Spousal support

[katbird]

Anyone who can give advice,
Fiance filed for divorce on Dec 22nd 2000. He has finally gottena response from his wife. She is asking for temporary and permanentspousal support and that the marital debts be split equaitably, plus her attorney fees and court cost be paid. She has less than 1207.00 going out a month and makes 3,333.00 a month. She makes $40,000 a year.She has an Ira account valued at 1,721.00 an deferred comp valued at 14,804.00 and a PERS valued at 28,456.00. She has stocks valued at 5,000. She is claiming she only has on bank account with 600.00 in it. She has an loan on a car that is valued at 15,000. She stands to inherit 3 properties value unknown and a suffiecnt amount of money that she has not acknowledged in the divorce as yet all though the attorney has given her until Feb 12th to produce that and other information. My fiance makes around 90,000 a year> We have 5 minor children living in our home, 2 of which are step-children to my fiance and 3 of which are ours together. We have over 3,600 dollars going out a month and that does not includ alot of things that I think needs to be factored in such as school fees school lunches preschool fees entertainmaent activities that are school realted and prescriptions for one child who has attention deficit and takes ritalin, that in itself is 50.00 a month. We receive onlt 15.00 a week child support. I don't feeel that this woman should notbe entitled to any spousal support or any attorney fees to be paid for her. She is living pretty much free with her parents and sheis working as an corrections officer with the county jail, so she is capable of making a good living and supporting herself which she has done for the past 16 years as that is when they seperated. He did pay her 600.00 a week for the first 4 years they were separated so she could stay home and raise their son. Plus took her to the grocery store weekly above the 600.00 he gave her. He paid have of the son"s collage education and half of the son's first car. I feel he has in no way neglected her and has done a suffient job of fullfilling his obligations prior to Her getting a job.She wants part of his retirement plan which has only been estavlished in the last two years. He is currently paying his boss back a loan taken out to pay Irs. He pays 150.00 a week for that. That was not factored in as an expense either. We had to take out a loan to pay for the attorney and we have to pay that back. I think this woman is seeking this out of revenge. We reside in ohio, so any advice you can give will be helpful. The question I need answered is a 2 part one. Is she entitled to spousal support and can He ask she pay him spousal support?

 

[rynswrap]

I understand what you are going through. It seems to me that justice is very unfair when it comes to fathers and men in general. I am in the same situation but for three years. She signed a agreement to end this with a no fault and acepted a payment of 2000.00 and was willing and did take 200 a month for 6 months but then refuse to go to court. Next thing you know then she got a lawyer and now unless his ex leaves him broke, she wont be happy. She works now and has so for two years. She wouldn't work despite the debts they made together. She wants to push that off on him and ask for a unbeliveable amount of alimony. He has no kids with this woman. He lost his job because he couldnt travel and pay for buisness trips because of ruining his credit. I think judges are unfair and I believe that when a man doesnt work and make money how do you make him pay. Woman would get money from men if they had kids,even if they aren't the man's. Shouldnt they take into consideration the expenses he has to live on with and what kinda life he has to provide for his real kids. We also have 5 kids from different marriage. I wish the best to you and will be watching to see if you get a answer.

 

[katbird]

Thanks for understanding

I really appreciate your reply,it is really rough and I feel that since this woman has supported herself for the past 12 years without any help from him why should she be entitled to anything from him now just because a divorce is in the process. The attorney has said we can contest the spousal support on the grounds that she has done a fine job of taking care of herself in the past and should be able to continue to do so considering that she is college educated and has a good income. We are hoping that once the court date comes up to contest spousal support she will just sign the papers and be done with it. There is really nothing for her to gain in this divorce, she is only alienating her grown son from the marriage as he is siding with us on this issue, he made a comment to his dad that his mom is acting like a bitch. it is going to cost her and us money we can't afford to put out and that really puts a hardship on everyone involved. She is doing this out of revenge because she can't have him back and because she feels she should take him for everything he is worth just to prove a point, that she can be greedy and give it to him where it counts. There is no other logical reason for her to be asking for all she wants. If my fiance was to stop the divorce things would continue on the way they have been. She would be still taking care of herself without his support, so why should this divorce change things. they have had no contact with each other in the past 4 or 5 years. They both live separate lives. The only thing stopping them from being divorced is a court order.They are living as if they are already divorced, she has her life and he has his. There is no joint property to split or bank accounts or anything pertenent of monetary value to split. There is no marital debts no small children nothing.The only thing stopping it is her willingness to cooperate and sign the papers. she told him once that she wanted a divorce so she could go on with her life but didn't have the money for an attorney and if he would pay for it she would gladly sign the papers, well now that he has done that she refuses to sign anything and acts like a wounded woman on the warpath. Senseless if you ask me, and for what. In the end nobody actually wins as we are both going to be out of a lot of money and she won't stop the divorce from finally going through. Well any way just needed to spout off and release some of the tension Thank you for understanding I really needed that right now. katbird

 

[rynswrap]

Re: Thanks for understanding

Katbird, I feel as if I am walking in your shoes. I really do. It is called Lazy and Greed and they are very happy to make us miserable if they can. What comes around goes around and I have to believe that she will get her's someday. I just feel that they really do hate themselves. They don't like that the men are happy and that really makes them mad. They don't want them but don't want them to have anyone else. It is a called bitter. Like the senior member said, It doesn't mean that she will get what she wants. You can prove she can work and is well educated, thats what he must do to fight this. It's hard to sit back and watch the person you love go through this but they have to end it to start your new life together. Just remember the love you both found and treasure it because it is so hard to find. You will be in my prayers and I hope for us both this ends with little damage. I believe men get a bad deal when it comes to alimony. If I could, I would love to start some kinda action against woman who abuse the system for there own greed. I am a woman and I see this. I believe child support is a different matter. Your in my prayers.

 

[katbird]

thanks from the bottom of my heart

Oh you both are soo nice i want to thank you both. My fiance has a court date set for March 6th for the hearing to contest the spousal support. I am praying all will go well. The other two hearings aren't set until june and july. This is going to be along drawn out process but I feel with all my heart this will be an end to a bitter battle, and I do hope that we all come out with more than a smaller wallet. I too feel giving child support should be expected but i also feel that spousal support given to an able bodied person is way to much to ask of one person, may back in the 50's or 60's when womaen were primaryily stay at home mothers but this is the new millenium and women have lots of opportunities to work and become educated enough to take care of them selves,without a man to do it for them. I would be embarassed my self to ask for a handout from a former spouse, if I was capable of taking care of myself. I guess I,m just independent that way. When me and my ex divorced I had a minium paying job and 2 kids to support and I gave him the house and just ask that I get the kids and our personal belongings. I just wanted it ended quickly and without a long drawn out bitter battle.We were incompatible fromn the beginning and we grew apart after almost 10 years. We parted on good enough terms and that was that, but some people try to hold on for a lifetime to something they don't really want, just the satisfaction of dragging them down. Thank you so much!!!!!
katbird

 

[hurtin4certain]

I read all of the replies to your original "question" and recalled a time when my feelings were along the same line as yours. But unfortunately, I feel much differently now. I've been married for 17 years, no children because we couldn't have any. I followed my husband from duty station to duty station every 3 years and had to quit jobs and find new ones, which was often a difficult task. A few years before he retired from the USMC he became a reserve police officer and was immediately hooked to the point of spending a great deal of his free time working as an unpaid police officer ... Then he retired from the USMC and became a paid police officer and joined the ranks of stressed out cops full time. I never wanted him to be a cop, I tried to talk him out of it, but he wouldn't listen to anyone ... He wanted what he wanted. Then just as things were at a point financially where we could finally buy the house of our dreams in SoCal and travel and vacation and really enjoy our lives, he goes through a mid-life crisis and wants out of the marriage, refuses counseling and leaves ... he just up and leaves. I've been paying all of the bills for 17 months now and he's lead me to believe on several occasions that we still had a chance of working things out ... Well, I think I'm done waiting ... even though I cannot seem to fall out of love with him ... He made $106,000 last year, and I made $43,000 ... and you don't think that there should be a more equitable arrangement? Do you really think that it's fair for him to kick me to the curb without any financial consideration after the life we shared, the life that we had planned to have after supporting him all of these years through deployments to foreign countries that lasted anywhere from 6 to 10 months, him going off to a variety of schools that lasted between 3 months and 6 months, him going off to a war and being gone for a year, not to mention the worry and fear of him being a patrol cop every night and giving up the ability to really firmly establish myself in a career instead of a long line of jobs that I had to find and then quit ... without equalling things out financially? Is that fair? I don't want the divorce, I want to work things out ... I still love him with all of my heart and these feelings are so deep that I was actually hurt by some of the things that you and your other respondents said. There are always 3 sides to every story. What happens when this happens to you?

 

[rynswrap]

understand

I understand how hurt you are, and as hurtful as this might sound, it was your choice in making the decision to follow his career and the choices you made for yourself. Love is a powerful thing, I understand that. Every case is different for sure. We were just stating our own cases and it is not personal. Yours is a case of desertion. He deserted you and the bills and all his obligations for his own selfish needs. Mid-life crisis! I believe you are giving him an excuse. You asked the question of what would I do if it were me? First if I was left with all the bills and a lot of maybes and promises of coming back to me, I would have set a date for him to make a decision and hold him to it. After that if he just couldn't make up his mind I would have a lawyer and get him for desertion. But not everybody's situation are the same. You have to do what is right for yourself. It is men like that who give other men bad names. I myself was married to a man of 20 years and spent most of that marriage in the armed forces. I went on deployment to cold places and the to hot nasty places and living on base was no kinda life either. It is a very hard life, for me and that's my own experience. I made the choice that I was not going to put my crying kids though it anymore and we bought a house. After his military career I supported his career and we started to get where we were seeing light and he decides that the bottle and friends were more important. I was starting to lose everything. His checks were going to his friend and booze. I believe that although he needs to take care of his three children, I can work and make my own living, and I do. It is better that he doesn't give me money because that just ties him to me and I don't want that. I want to go on with my life. Like you I was very angry he put in the position he did. I had so much hate it was ugly. He made this choice. I couldn't make him, It takes two to make it work. It doesn't work if only one wants to try. Good news is that I do know that you are entitled to half his retirement pay by law. It is a Federal Law you get half of it since you were with him 17 years and thoughout his military career. Now as we said, each case takes on its own personality. Just because you chose to support his career and do all these thing he wanted, does he really owe you all your life? I believe we are responsible for our own choices in life, good or bad. Are you entitled money...YES.. Sure you deserve half of everything and some money to get you started and his retirement will be part of that. I believe in equality. I have a complaint of bitter lazy woman who want to take them for everything and they don't want them but don't want them to be happy either. Not like your situation. They treated them like dirt. They want to not work and get paid for breathing. As I said before, all cases are not the same. I been there, I gone though this and believe me, I feel really bad in your case because one sided love is really hard. In OUR cases, we think these hard working and giving men were cheated and getting a raw deal and you have to admit, a lot of men do, but your man gets what he gets...I believe what comes around goes around. The rest of your life is up to you. Not his choice but yours. You deserve better. I will pray for you

 

[hurtin4certain]

Thank you so much for your kind words. To be honest with you I am scared to death. I still can't imagine what my life is going to be like without him in it. I know that he has been very disrespectful of me and has been downright mean to me over this last year and a half, but when he came running with his W-2s a few weeks ago for me to do "our" taxes for a joint return because I have all of the write-offs, I knew that I shouldn't do it, but I could not bring myself to be mean about it. I kept him from having to pay an additional $5,000 plus underpayment penalties. I've kept this separation and impending divorce from my family (we don't live near them) and have kept it from my employers and co-workers and from most of our friends because I didn't want them to have ill thoughts towards him. He hasn't even talked to his parents in almost 2 years and refuses their visits (they come to San Diego from Atlanta), won't respond to emails and won't return their phone calls. We (his family and I) don't know where he lives, only that he lives with another male cop. He drops by here on occasion unannounced while he is on duty ... The only means available to me for contacting him is through email and through his voice mail at work ... It's just so damned hard. I was diagnosed 3 years ago with adult onset juvenile arthritis and 2 years ago found out I have osteonecrosis in both knees ... to top that off, I've been on medication for severe depression since he left. I got laid off of my job on November 6th due to the economic slow-down and haven't been able to find work yet ... and all the while, I've asked for absolutely nothing from him. I've still been the one to do all of the giving. To look at me, to know me, people think that I'm this confident woman that has the world by the tail, but it's all an act. And I'm afraid that if I let the truth be known, I'll completely fall apart. I'm 45 years old and not getting any younger ... and I'm just scared. I know that it was my choice to follow him and support him throughout his military career ... but I did it for our future together and now he has pulled the rug out from under me and I just can't wrap my brain around it.

 

[katbird]

I feel for you

i really feel for you and understand the pain you must be going through. I know what your hubby did was unforgiveable, but you see my fiance supported his wife for 4 years after the separation and she certainlt wasn't hurting for financial help as her parents are millionaires and took her in to live after they separated and are leving two properties to her and a considerable amount of money upon thier death. She can't act as if she never seen it coming because there were numerous problems leading up to him leaving her. She chose to bury her head in the sand and now after 16 years she still feels there is a chance for them to get back together??????let's be realistic here, they have no contact between them at all and He and I have been together the last 8 years and have 2 children together, plus he has been raising my other 3 children with me the past 8 years. What is the chance of him and her getting together after all this time regardless of the circumstances???? I can truely understand how she may still have feelings for him to some extent, but after 16 years they have both changed from what they were then to what they are now and neither of them will be the same two people they were back 16 years ago. she has become a differnt person as well as he has. You can just pick up where you left off and think things will be the same because they won't. But really I do feel for you but my fiance never deserted his soon to be ex, they made decisions together about property and whatnot after they separated and he did pay her 600.00 a week for 4 years so she could stay home and raise his son. He never left her high and dry. And all the marital debts were paid when he left her. Any debts that have occured since the separation she made herself and he himself. She has been living well since the separation and doing good for herself. She really has no reason to be this greedy towards him other than just revenge that she can't have him back. But even if I wasn't in the picture he still wouldn't take her back because they tried that 10 years ago and she had a list of " If you Do this" and "If you do that" a mile long and he told her then if you can't accept me as I am then it won't work and they split before they even got together. Any how I have been through a divorce before but I decided I wanted the divorce because I got tired of being beat up by my ex husband and I had no job no place to go and had to figure out what i was going to do with 2 daughter to raise on my own. I found a minium paying job and rented two rooms off a lady until I could save enough money to get my own place and it was really hard but we did it for 3 years before I met my fiance. You can go on and make it if you really let go and say I'm better of without that person and If they don't want me then why am I hanging on to them . There is a better thing out there waiting for you around the next corner you just have to open you mind and heart to it or it will pass you by. remember you did nothing to cause this and if this man really loved you at all he wouldn't have done you this way and let him go his merry way cause you deserve better. I know it is hard to feel this way right now but you will and you will be happy again.

 

[hurtin4certain]

Like you mentioned, knowing things in your head is one thing. Knowing them and accepting them in your heart is quite another. Right here, right now, I feel as though my heart may never mend. When I married him, when we went on our adventures together, I never even dreamed that I would be in this place today ... So who knows what the future holds. Some day I may be thankful that he decided to leave, and I'll look forward to that day.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts and wishes with me.

 

[rynswrap]

Dear Hurtin, my heart goes out to you. I hurt so much when I got divorced, my heart hurt. I really felt that I was going to die. Something in me died and I hated it. I cried for 3 straight months. As time past, the anger got more intense.I wondered how I was going to live and how was I going to feed my kids and the biggest question was likes yours. How did we get to this point? Like you, I never dreamed after 20 years that we would get divorced and at the age I was, what my life was going to be like. I found out alot about me that year. I stayed in my house and hardly worked, and went online. I talked to other people only online. I didn't want to socialize with my friends and neighbors. My friend told me it was unhealthy for me to retreat to my house, but it was my only way to grive my death of divorce. Thats what I called it. I am now the most happiest woman alive in my eyes. After a long pity party (which we all have to go though and rightly so), I met this wonderful man that I believe is my soul mate, and his ex wife is a fool to have treated him the way she did. Not being my ex's victim anymore saved my life. The only thing I can say is hang in there. Peace should come soon. Maybe a year, maybe a month, who knows. God has a funny way of doing things in your life when its is right. I believe he has a sense of humor, which I didn't find so funny at the time. I just want you to know that you and Kat and I have something in common. It is just Kat and I are further along than you. You can start over and you deserve better treatment than you are getting. Stay strong and firm! Kat, I just wanted to say good luck on your court date. I pray you get the out come that you want. Please do the same for me.

 

[hurtin4certain]

Thank you so much for your kind thoughts and words. I guess that I'm going to try to look at today as the first day of the rest of my life. It didn't start out so well though. I was on my way to a very important job interview (I've been unemployed for several months) and I got a very severe flat tire on the way. I called the potential employer to let them know what happened and I ended up being an hour late ... but it worked out ... they were running behind too ... and just about 20 minutes ago I accepted the job ... So here I go!

 

[rynswrap]

Good for you! That is wonderful. I am SO glad you got the job. See, take it one day at a time. You are going to be great.

 

[katbird]

Prayers and thoughts are with you all

Great to hear you got a job!!!! Things will start to fall into place now for you. I will be praying for you and all the ones who need it. I am happy to hear some good news. I know this is very hard and I really know how you feel. Even though I wanted my divorce it still hurt to let go of something I had grown comfortable with. Yes I needed to get away from the beatings but there were good times as well. I did consider going back on several occassions at first when things would get tough, but I kept telling myself that life may be rough on your own and it may get even rougher as time goes by, but don't give in cause your are better off without the beatings. I guess the thought of my daughters growing up in that kind of enviroment helped keep me going. I certainly didn't want them growing up and thinking it was normal for a man to hit a woman and then end up marrying some jerk because of it. It will get better and you will be stronger because of it. It will be rough at first and you will hurt tremendously but you will wake up one morning and look back on all this and say hey look at me I made it Iam gonna be okay. It will take alot of healing and prayer but you will be happy again with time just don't let too much self pity set in or you will fall again and it will be a struggle to get back up. It isn't easy to be that strong, but sometimes we have to plod on to reach the place where we feel happiness again. Just hang in there and take one small step at a time. I will say a prayer for you, cause one thing I've learned throughout my life is God never leaves us forsakes us even in our darkest hours.He carries us.That has also helped me go on when things have gotten rough, that fact that I know God will always be there. God Bless You all you are truly a god send to me and we are god sends to each other! katbird