me at this point for non payment because of the fact they have not responded to any of my correspondence. They still have yet to provide me with any information on where I should send the rent. Furthermore the damage to the property was caused by an act of nature, I am not sure where you got the idea that I could be held liable for storm blowing over a tree. This is something that would normally be covered by the homeowners insurance, However I am not sure that the bank (The homeowner at the time the tree was downed) had homeowners insurance. Are you familiar with any PTFA cases?

Were you paying rent to the (former) owners or to the real estate company who had been handling the lease? Did you not contact the real estate company after the foreclosure if you had been paying them the rent (instead of the former owners)?

Under federal law – the Protecting Tenants at Foreclosure Act (PTFA) – you have certain protections if your rental house or apartment goes into foreclosure:

• Notice before you can be evicted. You have the right to a 90-day notice period before you can be evicted if you have a valid lease.
• The right to continue renting. You have the right to continue renting the property if you signed the lease before the foreclosure notice. If the new owners will occupy the property as their primary residence or if you do not have a lease or have a lease that can be terminated at will under State law, then the new owners are only required to allow you to occupy the property until the 90-day notice period ends. Otherwise, they must allow you to occupy the property for the remaining term of the lease.

http://www.consumerfinance.gov/askcfpb/1545/what-should-i-do-if-house-or-apartment-im-renting-goes-foreclosure.html

http://nlihc.org/library/other/foreclosure

http://alisondb.legislature.state.al.us/acas/CodeOfAlabama/1975/135724.htm
http://alisondb.legislature.state.al.us/acas/CodeOfAlabama/1975/155218.htm

 

[easuttle]

I see some of your confusion Geekess. The arrangement was that I would make a payment to the Real estate agency and they would deposit the money into the owners bank account. When I found that the house was scheduled for a foreclosure auction I contacted the real estate company who had no knowledge of this. They have been unable to reach or locate the previous owner. After consulting with the real estate company I did not make any rent payments to them after the foreclosure sale since they were only capable of sending the money to the previous owner.

I also meant to say " I included a letter from the real estate company stating that we had paid rent through January as my evidence of rent payment"


And thank you for your thought out response as wells as research into my issue. I really appreciate your effort.

 

[TigerD]

I see some of your confusion Geekess. The arrangement was that I would make a payment to the Real estate agency and they would deposit the money into the owners bank account. When I found that the house was scheduled for a foreclosure auction I contacted the real estate company who had no knowledge of this. They have been unable to reach or locate the previous owner. After consulting with the real estate company I did not make any rent payments to them after the foreclosure sale since they were only capable of sending the money to the previous owner.

I also meant to say " I included a letter from the real estate company stating that we had paid rent through January as my evidence of rent payment"

In other words, you ceased paying your rent.
My previous comment stands.

PTFA applies if they were evicting you because the ownership changed. You ceased paying your rent. You had a payment address. Only the ownership changed -- your lease did not.

Expect an eviction. And a suit for damages to the house.

by leaving multiple issues wrong with the house

DC

 

[easuttle]

So debtcollector,
In your opinion I should have continued to take a check to the real estate office. Who told me not to continue paying, because they did not have any ownership information on the house?

I really do not think you understand the situation. The law firm handling the foreclosure has contacted us with info to begin PTFA payments. However they did not provide this information until September 17, 2013. They have not asked for any back rent, but indicated to the real estate company who previously managed the lease that we may be asked for the back rent. There has been NO mention of eviction.

And as I have stated multiple times the issues with the house were a result of ACTS OF NATURE not my doing things that if you read the Alabama code as cited by geekess the LANDLORD is responsible for not the TENANT.

 

[TigerD]

So debtcollector,
In your opinion I should have continued to take a check to the real estate office. Who told me not to continue paying, because they did not have any ownership information on the house?

I really do not think you understand the situation. The law firm handling the foreclosure has contacted us with info to begin PTFA payments. However they did not provide this information until September 17, 2013. They have not asked for any back rent, but indicated to the real estate company who previously managed the lease that we may be asked for the back rent. There has been NO mention of eviction.

And as I have stated multiple times the issues with the house were a result of ACTS OF NATURE not my doing things that if you read the Alabama code as cited by geekess the LANDLORD is responsible for not the TENANT.

1. Damage to the fence is one thing.
2. You stated there were other problems with the house.

You are adding information in bits and dribbles.

Most of this is to ask, do I have any defense to not pay the back rent?

No, you don't have a defense. There is no way here you are not wrong

DC

PS: Since what you are really looking for is someone to tell you you are right -- just tell us what you want to hear. Someone will parrot it back to you.

 

[DeenaCA]

You're describing two common forms of widespread noncompliance with PTFA on the part of foreclosing banks and their agents. The banks often stonewall inquiries about rent payment after foreclosure, then try to evict the tenant for nonpayment. They also frequently send misleading or inaccurate notices, falsely implying that a tenant is not covered under PTFA unless he or she can provide extensive documentation of tenancy. See the report at http://www.nlchp.org/content/pubs/12.17.12%20Eviction%20Without%20Notice%20FINAL.pdf.

None of this entitles the tenant to free rent. Now that the bank has provided a payment address, they can evict for nonpayment if you do not pay. Since it sounds like the bank may be interested in selling the house to you, maybe they are willing to negotiate.

Do you have a fixed-term lease? If you are month-to-month or your lease has expired, the bank can legally terminate tenancy on 90 days notice even if you do pay the back rent. If you do not pay, the bank can evict under Alabama state law.

 

[TigerD]

You're describing two common forms of widespread noncompliance with PTFA on the part of foreclosing banks and their agents. The banks often stonewall inquiries about rent payment after foreclosure, then try to evict the tenant for nonpayment. They also frequently send misleading or inaccurate notices, falsely implying that a tenant is not covered under PTFA unless he or she can provide extensive documentation of tenancy. See the report at http://www.nlchp.org/content/pubs/12.17.12%20Eviction%20Without%20Notice%20FINAL.pdf.

None of this entitles the tenant to free rent. Now that the bank has provided a payment address, they can evict for nonpayment if you do not pay. Since it sounds like the bank may be interested in selling the house to you, maybe they are willing to negotiate.

Do you have a fixed-term lease? If you are month-to-month or your lease has expired, the bank can legally terminate tenancy on 90 days notice even if you do pay the back rent. If you do not pay, the bank can evict under Alabama state law.

Deena,

Perhaps you overlooked where the tenant was required to pay the property management company. That didn't change. Paying the owner was the property management company's problem.

DC

 

[LdiJ]

Deena,

Perhaps you overlooked where the tenant was required to pay the property management company. That didn't change. Paying the owner was the property management company's problem.

DC

Nope...not if the property management company was not retained by the new owner.

 

[Zigner]

Nope...not if the property management company was not retained by the new owner.

I would agree. The Mgm company was acting as the agent of the OLD owner.