School tuition/after school care

[sad_dad]

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state?
Washington State

I am a father with 1 child. My ex-wife is the custodian parent. I pay basic child support and day care cost to my ex-wife.

Now my child is going to kindergarten. Is the tuition and after school care cost considered as child care cost?

In the child support order, it is ordered that I share the day care cost with my ex-wife.

My question is, do I have to pay/share the public kindergarten and after school care cost with my ex-wife? How about we send our child to a private kindergarten?

Your advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[eyemback]

What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state?
Washington State

I am a father with 1 child. My ex-wife is the custodian parent. I pay basic child support and day care cost to my ex-wife.

Now my child is going to kindergarten. Is the tuition and after school care cost considered as child care cost?

In the child support order, it is ordered that I share the day care cost with my ex-wife.

My question is, do I have to pay/share the public kindergarten and after school care cost with my ex-wife? How about we send our child to a private kindergarten?

Your advice is greatly appreciated.

If tuition costs are not addressed, then you are not legally obligated to pay for those. After-school care *might* be considered daycare costs (although daycare and after-school care are different IMO). How does the school bill this?

 

[LdiJ]

If tuition costs are not addressed, then you are not legally obligated to pay for those. After-school care *might* be considered daycare costs (although daycare and after-school care are different IMO). How does the school bill this?

After school care is considered to be daycare costs.

 

[ablessin]

It's still considered child care, whether or not the kid is there all day or part of the day.
Someone else is looking after your child while parent is at work.

You will continue to pay the before and/or after school costs. The daycare costs might decrease once the child is not there all day anymore.
You'll have to ask the provider.

Our rate changes when school is in session.

 

[nextwife]

After school care is considered to be daycare costs.

Yes and no. I use some after school/at school options for my child that are far more expensive than if I simply signed her up for after school day care. The Thursday dance class at her school is pricey - so is the Mad Science enrichment program. It is my choice to use these expensive after school alternatives to day care for some of the week.

So, simply because it is a program for them to attend after school does NOT automatically make it "child care" and the cost should be examined to see if it is appropriate to child care costs, or if is really something else that costs more.

The after school non-enrichment program I use (Many YMCAs or JCCs have such pricing), has a tiered price schedule each month, based upon whether they are 1/2/3/4 or 5 days a week after school. As my daughter has a different program on Thursdays, we only use (and get charged for) the 4 day a week schedule. Anyway, my point is that there are programs that charge based upon use, and it is not automatic that one needs to pay for 5 days a week if they don't use 5 days a week. Perhaps other options should be researched if they are paying for a given day each week that is never being used.

 

[mom22boyz]

Generally speaking, childcare is defined as care necessary to provide the parent the opportunity to work outside of the home. In your case it sounds like the before and after care program will definitely be considered partly your responsibility. You are usually not legally responsible for any school tuition (public or private) unless it's either 1)agree upon in advance in CO - or 2)sought and won in court. The only sticky part is if the cost of private school is combined with before and after care. That is the situation my husband is currently in. He has now recived advise from 2 different atty's stating that either 1) the whole cost will be the Ex's - or 2)the cost of a similar before/after school program will be credited to the Ex even though it is not technically paid for, since the tuition cost includes it. The first atty claimed that the IRS does not consider Kindergarten tuition as an eligible expense for the Child and Dependent Care credit, and that any before and after costs can ONLY ne included if they can be separated out in billing, so neither should a judge for C/S. The second atty basically said that although the Ex was recieveing the benefit of "free" before/after care, by way of paying for Kindergarten tuition, that it does not alleviate the NCP from paying his portion of what would be necessary should the child have been enrolled in public school. I hope this makes at least some sense.

You said you are currently paying 1/2 of daycare. Is this through your C/S order, or do you pay directly to the Ex or daycare provider for your part of the expenses?

Also, you asked what if we send her to private K. I would think twice about agreeing to private school unless you wish (and can afford) to continue. I have heard of a LOT of cases where as long as private school was agreed upon for one school year, that judges are very likely to order that it continue throughout the rest of schooling. They consider it in "the best interest of the child" to continue upon a path originally sought out. If you cant afford it anymore due to financial constraints, too bad. I think that's why I have such a prob with family court in general. It's supposed to be about keeping status quo for the kids, but your F'ed if your situation ever changes. I guess it's beyond the realm of possibility that had the parents stayed married, that situations could get worse too.

 

[sad_dad]

Thank you all for the valuable information.

I’d like to make a few points clear:

1. I was ordered to pay basic child support($650 per month).
2. I was ordered to pay ½ day care cost (I paid about $400 per month).
3. I pay directly ½ of the day care cost directly to the provider.

Now I understand that the public elementary school tuition ($270 per month for full day, free for half day) is not day care cost. So I don’t have to pay it. But my ex-wife is mad about this. She yelled at me over the phone and wants to take me to the court.

I will pay ½ of the after school cost. I have no problem with that.

 

[mom22boyz]

"Now I understand that the public elementary school tuition ($270 per month for full day, free for half day) is not day care cost"

Well, actually she could take you to court, and might win. It can be stated that by putting the child in full day Kindergarten, that you are saving $ on before/after care. In a LOT of daycare centers, there is a b4/after charge for fullday Kindergarteners and a higher charge for b4/after for 1/2 day Kindergarteners. If the child was in 1/2 day, you would have to pay for 1/2 of the higher daycare cost, but since she is in the fullday, the daycare cost is lower. A judge COULD (not saying will) rule in her favor.

Here's an ex. I'll use the #'s for the daycare my stepdaughter is in, just to compare, so you can see what I mean

1/2 day K = free
B4/after care for 1/2 day K = 122/wk (approx 535/mo)
Total spent = 535/mo
Your 1/2 = 267

full day K = 270/mo
b4/after care for school agers or fullday K = 80/wk (approx 350/mo)
b4 & after for 1/2 day K (or sometimes is still billed at fulltime charge)
Total spent = 620/mo
Your half of actual daycare= 175
Your half if total is assessed = 310

I guess what I'm trying to say is the judge could see that it is in the child's best interest to go to private school and your final cost would still be less than the 400 you were spending. KWIM? Again, it is NOT a given, but I just think you should be aware that it can and does happen.

 

[sad_dad]

Thanks mom.

I just talked with the attorney whos firm represented me in my divorce. He told me exactly as you said.

So I will have to pay 1/2 of the tuition.

 

[mom22boyz]

If it were me, I would continue to still pay only the cost for daycare. Let Ex take you back to court to get the rest. Would she willingly agree to take less w/o a court order just because you were due a reduction? I think not. If your CO states you are responsible for 1/2 of daycare, then pay for 1/2 of daycare. She may even decide it's not worth her time to get an atty and file for modification to have the public school tuition included. To me her case seems iffy at best and what's the worst that could happen? You have to pay for 1/2 of daycare AND 1/2 of tuition, which is what you are thinking of doing voluntarily anyway. I could see if you would have to take it to court, but since the ball is in her court, it's her move if she wants more cash.

 

[LdiJ]

If it were me, I would continue to still pay only the cost for daycare. Let Ex take you back to court to get the rest. Would she willingly agree to take less w/o a court order just because you were due a reduction? I think not. If your CO states you are responsible for 1/2 of daycare, then pay for 1/2 of daycare. She may even decide it's not worth her time to get an atty and file for modification to have the public school tuition included. To me her case seems iffy at best and what's the worst that could happen? You have to pay for 1/2 of daycare AND 1/2 of tuition, which is what you are thinking of doing voluntarily anyway. I could see if you would have to take it to court, but since the ball is in her court, it's her move if she wants more cash.

I think thats a very bad idea. He has already spoken to the firm that represented him in the divorce and has already been told that he has to pay.
If he takes your advice he will be risking not only be ordered to pay, but also being ordered to pay her legal fees for making her take him to court. His attorney won't be particularly pleased with him either.

 

[mom22boyz]

"He has already spoken to the firm that represented him in the divorce and has already been told that he has to pay"

That's not exactly true. The OP resonded to my post stating that the judge MAY order him to pay, by saying his atty was in agreement. How could he be held in contempt for following his CO to the letter? Splittling private and or public school tuition is not automaticaly ordered, but is considered grounds for deviation. Ex would have to seek modification and win in order for the CO to be revised to include these charges. I read the most recent post from the OP to mean that he was told that he would prob have to pay if Ex took him court, not that he should start paying now. It would take a pretty uptight judge to find a person in contempt for not volunteering to pay for school tuition that is not covered in any previous agreement.

OP what exactly did the atty say? Pay now, or you will prob be ordered to pay? If it's the former than I agree with the PP. If it's the latter, than I stand by my most recent post.

The reason I feel so sure about this is that my husband was/is in this EXACT same situation. Husband's Ex wife moved from good school to bad school district. Ex enrolled daughter in private K w/out his approval. Husband didnt agree to enrollment or charges. No tuition addressed in CO. 2 atty's told hubby not to pay. In one of my previous posts I explained what both attys said outcome COULD be, but neither said to pay up now with no arguement. The only difference in the situation is that my husband's C/S includes the daycare, while the OP pays direct. In my husband's case, both emphatically said to modify and NOT to pay any additional $. The worst that could happen to hubby is that he pays full amt for b/4 & after + school, which is less than he pays now. The worst that could happen (contempt charges excluded) to OP is that he is ordered to pay for school & b/4 & after.

 

[SMURFEELAW]

I agree on the full day kindergarten enrichment. Although it was not tax deductible We put my SD in a kindergarten before public schools would accept her (age) we figured she could either go on to first or redo K this year but eith way full day was $175 per month versus 400 plus for daycare and we wanted her to start having some structured learning. With the cost of summer care and afterschool care it was just over the amount in this state that makes it get lowered to take in the child care credit. when we proved it was not tax deductible only the after school and summer care the judge said it still was less than the cost of day care (we brought in flyers from many preschools/daycares in the area) and would have held mom responsible for paying half. this was not a CS hearing but mom brought it up complaining that we enrolled her before time trying to make it look to the judge that we were trying to set the child up with roots the judge would not want to pull up. Then he told my hubby to file for support against mom anyway but the judge himself made the clear case for us that it was the most inexpensive and beneficial to the child. as it turns out we had her redo K this year (mom put her through the ringer emotionally) and it is public school now but we are asking for half of after school care costs and break/summer costs.

Good Luck I would research costs of alternantives and decide which is most cost effective and go with it. If the private K turns out to be the best choice for this year write a letter to mom stating your research and that it is the most cost effective but that it does not mean you agree to private schools for all remaining years-- Is your situation also an age thing???