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Signing Bonus? Return obligation?

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surfer349

Member
So here’s my situation. A little confusing. I worked for a sales/commission company over the summer. When I started, I was given a signing bonus of $4000 as extra incentive. I had to sign contract stating I would return the bonus in full if I did not reach a certain sales quota, or face collection and small claims court. After working for 2 months, I decided to pursue other jobs, not reaching the quota. Naturally, I wrote a check for the $4000, returning it to the company.
The area manager typed a letter on company letterhead stating that I [Adam] has returned the $4000 by check [check #] along with the date and both our signatures. Well, after about a month of no action, checking my account daily to see if they deposited my check, they finally call me saying that the check bounced/insufficient funds, and that I had to write them a new check.
The whole time, I had well over the $4000 sitting in that checking account, waiting for the check to clear. In addition, there is no record from my bank of any attempted deposit. I told them to mail the check back to me and that I would write a different check.

SO, here’s my question: Couldn’t they just try cashing/deposit the check again a few days later? Since I have a signed statement from the company saying I wrote them a check back for the $4000, with the exact check number, along with a photocopy of the check, do I have any legal obligation to re-write another check, after destroying the original? They told me they could submit the $4000 bonus to collections or take me to small claims court.
I can produce copies of the original bonus contract and the signed retuning statement if that would help. Let me know any advice.

-A
 
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Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
If the check was never cashed, then yes, you are obligated to replace it.

Definitely get the old check back...if you can't, at least put a stop payment on it.

ETA: This time, get a certified check
 

surfer349

Member
Proof?

The area manager typed a letter on company letterhead stating that I [Adam] has returned the $4000
Ok, but I still have a signed statement that I gave them the $ back. If this does get taken to small claims court, can't I just provide this to the judge and say its not my fault they messed up. I have a letter stating I returned the cash...

comments?
 

tranquility

Senior Member
It certainly would be evidence. All you will have to do is commit perjury and a fraud on the court and you might win.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
So here’s my situation. A little confusing. I worked for a sales/commission company over the summer. When I started, I was given a signing bonus of $4000 as extra incentive. I had to sign contract stating I would return the bonus in full if I did not reach a certain sales quota, or face collection and small claims court. After working for 2 months, I decided to pursue other jobs, not reaching the quota. Naturally, I wrote a check for the $4000, returning it to the company.
The area manager typed a letter on company letterhead stating that I [Adam] has returned the $4000 by check [check #] along with the date and both our signatures. Well, after about a month of no action, checking my account daily to see if they deposited my check, they finally call me saying that the check bounced/insufficient funds, and that I had to write them a new check.
The whole time, I had well over the $4000 sitting in that checking account, waiting for the check to clear. In addition, there is no record from my bank of any attempted deposit. I told them to mail the check back to me and that I would write a different check.

SO, here’s my question: Couldn’t they just try cashing/deposit the check again a few days later? Since I have a signed statement from the company saying I wrote them a check back for the $4000, with the exact check number, along with a photocopy of the check, do I have any legal obligation to re-write another check, after destroying the original? They told me they could submit the $4000 bonus to collections or take me to small claims court.
I can produce copies of the original bonus contract and the signed retuning statement if that would help. Let me know any advice.
**A: why have you not paid back the $4K?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

surfer349

Member
A: why have you not paid back the $4K?
umm, I did pay it back. I wrote a $4000 check right away.

============
All you will have to do is commit perjury and a fraud on the court and you might win
Where is the perjury/fraud? I gave them a check. I have a signed statement saying I gave them the check. I have a copy of the check. If they "lost" it mailed it back to me because of an error on their part, how am I responsible?

just trying to figure this whole thing out....
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
umm, I did pay it back. I wrote a $4000 check right away.

============


Where is the perjury/fraud? I gave them a check. I have a signed statement saying I gave them the check. I have a copy of the check. If they "lost" it mailed it back to me because of an error on their part, how am I responsible?

just trying to figure this whole thing out....
**A: you did not pay it back as the check was not negotiated. Stop playing games.
You have played this game with them and now you are trying it with us. I wish I was their attorney. It stops here. You owe them $4000 in cash. So freaking what if you spent the money. That's what you did. You spent the money and now are looking for excuses not to pay. Nice try but that little flimsy scheme of yours will not work. Your whole life has been a game of trying to beat the system. It stops right here, right now. Your not going to use your minor sales pitch on us. We got your number man. And it's up.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
Ok, but I still have a signed statement that I gave them the $ back. If this does get taken to small claims court, can't I just provide this to the judge and say its not my fault they messed up. I have a letter stating I returned the cash...

comments?
**A: you're a liar. You have no statement that you returned the cash.
 

surfer349

Member
Ok, look Homeguru,

I don't know what your deal is but maybe you should pull the stick out of your butt and stop making asinine assumptions without merit.

You spent the money and now are looking for excuses not to pay
Where do you get off saying I've spent the money? I've got an account with over $4k sitting there waiting for this scenario to be over. There is NO TRANSACTION HISTORY of any of this happening. The check is not in their possession and they are claiming it bounced, which is completely incorrect, as stated previously. Why would I lie about a detail like that when I am seeking accurate advice?
================
that little flimsy scheme of yours will not work. Your whole life has been a game of trying to beat the system
umm, what the hell are you babbling about? I'm trying to ascertain accurate advice about a company jerking me around with a check I wrote.
=====================
**A: you're a liar. You have no statement that you returned the cash.
Again, another stupid assumption. I have a signed statement saying I have returned the $4000 in full. Its not my fault if they failed to put it in their bank accounts. Again, why would I lie about a detail like this?

Does anyone else have any input besides the biased HomeGuru?

I guess another way to look at this is with a simplified situation. Let's say you owed your friend $20. You gave it to him and had him sign a piece of paper stating you gave him the cash. If he then loses the $ for whatever reason, he has no claim to come back to you saying you have to give him another $20 for his own error.

any thoughts?
 

cyjeff

Senior Member
umm, I did pay it back. I wrote a $4000 check right away.

============


Where is the perjury/fraud? I gave them a check. I have a signed statement saying I gave them the check. I have a copy of the check. If they "lost" it mailed it back to me because of an error on their part, how am I responsible?

just trying to figure this whole thing out....
Oh look.

That's cute.

Surfer wants to teach us how the law looks at a debt. See, he says, I gave them a check. Signed it myself and everything.

Sure, they didn't cash it.... but that check let me off the hook... if they lose it, I dont' have the debt anymore... he says.

Wow. You must enjoy court.
 

cyjeff

Senior Member
Oh, and you didn't give them the money.

A check is a piece of paper worth less than a nickel. It merely signifies the acknowledgment of a funds transfer.

That transfer didn't take place.

Do you really feel comfortable standing in front of a judge and saying, "They lost the check so I don't owe it anymore"?

And how will you answer when the judge asks you, "Why didn't you give them another check? YOu acknowledge you owe the return of funds.... and acknowledge that you never returned the funds... why is this a problem and why are you wasting the court's time over it"?

HG is correct... you are trying to figure out some way to keep the money that you rightfully owe.

Just stop.
 

surfer349

Member
I'm just trying to ascertain information. I don't understand how I am still responsible for this if they made an error. Can someone actually explain with out being condescending? If this did go to court, I have a document/receipt stating I returned the $$. Couldn't this be used as proof that I gave them the money, releasing me of responsibility?

And yea, it would be nice to keep the $4000. If you were presented with the option to pay a large sum of $$ or to keep it, wouldn't you or anyone else, if you had a valid defense?

on a different note, who are the moderators for the boards? I've been trying to find out to ask a certain question, but they don't seem to be labeled as such. Any help?
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
Ok, let's make this easy:
How much money have they received from you.

While answering this question, please keep in mind that a check, in and of itself, is NOT money.

I'm just trying to ascertain information. I don't understand how I am still responsible for this if they made an error. Can someone actually explain with out being condescending? If this did go to court, I have a document/receipt stating I returned the $$. Couldn't this be used as proof that I gave them the money, releasing me of responsibility?

And yea, it would be nice to keep the $4000. If you were presented with the option to pay a large sum of $$ or to keep it, wouldn't you or anyone else, if you had a valid defense?

on a different note, who are the moderators for the boards? I've been trying to find out to ask a certain question, but they don't seem to be labeled as such. Any help?
 

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