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Sex offense?

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reyn562

Member
What is the name of your state? FL

The case of Otis and Victor

STATE: Florida

Otis is a 40-year-old male with limited mobility and in a power chair, although there are times when he can get up from the power chair with a degree of difficulty.

Victor is a 30-year-old male without limitations in mobility but has a mild to moderate form of mental retardation.

Otis and Victor had just met at a Florida theme park. Both were waiting in line until the park opened. While the two were waiting in line of Victor engaged in a conversation with Otis and determined that he was from up north will Otis lived in the same state as a theme park. Victor traveled by himself by airline and was staying at a nearby hotel which turned out to be next to the hotel at which Otis was staying.

The two then formed a bond and Otis asked Victor to serve as his companion throughout the excursion at the theme park. The companionship involved assisting Otis in his power chair with many things including reaching for items such as those at the restaurants and food stands within the theme park, and using the toilet, particularly urinating. Assisting in urinating meant that Victor would unzip Otis's pants, remove his penis, and direct it to the toilet to arch the urine stream into it. On a couple of occasions and at Otis's request, Victor masturbated him. This was after Victor showed some affection toward Otis by tickling the back of his neck and the back of his hand. Victor gave no resistance and was clearly told that if he didn’t like this he can easily say he doesn’t want to and that it would not affect their relationship.

At the conclusion of that day's excursion, Otis took Victor to his own hotel where Victor assisted him to unload the power chair, which had to be dismantled partially to load into the back of the vehicle. Victor then would walk next door to his hotel. The next morning of Otis and Victor met again, had breakfast together, and return to the theme park for another day of fun. Victor liked to get onto the rides, particularly roller coasters. We both gone onto a five-minute ride on the Range Rover at the theme park a couple of times. Victor did not go with Otis into the haunted theater, and Otis never went on any of the roller coaster rides with Victor. Numerous pictures of Victor were taken that the theme park, one of which included a DVD with Victor having gone on the ride.

At the conclusion on both evenings, Victor and Otis went to dinner at two different restaurants located near the hotels. All of the meals eaten by both individuals were paid for by Otis, especially when he learned that Victor traveled with very little money, no debit or credit card, and a card called an EBT card with which he accessed his food stamps. Victor would buy a large quantity of sodas to take into the park to prevent dehydration.

Otis and Victor had been keeping in touch with each other since then through text messaging and occasional phone calls. None of the text messages or even telephone calls had any depiction of any sexual nature.

One morning, about two months later, a "relative" called Otis and asked how he knew Victor. The relative stated that Victor mentioned to her that there were sexual encounters. She then stated that this was a police matter and a police would be contacted in Otis's area. She stated that Victor did not have the mental capacity to consent to sex. Otis stated that if this was true that Victor should not be traveling alone if he has such a diminished mental capacity. It should also be noted that Victor, according to his statements, lives in his own apartment and pay his own rent, although it is unclear who manages his money. It should also be noted that Victor seemed to be pretty good with numbers such as dates, credit/debit/EBT card numbers, and the PIN to the cards in his possession.

So the big question is this: did Otis commit any violation of law regarding consensual sex and diminished mental capacity? To what extent must Otis have been able to determine whether or not Victor had enough mental capacity to give consent to any sexual activity that occurred?
 
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michsisu

Junior Member
Is this for real? If so,

Sounds like Otis is freaking perv who molested poor Victor. I'll bet he usually preys on young boys, but was quite delighted to find a 30 year old with a young boy mentality.
Seems like it would be quite difficult for Otis just to get out to the bank- yet he can have fun at a theme park for 2 days on his own?
Okay.
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
justalayman said:
They put the answers in the back of the book , don't they?

No sometimes you have to get a seperate workbook with the answers. Costs a bit more than going to a free legal advice site. ;)
 
All of the meals eaten by both individuals were paid for by Otis, especially when he learned that Victor traveled with very little money, no debit or credit card, and a card called an EBT card with which she accessed his food stamps.

Gender identity disorder perhaps?
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
john123456 said:
All of the meals eaten by both individuals were paid for by Otis, especially when he learned that Victor traveled with very little money, no debit or credit card, and a card called an EBT card with which she accessed his food stamps.

Gender identity disorder perhaps?

That is found in an Entirely different workbook!!!
 

reyn562

Member
Apply the law, not opinions

In this puzzle you need to apply the law, not your opinion: perhaps Otis is a monster, but in this case did he break the law?

In this case, Otis claims his encounter with Victor was consensual, and although he admits that Victor appeared to be mentally deficient (retarded), several aspects of Victor's encounter made Otis believe he had the capability to consent to having sex (by virtue of the fact that Victor masturbated Otis). These aspects included the facts that Victor traveled by himself to the theme park, in fact, to Florida by air; he was staying at a hotel alone; he met Victor at the restaurant the next morning for breakfast; he flew home and made it safely; and they kept in touch by text message and phone calls.

In order for the law to be broken, Florida Statutes 825.101, defines "(1) As used in this section, "sexual activity" means the oral, anal, or vaginal penetration by, or union with, the sexual organ of another or the anal or vaginal penetration of another by any other object; however, sexual activity does not include an act done for a bona fide medical purpose."

This didn't happen: relatives claim that Victor masturbated Otis, something Otis admits but states this was consensual, especially when he claims that Victor made some advances to Otis first.

I believe this IS sexual activity, but the Statutes don't mention it. They do state, however, that if a person intentionally masturbates, etc., in the presence of an elderly or disabled person who lacks the ability to consent or fails to consent, (FS 825.1025 4(a) 1) he is guilty of lewd or lascivious exhibition in the presence of an elderly or disabled person, a third-degree felony.

So the issue is: to what extent must a lay person know that a disabled person lacks the ability to consent?

As soon as I get some more responses, I will post the outcome of this issue and what happened in the case: this case IS fictitious but an issue could come up like this in the future if it hasn't already been presented to you (lawyers, officers and judges).
 

reyn562

Member
Outcome

Outcome of case: Otis was arrested and charged with violation of FS 825.1025 4(a), lewd exhibition in the presence of a disabled person.

However, the case was dropped (nolle prosequi) because the State was uncomfortable prosecuting by virtue of proof that the Defendant (Otis) had reason to believe the victim lacked the capability of consensual sex. While the Defendant admitted he knew the victim was mentally impaired, the Defendant took into account the fact that the victim was by himself, had traveled alone, admitted to having had prior same-sexual encounters (masturbation only), had a cellular phone in which he stored numerous contact information including that of the Defendant, and made it home safely, specifically stated to the victim that he was not under any obligation to perform the manual procedure, and the procedure was reciprocated to the Victim (he ejaculated), he had no reason to believe the victim lacked such capacity to give consent.

Thanks for your input everybody, albeit marginal!!
 
Poster:

Why did you delete your previous post indicating this was a HOMEWORK assignment?


"This was a very dificult case discussed in class: The case was unfounded.

Otis' defense was basically that he, himself disabled and with Asperger Syndrome (not an excuse), had no way of determining whether or not Victor was in fact mentally incapable of giving consent to sexual activity (IMO any type of activity involving an orgasm is sexual activity-- Sorry, Clinton!). Victor admitted he didn't mind performing the act and that he liked it.

The fact that the victim took a trip from out of state by himself, was able to recall certain numerical data, return home safely, go to the theme park alone, stay in a hotel alone, and reunite the next day with the perp, made it impossible for any prosecutor to convince a jury that the victim lack mental capacity to give consent to sex.

AS for the Gender Identity disorder: it was a typo on my part.

Any feedback?
"
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
recess

john123456 said:
Poster:

Why did you delete your previous post indicating this was a HOMEWORK assignment?


"This was a very dificult case discussed in class: The case was unfounded.

Otis' defense was basically that he, himself disabled and with Asperger Syndrome (not an excuse), had no way of determining whether or not Victor was in fact mentally incapable of giving consent to sexual activity (IMO any type of activity involving an orgasm is sexual activity-- Sorry, Clinton!). Victor admitted he didn't mind performing the act and that he liked it.

The fact that the victim took a trip from out of state by himself, was able to recall certain numerical data, return home safely, go to the theme park alone, stay in a hotel alone, and reunite the next day with the perp, made it impossible for any prosecutor to convince a jury that the victim lack mental capacity to give consent to sex.

AS for the Gender Identity disorder: it was a typo on my part.

Any feedback?
"

good catch John... School is OUT!
 

rmet4nzkx

Senior Member
john123456 said:
Poster:

Why did you delete your previous post indicating this was a HOMEWORK assignment?


"This was a very dificult case discussed in class: The case was unfounded.

Otis' defense was basically that he, himself disabled and with Asperger Syndrome (not an excuse), had no way of determining whether or not Victor was in fact mentally incapable of giving consent to sexual activity (IMO any type of activity involving an orgasm is sexual activity-- Sorry, Clinton!). Victor admitted he didn't mind performing the act and that he liked it.

The fact that the victim took a trip from out of state by himself, was able to recall certain numerical data, return home safely, go to the theme park alone, stay in a hotel alone, and reunite the next day with the perp, made it impossible for any prosecutor to convince a jury that the victim lack mental capacity to give consent to sex.

AS for the Gender Identity disorder: it was a typo on my part.

Any feedback?
"
It is too bad that OP decided to delete this information even though this was a homework assignment. This type of activity and other forms of inappropriate sexual activity/masturbation in public, is not uncommon among males with Asperger's, even high functioning individuals, for a number of reasons and is not written about but discussed among professionals. Insofar as the outcome, there would be other statutes covering this situation and the charges would vary from state to state where sexual activity would be more broadly defined.
 

reyn562

Member
It wasn't a homework assignment

This was a case study in my class, but not a homework assignment. I specialize with disabled persons because I too have Asperger's and was presented in a similar situation, although in my case it was a 20 year old with neurological damage but nonetheless was gay and initiated the sexual contact.

Basically one has to have good judgment in determining whether or not a disabled person lacks the capability to consent to sex. And I don't think the average person has the ability to do so. So a case like this could have an affect on anyone, especially whose family is so over-protective that they will deny the individual the right to have sex.

The mentally retarded, TBI (traumatic brain injured), and most other similar persons still have sex drives, albeit inappropriate at times (in the case of Otis and Victor, at a theme park). But it's the family member who tries to step in and threaten to call cops saying that their MR/TBI "lack the ability to consent to sex," and now the other person involved, himself disabled, is worried about possibly being in trouble.
 

rmet4nzkx

Senior Member
reyn562 said:
This was a case study in my class, but not a homework assignment. I specialize with disabled persons because I too have Asperger's and was presented in a similar situation, although in my case it was a 20 year old with neurological damage but nonetheless was gay and initiated the sexual contact.

Basically one has to have good judgment in determining whether or not a disabled person lacks the capability to consent to sex. And I don't think the average person has the ability to do so. So a case like this could have an affect on anyone, especially whose family is so over-protective that they will deny the individual the right to have sex.

The mentally retarded, TBI (traumatic brain injured), and most other similar persons still have sex drives, albeit inappropriate at times (in the case of Otis and Victor, at a theme park). But it's the family member who tries to step in and threaten to call cops saying that their MR/TBI "lack the ability to consent to sex," and now the other person involved, himself disabled, is worried about possibly being in trouble.
Since you admit to having Asperger's I dare say that you would still have a difficult time understanding why this was inappropriate and not a matter of consenting adults being entitled to enjoy sexual relationships. The difference between a TBI patient consenting to sex would depend on their level of impairment and ability to evaluate the situation, whereas an Asperer's patient has a whole diferent unique set of rules by which they function which may or not be the same as society, nor may they have the requisite discernment. Unfortunately, you may never understand why it was wrong and may always feel it was unfair that the relative interceeded.
 

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