Son's mom wants to terminate her rights

[masopa]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

I have sole custody of my 10 y.o. son and have for the past almost 5 years. Mom was ordered to pay CS in 2009. She has never actually made a payment, but her tax refund has been garnished and she has been arrested for nonpayment and bailed out. She was arrested for the second time last week and has been in jail since Thursday because of another warrant for nonpayment of support.

I was contacted by her husband today and told that she wants to terminate her rights. These are her reasons:

• She is tired of "screwing over her family" (her husband, her child with him, and her stepkids) by leaving her family to visit with her own/my son.
• She says she cannot afford to make payments. She also just quit her job in January, though that doesn't really have any bearing since she never made payments to begin with.
• She feels like she and son are growing apart and it isn't worth coming to visit him (CO states she must come to our town and visit with son at her sister's house)
• She wants the arrears erased because she cannot pay them and her extended family refuses to help her out anymore. She says she will miss July visitation at least because she doesn't have the money for bail.

Years ago things were very acrimonious between us and at one point when she was very behind on CS I offered to her to terminate her rights since she wouldn't have to pay child support. That was years ago and I haven't thought about it since. Things have calmed down significantly. Now she wants to "take me up on that offer." She wants her CS arrears erased and her rights terminated.

Son currently visits her two weekends a month, year round, and the visits take place at her sister's house. There is a no contact order between her husband and my son, stemming from alleged abuse in 2008 and then a DV charge in 2010 from an incident with mom and her husband.

I don't know what to think. I feel like she's asking me to "buy her out." In my "offer" from a few years ago I told her that I would never stop her from seeing our son, even if she did terminate her rights. If this happens, I will not stop contact between them and there will still be opportunities to see each other. Then again, she apparently thinks it's not worth it to try to salvage a relationship with him...

On the other hand - I don't feel right "letting" her terminate her rights just so she doesn't have to pay CS. A judge wouldn't terminate someone's right just because they don't want to pay CS though. She has the means to, but chooses not to.

I'll be trying to talk to my attorney tomorrow, but my head is just swimming with all of this today. From what I've researched it looks like a GAL would be appointed and there would be a hearing before a judge. Mom and her husband seem to think we just snap our fingers and everything is done.

Any advice? Anything I should be sure to ask my attorney?

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

Your son deserves to be supported by his mother, whether she wants to have a relationship or not.

 

[Proserpina]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

I have sole custody of my 10 y.o. son and have for the past almost 5 years. Mom was ordered to pay CS in 2009. She has never actually made a payment, but her tax refund has been garnished and she has been arrested for nonpayment and bailed out. She was arrested for the second time last week and has been in jail since Thursday because of another warrant for nonpayment of support.

I was contacted by her husband today and told that she wants to terminate her rights. These are her reasons:

• She is tired of "screwing over her family" (her husband, her child with him, and her stepkids) by leaving her family to visit with her own/my son.
• She says she cannot afford to make payments. She also just quit her job in January, though that doesn't really have any bearing since she never made payments to begin with.
• She feels like she and son are growing apart and it isn't worth coming to visit him (CO states she must come to our town and visit with son at her sister's house)
• She wants the arrears erased because she cannot pay them and her extended family refuses to help her out anymore. She says she will miss July visitation at least because she doesn't have the money for bail.

Years ago things were very acrimonious between us and at one point when she was very behind on CS I offered to her to terminate her rights since she wouldn't have to pay child support. That was years ago and I haven't thought about it since. Things have calmed down significantly. Now she wants to "take me up on that offer." She wants her CS arrears erased and her rights terminated.

Son currently visits her two weekends a month, year round, and the visits take place at her sister's house. There is a no contact order between her husband and my son, stemming from alleged abuse in 2008 and then a DV charge in 2010 from an incident with mom and her husband.

I don't know what to think. I feel like she's asking me to "buy her out." In my "offer" from a few years ago I told her that I would never stop her from seeing our son, even if she did terminate her rights. If this happens, I will not stop contact between them and there will still be opportunities to see each other. Then again, she apparently thinks it's not worth it to try to salvage a relationship with him...

On the other hand - I don't feel right "letting" her terminate her rights just so she doesn't have to pay CS. A judge wouldn't terminate someone's right just because they don't want to pay CS though. She has the means to, but chooses not to.

I'll be trying to talk to my attorney tomorrow, but my head is just swimming with all of this today. From what I've researched it looks like a GAL would be appointed and there would be a hearing before a judge. Mom and her husband seem to think we just snap our fingers and everything is done.

Any advice? Anything I should be sure to ask my attorney?

Not going to happen unless there is a stepparent adoption (in your state).

 

[stealth2]

Unless you have a spouse who is willing to adopt your child (something she should SERIOUSLY consider the ramifications of)? No one is terminating Mom's rights.

 

[Ladyback1]

WILL giving up her rights really erase the arrears?
It won't in my state and many others, I'm sure. So, she'd only be able to skip out on future support payments!

As much as mom may want to give up her rights, the courts will probably not grant it.

 

[masopa]

Thanks for the replies.

I understand and agree that my son deserves support from his mom.

I wasn't sure about the stepparent adoption part. I didn't see that in any of the statutes that I was looking through. However, my wife would be willing to adopt. She has known and helped me raise my son since he was born.

As far as the CS arrears go, I would have to sign off to erase them. This is another reason I feel like she's trying to get me to "buy her out."

At first I thought this was largely because of money, but I've told her that if she were just making token payments, or even called the CS agency to work something out, she could avoid jail. She doesn't want to though. I don't understand it though.

 

[single317dad]

Not going to happen unless there is a stepparent adoption (in your state).

To expand a bit for OP's benefit:

The reason most states (47 of them, if I remember correctly) do not allow voluntary TPR without a stepparent adoption is that a child is born with two parents. That's two people who can support him, financially, emotionally, and help him develop. Removing one of them is not in the best interest of the child (or the State, who many times is left picking up the slack). Unless someone else is willing to legally acquire the rights and responsibilities of parenting that child, via a stepparent adoption, then voluntary TPR by one or both parents is not allowed. If your wife is indeed willing to adopt, then the court will be much more receptive. A good attorney can get this done for you with Mom's consent.

This is by no means meant as dissent to Proserpina's legally correct answer; I simply wanted to enlighten OP somewhat.

 

[masopa]

Thanks for your replies everyone.

I spoke to my attorney and he advised that a judge would see this situation for what it is - mom just trying to "buy" her way out of jail. He said I should tell mom that she needs to pay the back support/bail and then we can revisit this issue in a couple months if she still really wants to.

 

[Zigner]

However, my wife would be willing to adopt.

Then, you should seriously consider if that's the route you really want to go. Why? Because being "willing to adopt" is not the same as "would love to adopt" or "loves my son and would want nothing more than to be a his legal parent."



PS: I do understand that a textual medium such as this has its limitations, so your statement above may not express the true situation.

 

[LdiJ]

Thanks for your replies everyone.

I spoke to my attorney and he advised that a judge would see this situation for what it is - mom just trying to "buy" her way out of jail. He said I should tell mom that she needs to pay the back support/bail and then we can revisit this issue in a couple months if she still really wants to.

If her husband is the only one with any job or money, how is she going to pay the back support/bail to get out of jail if her husband refuses to help?

 

[masopa]

If her husband is the only one with any job or money, how is she going to pay the back support/bail to get out of jail if her husband refuses to help?

Well, according to my attorney that's neither my fault nor my problem.

While I don't want her to miss a visit, there's not much I can do about it aside from signing a document forgiving the arrears - which I'm not going to do just so she can get out of jail. This isn't the first time she has been arrested for nonpayment. She knew what the stakes were and still didn't pay CS; instead she quit her job.

She has 2.5 weeks until the next time she's supposed to be pick up my son for visitation. We'll see what happens in that time. I don't believe her family will let her sit in jail.

 

[I'mTheFather]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

Son currently visits her two weekends a month, year round, and the visits take place at her sister's house.

I don't know what to think. I feel like she's asking me to "buy her out." In my "offer" from a few years ago I told her that I would never stop her from seeing our son, even if she did terminate her rights. If this happens, I will not stop contact between them and there will still be opportunities to see each other.

What is your goal here? I'm very confused.

I don't understand why the CS is such a stickler for you if you plan to allow mom to continue a relationship with son after a TPR.

What's the point? What is the end-goal here?

 

[LdiJ]

Well, according to my attorney that's neither my fault nor my problem.

While I don't want her to miss a visit, there's not much I can do about it aside from signing a document forgiving the arrears - which I'm not going to do just so she can get out of jail. This isn't the first time she has been arrested for nonpayment. She knew what the stakes were and still didn't pay CS; instead she quit her job.

She has 2.5 weeks until the next time she's supposed to be pick up my son for visitation. We'll see what happens in that time. I don't believe her family will let her sit in jail.

Of course its not your problem...and I asked that question not because of visitation, but because I was making a different point.

If someone cannot or will not pay child support, and is determined not to do so, then collecting from them is going to be virtually impossible. You can make sure she gets jailed for non-payment, you can separate her permanently from your child, you can do all manner of things, but collecting from her may be impossible.

On top of that, I suspect that her husband has a lot to do with this...and her other child as well. She basically has to choose between them and your mutual child, and I suspect that her husband seriously resents that. Is he right to feel that way? Mostly likely not at all, but that doesn't change human nature and the fact that he most likely does feel that way.

 

[masopa]

What is your goal here? I'm very confused.

I don't understand why the CS is such a stickler for you if you plan to allow mom to continue a relationship with son after a TPR.

What's the point? What is the end-goal here?

Honestly, three years ago when I made the "offer" I wanted her out of his life. She was in a relationship with - had actually just married - a man who abused my son. She had no role in his day-to-day life, I didn't think he was safe with her, etc. etc. it doesn't matter NOW. She has calmed down significantly in the past few years (as have I, I suppose), and there is a no-contact order between her husband and my son now to keep him safe. She has to stay at her sister's house to visit with my son, and things have been going smoothly for a couple of years.

I don't have an end-goal. I was ok with how things have been going. It's she that wants out. Her end goal is to not pay child support anymore, and apparently she wants to cut down her visitation too. I'm just trying to figure out if that's a good idea. For anybody involved.

I just can't figure out if she's trying to abdicate her financial responsibilities or if she's really done with having a presence in our son's life. If she's really done then I can't force her to be a parent.

Of course its not your problem...and I asked that question not because of visitation, but because I was making a different point.

If someone cannot or will not pay child support, and is determined not to do so, then collecting from them is going to be virtually impossible. You can make sure she gets jailed for non-payment, you can separate her permanently from your child, you can do all manner of things, but collecting from her may be impossible.

On top of that, I suspect that her husband has a lot to do with this...and her other child as well. She basically has to choose between them and your mutual child, and I suspect that her husband seriously resents that. Is he right to feel that way? Mostly likely not at all, but that doesn't change human nature and the fact that he most likely does feel that way.

Right. She can pay CS but chooses not to. I can't force her to pay it. The CS is set up through the state since she is on public assistance and I have to admit they are really on top of enforcement. They have tried garnishing her wages twice before but she just quits her job once it goes into effect.

This may be the case about her husband and her family. I can't imagine feeling like I had to choose between my son and my other child. I don't want to move ahead with anything until I can talk to her, which I can't while she is in jail.

 

[LdiJ]

Honestly, three years ago when I made the "offer" I wanted her out of his life. She was in a relationship with - had actually just married - a man who abused my son. She had no role in his day-to-day life, I didn't think he was safe with her, etc. etc. it doesn't matter NOW. She has calmed down significantly in the past few years (as have I, I suppose), and there is a no-contact order between her husband and my son now to keep him safe. She has to stay at her sister's house to visit with my son, and things have been going smoothly for a couple of years.

I don't have an end-goal. I was ok with how things have been going. It's she that wants out. Her end goal is to not pay child support anymore, and apparently she wants to cut down her visitation too. I'm just trying to figure out if that's a good idea. For anybody involved.

I just can't figure out if she's trying to abdicate her financial responsibilities or if she's really done with having a presence in our son's life. If she's really done then I can't force her to be a parent.



Right. She can pay CS but chooses not to. I can't force her to pay it. The CS is set up through the state since she is on public assistance and I have to admit they are really on top of enforcement. They have tried garnishing her wages twice before but she just quits her job once it goes into effect.

This may be the case about her husband and her family. I can't imagine feeling like I had to choose between my son and my other child. I don't want to move ahead with anything until I can talk to her, which I can't while she is in jail.

And she can't get out of jail until she pays the child support bail...its a real conundrum.