Spousal Support Modification

[gasgirl]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Nevada
My Husband pays $7250/month in spousal support to ex-wife...she has NEVER been employed since the divorce, despite getting certifications in Cosmetology, Real Estate and Computer Drafting.

My husband and I own a business, both working, and since January, have seen a 40% decrease in income. In addition, the ex-wife now has live-in boyfriend (they even wear "wedding rings"), who is also unemployed...

Can my husband petition for a decrease in alimony? We tried getting her to accept the remainder of his 401k ($200,000) in a lump settlement, but she will not budge...

 

[Proserpina]

What does the court order say with regards to cohabitation and/or modification?

How long is the alimony meant to last?

And I have to ask...

Is that figure a typo?!

(I'm crossing my fingers here hoping to gawd it is a typo)

 

[LdiJ]

What does the court order say with regards to cohabitation and/or modification?

How long is the alimony meant to last?

And I have to ask...

Is that figure a typo?!

(I'm crossing my fingers here hoping to gawd it is a typo)

If its not a typo, then I have to wonder why she is posting on an internet message forum rather than talking to an attorney.

 

[Bali Hai]

If its not a typo, then I have to wonder why she is posting on an internet message forum rather than talking to an attorney.

Because attorneys cost money. The ex-wife is obviously taking all their money!!

 

[gasgirl]

All tapped out!

No, no typo there. Marriage duration was 19 yrs, total alimony duration is 10 yrs, under 7 to go.

Originally, spousal support was to be 33% of AGI (adjusted gross income), with a minimum of $5000 and max of $12,500. She reacted to our petition for sole custody by demanding a FORENSIC AUDIT of our finances, claiming we were hiding money...not true.

SO, because custody batlle legal fees were mounting (over $50,000), we agreed to flat fee of $7250.

Currntly, this sum amounts to 70% of his total income. Until recently, when we got custody, we were also paying $1860 in child support...

We are currently considering cashing out part of a 401k just to pay her alimony.

Did I mention she is deliberately unemployed?

There is no provision in the SS Order for Cohabitation or Modification.

 

[LdiJ]

No, no typo there. Marriage duration was 19 yrs, total alimony duration is 10 yrs, under 7 to go.

Originally, spousal support was to be 33% of AGI (adjusted gross income), with a minimum of $5000 and max of $12,500. She reacted to our petition for sole custody by demanding a FORENSIC AUDIT of our finances, claiming we were hiding money...not true.

SO, because custody batlle legal fees were mounting (over $50,000), we agreed to flat fee of $7250.

Currntly, this sum amounts to 70% of his total income. Until recently, when we got custody, we were also paying $1860 in child support...

We are currently considering cashing out part of a 401k just to pay her alimony.

Did I mention she is deliberately unemployed?

There is no provision in the SS Order for Cohabitation or Modification.

If there is no provision for cohabitation or modification then he is stuck paying it for the full 10 years.

 

[Bali Hai]

No, no typo there. Marriage duration was 19 yrs, total alimony duration is 10 yrs, under 7 to go.

Originally, spousal support was to be 33% of AGI (adjusted gross income), with a minimum of $5000 and max of $12,500. She reacted to our petition for sole custody by demanding a FORENSIC AUDIT of our finances, claiming we were hiding money...not true.

SO, because custody batlle legal fees were mounting (over $50,000), we agreed to flat fee of $7250.

Currntly, this sum amounts to 70% of his total income. Until recently, when we got custody, we were also paying $1860 in child support...

We are currently considering cashing out part of a 401k just to pay her alimony.

Did I mention she is deliberately unemployed?

I am utterly SHOCKED to hear this!!

There is no provision in the SS Order for Cohabitation or Modification.

This unfortunately is what happens when someone agrees to pay alimony.

Had your husband forced the judge to order alimony, there are probably statutes in your state law that allow for a modification hearing when unforseen changes happen.

 

[Proserpina]

Yup, what LdiJ said.

(and I bet ex's attorney is quite happy about the situation too....)

 

[gasgirl]

Do-It-Yourself Divorce

There were no attorneys involved with the Divorce...they sat down and hashed it out themselves.

According to my research, as the SS agreement has no statement, positive or negative concerning cohabitation, we CAN, according to Nevada law, petition for modification on 2 grounds:

1. More than 20% Unintentional loss in income
2. Cohabitation with someone who can, but is not contributing to the household expenses.

Anyone have experience with this? We have never missed or shrted any SS or CS payment-EVER.

 

[Proserpina]

There were no attorneys involved with the Divorce...they sat down and hashed it out themselves.

According to my research, as the SS agreement has no statement, positive or negative concerning cohabitation, we CAN, according to Nevada law, petition for modification on 2 grounds:

1. More than 20% Unintentional loss in income
2. Cohabitation with someone who can, but is not contributing to the household expenses.

Anyone have experience with this? We have never missed or shrted any SS or CS payment-EVER.

Start here: NRS: CHAPTER 125 - DISSOLUTION OF MARRIAGE

Scroll down to NRS 125.150

Get that modification started!

This bit is not legal advice whatsoever:

I'm sorry - but that amount of alimony per month, with the recipient being able-bodied, is just preposterous. But that's just my humble little opinion.

 

[LdiJ]

Start here: NRS: CHAPTER 125 - DISSOLUTION OF MARRIAGE

Scroll down to NRS 125.150

Get that modification started!

This bit is not legal advice whatsoever:

I'm sorry - but that amount of alimony per month, with the recipient being able-bodied, is just preposterous. But that's just my humble little opinion.

It sounds preposterous to us, but it isn't really...not based on the length of the marriage and the previous income I am able to extrapolate from the numbers here.

Its 70% of his current income, so his current income is about 10350. That income is 40% down from his previous income, so his previous income was about 17250. Assuming a little fudging on the OP's part...I would say that she was awarded between 35% and 40% of his income for 10 years.

Now, my guess is that there is a little bit of tax creativity involved too...I suspect that she did NOT get a share of the business, as she should have, and that it figured into the alimony calculation. Its also possible that the business is paying a generous salary to the new wife, (since she indicates that she is working in the business) thus reducing the husband's income.

So...all in all there could be many reasons why its not preposterous, and reasons why there were no provisions for cohabitation or modification. That also may be why hubby isn't the one here posting questions.

Again, this is something that the OP's husband should be discussing with an attorney...and possibly a tax professional as well if any of my hunches are even remotely correct.

The thing could be truly preposterous, is that the ex wife is not paying attention to the fact that the alimony will end in ten years, and isn't working towards future self sufficiency. However, we don't know that she isn't. She may be socking a healthy portion of the alimony away for the future.

 

[Proserpina]

It sounds preposterous to us, but it isn't really...not based on the length of the marriage and the previous income I am able to extrapolate from the numbers here.

Its 70% of his current income, so his current income is about 10350. That income is 40% down from his previous income, so his previous income was about 17250. Assuming a little fudging on the OP's part...I would say that she was awarded between 35% and 40% of his income for 10 years.

Now, my guess is that there is a little bit of tax creativity involved too...I suspect that she did NOT get a share of the business, as she should have, and that it figured into the alimony calculation. Its also possible that the business is paying a generous salary to the new wife, (since she indicates that she is working in the business) thus reducing the husband's income.

So...all in all there could be many reasons why its not preposterous, and reasons why there were no provisions for cohabitation or modification. That also may be why hubby isn't the one here posting questions.

Again, this is something that the OP's husband should be discussing with an attorney...and possibly a tax professional as well if any of my hunches are even remotely correct.

The thing could be truly preposterous, is that the ex wife is not paying attention to the fact that the alimony will end in ten years, and isn't working towards future self sufficiency. However, we don't know that she isn't. She may be socking a healthy portion of the alimony away for the future.

Yes...you do have a point. But still....

 

[LdiJ]

Yes...you do have a point. But still....

Let me give you another example...lets say that the ex wife worked with her husband in the business, from day one, with or without a salary...and did not get a share of the business in the divorce. Would you still be saying "But still...."?

Please think about what I am saying. Its not at ALL unusual in a situation like this one for a property settlement to be disguised as alimony...or for a spouse to accept alimony in lieu of a proper property settlement.

Or for a spouse keeping an asset to want to disguise paying out the other spouse's share as alimony.

If dad was raking in 18k or better a month (profit) when the divorce happened, then there is almost no chance that this agreement didn't end up being in lieu of some part of the property settlement. Otherwise, 18k a month in profit would have resulted in a serious lump sum payoff to the ex for the equity in the business.

 

[gasgirl]

Clarification

1. Our business was started after his divorce.
2. He was an employee prior to divorce. Had no business to split. She got 1/2 of his retirement and cash, ALL proceeds from the sale of marital home (which she put down on a new home-which he co-signed the mortgage for), and most furniture, and a car (which was paid off)
3. My husband and I make the SAME salary. No, we are not shifting income, or being creative:in fact, we had the SAME accountant until he fired her for bugging him about our financial information.

As for the Ex-wife, she has had a string of men who have sucked her dry-she apparently has a Jaguar she is paying for (which she bought for some guy and then had to chase him down to get it back), as well as $40,000 in credit card bills,etc. She may try to file bankruptcy, as I believe she has tax issues/liens and is currently CASHING her alimony checks to avoid levys on her bank accounts.
In addition, she is trying to sell her house by short sale (at $175k loss), which is being denied by the bank because my husband is not willing to take that hit on our credit. So, we had to get a court order to allow us to make her mortgage payment (she is starting to pay late, or only partially) and deduct it from her Spousal support.

Clearly our money is going to good use...as I stated before, she has Real Estate License, Cosmetology License, and Associates in Computer Drafting, yet she refuses to be employed.

My husband was also awarded Child Support after we received custody (new live-in boyfriend is Child Sex Offender), which she did not pay, and we were allowed to deduct from Alimony

 

[Proserpina]

Let me give you another example...lets say that the ex wife worked with her husband in the business, from day one, with or without a salary...and did not get a share of the business in the divorce. Would you still be saying "But still...."?

Please think about what I am saying. Its not at ALL unusual in a situation like this one for a property settlement to be disguised as alimony...or for a spouse to accept alimony in lieu of a proper property settlement.

Or for a spouse keeping an asset to want to disguise paying out the other spouse's share as alimony.

If dad was raking in 18k or better a month (profit) when the divorce happened, then there is almost no chance that this agreement didn't end up being in lieu of some part of the property settlement. Otherwise, 18k a month in profit would have resulted in a serious lump sum payoff to the ex for the equity in the business.

(I saw OP posted below this one but didn't read it yet - bear that in mind lol)

Yes, you're right. I did - admittedly - sort of jump to conclusions and I really shouldn't have done so. You've made excellent points that I didn't take into consideration until you pointed them out - and even if those points don't apply here it was still an angle I should have thought about before jumping in.