Step parents

[olhobbes]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

Just a quick clarification; Do the courts consider a spouse ( step parent ) "family"? It may sound an odd question, but do the courts even have such a concept as "Family" beyond the guardians? If so, how does it apply?

My custody agreement seems to only be concerned with the Father and Mother, and my research indicates that no one else holds any relevance ( well, guardians listed in the order anyway ). But I wanted to know if there's some law/rules/ect that are implied beyond the order.

This stems from something my daughter's mother said; that her spouse is not a day care, but her step father. While our custody order certainly allows anyone my daugher's mother designates during her custodial time to watch her, and I don't begrudge her that, that comment made me start thinking. And I know it's just a matter of time before it becomes relevant, so I figured I'd start researching it.

thanks in advance!

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

In general, the only ones mattering in custody issues are bio mom and bio dad.

 

[Proserpina]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

Just a quick clarification; Do the courts consider a spouse ( step parent ) "family"? It may sound an odd question, but do the courts even have such a concept as "Family" beyond the guardians? If so, how does it apply?

My custody agreement seems to only be concerned with the Father and Mother, and my research indicates that no one else holds any relevance ( well, guardians listed in the order anyway ). But I wanted to know if there's some law/rules/ect that are implied beyond the order.

This stems from something my daughter's mother said; that her spouse is not a day care, but her step father. While our custody order certainly allows anyone my daugher's mother designates during her custodial time to watch her, and I don't begrudge her that, that comment made me start thinking. And I know it's just a matter of time before it becomes relevant, so I figured I'd start researching it.

thanks in advance!

When you're faced with an actual situation, come back and ask about it.

Until then the question is honestly meaningless without context.

 

[olhobbes]

When you're faced with an actual situation, come back and ask about it.

Until then the question is honestly meaningless without context.

Sorry, I thought I did give enough context.

My daughter's mother ( henceforth referred to as DM for short ) placed our daughter in the care of her spouse while she was away for the weekend. While I might have chosen a different course were our situations reversed, her choice is well within her rights in the custody order. She didn't tell me about it however ( which makes sense as she has been pushing for me to include ROFR in the custody paperwork ), so when I asked her to keep me informed of our daughter's location when she is with day care, she told me that the step parent is family and not day care.

Again, not a huge deal. She didn't do anything that violated the order, so there's really nothing to worry about. I feel she had every right to choose an alternative day care provider ( although given how long she was gone, I think I would have given the other parent first crack. ROFR or no ). However, given her history of pushing the limits, I want to start researching NOW so I am ready for anything she might pull.

 

[Proserpina]

Sorry, I thought I did give enough context.

My daughter's mother ( henceforth referred to as DM for short ) placed our daughter in the care of her spouse while she was away for the weekend.

It's just Mom. No need for abbreviations. "Mom".

And yes, she can leave kiddo with her spouse while she's away. Or, anyone else for that matter.

While I might have chosen a different course were our situations reversed, her choice is well within her rights in the custody order. She didn't tell me about it however ( which makes sense as she has been pushing for me to include ROFR in the custody paperwork ), so when I asked her to keep me informed of our daughter's location when she is with day care, she told me that the step parent is family and not day care.

She is correct. Daughter is not in day care.

Again, not a huge deal. She didn't do anything that violated the order, so there's really nothing to worry about. I feel she had every right to choose an alternative day care provider ( although given how long she was gone, I think I would have given the other parent first crack. ROFR or no ). However, given her history of pushing the limits, I want to start researching NOW so I am ready for anything she might pull.

Are you setting yourself up for an adversarial co-parenting relationship?

 

[CJane]

IMO, a GOOD ROFR clause includes household members. So, if for example I was going to be gone for the day (10 hours or so) and wanted to leave my 5 year old in the care of my 15 year old, I wouldn't have to run that by my ex first.

Likewise, if I was remarried and wanted to spend a night at my Mom's house for a girls' night, I should be able to leave my son in the care of my spouse.

For ME, life should be more about maintaining consistency in location for the children, and not worrying so much about who exactly is where and whether or not the biological contributors are the ones in the child's physical presence at all times.

 

[olhobbes]

Are you setting yourself up for an adversarial co-parenting relationship?

Negative. As you can see, I'm well aware that all of what she has done is well within her rights of the order. I have said as much after all. I'm really just curious if their is anything "assumed" outside of the custody order regarding step parents. I'm researching ahead of time, should I need the information.

I understand if you don't want to help.

 

[CJane]

Negative. As you can see, I'm well aware that all of what she has done is well within her rights of the order. I have said as much after all. I'm really just curious if their is anything "assumed" outside of the custody order regarding step parents. I'm researching ahead of time, should I need the information.

I understand if you don't want to help.

Here's the deal. Legally speaking, steps have no rights to the child/ren. However, if they're GOOD stepparents who know their place and keep the child's best interests in mind, the court tends to respect that and not interfere with the family unit that involves the step parent/parent/children.

If they're an overstepping and interfering stepparent, it's not uncommon for the court to slap them pretty hard, and even (as is in my case) include in the order that they're not allowed to participate in any decisions regarding the children.

 

[ecmst12]

Mom does not have to tell you exactly where the child is at all times. She is in the care of mom during mom's parenting time and in the care of you during your parenting time. Either one of you can designate someone else to actually watch her during your scheduled time and neither of you should question the other about it, since currently there is no ROFR in your order. You instigated a defensive response from an inappropriate question.

 

[olhobbes]

Mom does not have to tell you exactly where the child is at all times. She is in the care of mom during mom's parenting time and in the care of you during your parenting time. Either one of you can designate someone else to actually watch her during your scheduled time and neither of you should question the other about it, since currently there is no ROFR in your order. You instigated a defensive response from an inappropriate question.

I know it's not required. Standard practice between the two of us had been to inform the other when our child is not in our care, however. That's just how it's been, and I was unaware of a change of circumstance.

I have no intention of continuing the practice however, as it does generate conflict. I am in a very difficult situation where the mother is extremely hostile, demanding things from me she is not willing to do herself. In order to keep the peace, most of the time I just do it anyway ( mostly when it doesn't impact my time with our daughter ), but I do like to keep myself educated as to what is and is not legally required. This is a learned response too; her mother has made extraordinary demands upon me before, and in my ignorance of the law I have complied.

Her hostility towards me is caused by the circumstances of the court order. I was stupid and did not estabish paternity as I should have ( see: ignorance of the law ). Her mother assured me that she was filing and that we'll have something solid soon. What she had been filing were paternity papers with the spouse as our child's father.

Of course I put a stop to this and established the order, ect...but ever since then she has been extremely hostile in all our dealings. Every step with her a fight, and she is constantly trying to push the envelope as far as what is and is not appropriate, whereas I am trying to simply give our daughter the best home environment possible. To do that, I am trying to learn as much as I can, so as I do not repeat my prior mistakes.

Here's the deal. Legally speaking, steps have no rights to the child/ren. However, if they're GOOD stepparents who know their place and keep the child's best interests in mind, the court tends to respect that and not interfere with the family unit that involves the step parent/parent/children.

If they're an overstepping and interfering stepparent, it's not uncommon for the court to slap them pretty hard, and even (as is in my case) include in the order that they're not allowed to participate in any decisions regarding the children.

And for my part, I have no interest in interrupting her custodial time, and if the step provides a healthy environment for our daughter then more power to him. I want our child surrounded by people that love her.

My concern is that Mother come up with something weird in the future, and because of my ignorance I'll agree where I shouldn't. Hence, my researching and asking for information.

 

[ecmst12]

Since you are in an adversarial situation, it may be best to keep communication to the minimum necessary and follow your court order to the letter.

 

[CJane]

Since you are in an adversarial situation, it may be best to keep communication to the minimum necessary and follow your court order to the letter.

Exactly. It's sad, but it was actually better for my kids after I cut off communication with my ex.

 

[stealth2]

It's better all around. I know my life is much calmer w/o it. Which, of course, means the kids' lives are calmer, too.

 

[olhobbes]

Exactly. It's sad, but it was actually better for my kids after I cut off communication with my ex.

That appears to be the route I'll be taking.

Which is a tragedy really, as our daughter will be the one negatively impacted if we can't effectively communicate with each other.

 

[CJane]

That appears to be the route I'll be taking.

Which is a tragedy really, as our daughter will be the one negatively impacted if we can't effectively communicate with each other.

I don't necessarily agree that's true.

My kids were MORE negatively impacted when we had a crazily contentious but communicative relationship than they are by our current arrangement where only brief text messages are exchanged when schedules need addressed or the like. No more screaming phone calls from him, no more 3-4 letters every week, no more phone calls from his wife. I stopped letting them invade my every moment, and my kids' lives improved.