Stop ex-wife from calling police on my relatives

[thedoctorisin]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA

Then: My ex-wife called the police during one of my visitation weeks, when my teenage daughter was spending the night at a sleepover with relatives at a different address, instead of being with me. The police came, and quickly determined that there was no reason for them to be there.

Now: I am negotiating modifications to the existing court order, and would like to add a provision to specifically proscribe such behavior on my ex-wife's part. Currently, there are only vague clauses such as:

"Neither party shall do anything which may estrange the child from the other parent or which my hamper the free and natural development of the child's love and respect for each parent."

"The parties shall at all times be flexible in their custody arrangement and shall give mature consideration to the wishes and needs of the minor child."

Question: Any suggestions for drafting a provision to stop this kind of behavior on my ex-wife's part? Her mindset is that she hates me more than she loves our daughter, and she spends much of her spare time trying to come up with new ways to screw me over, but she will generally adhere to the terms of the court order which are explicitly spelled out.

 

[Isis1]

you cannot get a court order to stop her from calling the police. that's not going to happen. however, on a criminal basis, i am sure at some point she can get charged with making false police calls.

it might be helpful if you were able to get a copy of the police report and it's non-status.

 

[thedoctorisin]

you cannot get a court order to stop her from calling the police. that's not going to happen. however, on a criminal basis, i am sure at some point she can get charged with making false police calls.

it might be helpful if you were able to get a copy of the police report and it's non-status.

Thanks for the response! If you don't mind too much, I'm going to try to add some more information and ask again, in hopes of getting a response I like better. I apologize in advance for acting like an ungrateful newbie. (And I understand I'm still probably going to the the same answer as before.)

My ex-wife and I have a separation agreement, which was incorporated into our divorce decree, and which has been amended by a subsequent court order to address aspects of her behavior that were not covered by the original agreement. Now, I am seeking a new motion to amend, and I am trying to draft a provision that will address her latest behavior of calling the police on me. We are currently in negotiation, and hopefully we will come to an agreement before the court date. My ex-wife's proposal included about a dozen new provisions.

Both the original agreement and the previous amendment have clauses that contain various provisions, such as the two I quoted in my OP. I want to propose something like, "Neither party shall interfere with visitation to the other party by calling the police unless the well-being of the minor child is endangered." It doesn't have to worded strongly enough to actually be enforceable, as I am mainly interested in its effect as a deterrent.

For example, the last time my ex-wife's shenanigans related to a change to my daughter's school schedule that I was not aware of, so the court order included a statement that "if Mother is aware of a change in the calendar that may not be on the yearly schedule, she is to notify Father."

Currently, we have joint legal custody, but my ex-wife has sole physical custody. However, my ex-wife has agreed to joint physical custody in the new motion to amend.

If we do end up going to court, the police incident will definitely be fully documented.

Thanks again.

 

[Isis1]

what exactly is your goal here?

sole physical custody? sole legal custody? both?

it sounds like mom is being amicable by modifying it to joint physical.

are you trying to point fingers and say "look, mom's a nutcase?" cuz you can let her do that on her own.

here's the problem with your "no calling the police unless the child is in danger". what if mom is really convinced the child is in danger? i can't tell you many times when i have yelled out a bloodcurlding scream over the phone over a stupid bug, or a friend popping out of a dark corner just to scare me, only to really freak out the person on the line. just because nothing is really wrong, it may be wrong of mom to NOT call because of this clause.

 

[thedoctorisin]

what exactly is your goal here?

My ex-wife tries to mess up my life whenever possible. Some of things that she does are just laughable. Some are only mildly annoying. Some are extremely infuriating, and really succeed at screwing me over. Because of her history, just wondering what trick she is going to pull next is enough to mess up my life.

Once upon a time, I was advised that the best way to deal with my ex-wife's antics was to ignore them all, and most of all not to let her know when something she did really got to me. I tried this for a while, and found it doesn't work.

So now my strategy is to address her most egregious behaviors directly. Hence my desire to include something in the new court order about her not calling the police. It's getting to the point where I dread visiting relatives with my daughter because I know my ex-wife will pull something, even if it is just calling them up and grilling them on every aspect of the visit, including what they are serving my daughter for dinner.

sole physical custody? sole legal custody? both?

Custody issues are already agreed upon. Other issues, such as child support and decisions as to daughter's after school activities, aren't. I'm mostly just looking for help here on this one issue, though.

it sounds like mom is being amicable by modifying it to joint physical.

I think this is more indicative of what a poor case she has, rather than her actually being reasonable.

are you trying to point fingers and say "look, mom's a nutcase?" cuz you can let her do that on her own.

I don't care who knows mom is a nut case. (I agree that she is making this obvious.) I'm trying to be able to visit relatives without a cloud of doom hanging over my head.

here's the problem with your "no calling the police unless the child is in danger". what if mom is really convinced the child is in danger? i can't tell you many times when i have yelled out a bloodcurlding scream over the phone over a stupid bug, or a friend popping out of a dark corner just to scare me, only to really freak out the person on the line. just because nothing is really wrong, it may be wrong of mom to NOT call because of this clause.

This is a good point. Which is why I'm asking for help in how to word this clause.

Again, my ex-wife's mindset is to find what she considers to be "loopholes" in the existing agreement, where her behavior isn't specifically prohibited. For example, "the agreement doesn't say I can't schedule a doctor's appointment for our daughter when I know she will be at her paternal grandparent's birthday party." So I'm trying close one more loophole here.

 

[sometwo]

Neither party shall interfere with visitation to the other party by calling the police unless the well-being of the minor child is endangered

How do you know the mom did not really think the child was in danger at the time?


I really dont think there is any way you can word it to make it acceptible. The police are there for a reason.

Now if its being abused you can file charges agaist her or a civil suit for fasle police reports.

 

[thedoctorisin]

How about:

"Mother will not call police relating to minor child while child is with Father, unless Mother first tries to contact Father on Father's cell phone regarding the situation. If Father is available on the cell phone, Father shall have sole discretion as to whether to call the police."

 

[thedoctorisin]

How do you know the mom did not really think the child was in danger at the time?

My ex-wife was doing it out of spite, in an attempt to spoil my daughter's visitation with me and my relatives. Fortunately, there are enough witnesses to establish this in court, in case we are not able to come to an agreement prior to the court date.

 

[thedoctorisin]

Okay, due to everyone's concern about the police, I have reworded the provision to address the sleepover aspect of the situation instead.

Now for a new question.

My ex-wife's proposal stated, "An agreement would be incorporated stating that minor child's physical address is determined by what is in her best interest."

Questions: What does this mean exactly? Why does the minor child's physical address matter anyway? And finally, wouldn't it be better for the court order to specify the physical address one way or another, instead of leaving it up in the air?

Another question: Child will be driving soon. Does the physical address affect car insurance in any way?

 

[proud_parent]

Why does the minor child's physical address matter anyway?

The child's address could impact public school enrollment, depending on school district rules regarding residency and enrollment.

Does the physical address affect car insurance in any way?

Possibly. Rates, for example, can be affected by where the vehicle is frequently parked.

 

[Ohiogal]

How about:

"Mother will not call police relating to minor child while child is with Father, unless Mother first tries to contact Father on Father's cell phone regarding the situation. If Father is available on the cell phone, Father shall have sole discretion as to whether to call the police."

NOPE. That won't fly. Because YOU look like the psycho.

 

[StampGirl]

How about:

"Mother will not call police relating to minor child while child is with Father, unless Mother first tries to contact Father on Father's cell phone regarding the situation. If Father is available on the cell phone, Father shall have sole discretion as to whether to call the police."

*sigh*

You both need help. You for being a controlling pain and her for being just a pain in general. That poor child.

Just follow the court order and if she doesn't, file contempt charges. Sheeesh.

So much drama. Don't feed her need for it but at the same time you are generating your fair share of it by attacking her in these ways.

 

[thedoctorisin]

You both need help.

I'm trying to get some help here.

You for being a controlling pain and her for being just a pain in general.

I would like to be able to let my daughter have a sleepover with my relatives without my ex-wife calling the police on them. That makes me controlling, how?

That poor child.

It is very rough on her. That is why I have her in counseling, which is helping immensely.

Just follow the court order and if she doesn't, file contempt charges. Sheeesh.

I'm seeking to modify the court order, and I'm asking for help on how to do so. Your advice does not make any sense in this context.

Part of the reason I am seeking the modification is because she did not follow the current order.

So much drama.

Quite a bit. I would like to reduce the drama.

Don't feed her need for it but at the same time you are generating your fair share of it by attacking her in these ways.

I was married to my ex-wife for 20 years. You don't know her at all. Isn't it at least conceivable that I might have a little bit better insight on this? In my experience, responding to her drama in a calm but determined manner is more effective in stopping it than just ignoring it.

Anyway, here is my latest draft:

"Because minor child can be contacted by cell phone, each party shall have the flexibility to take advantage of last minute opportunities for sleepovers and other changes to travel plans."

 

[StampGirl]

I'm trying to get some help here.


I would like to be able to let my daughter have a sleepover with my relatives without my ex-wife calling the police on them. That makes me controlling, how?


No that doesn't make you controlling. Trying to take away her right to call the police should she believe her child is in danger is controlling.


It is very rough on her. That is why I have her in counseling, which is helping immensely.

Awesome. Thats a great step in the right direction.

I'm seeking to modify the court order, and I'm asking for help on how to do so. Your advice does not make any sense in this context.

You can file contempt charges for her violating the court order and also recommend to modify it (or clarify it) as well. Filing contempt charges lets your Ex know she doesn't get to do what she wants when she wants to do it. It sends a clear message that you aren't going to stand for her not following a court order.

Part of the reason I am seeking the modification is because she did not follow the current order.


Quite a bit. I would like to reduce the drama.


I was married to my ex-wife for 20 years. You don't know her at all. Isn't it at least conceivable that I might have a little bit better insight on this? In my experience, responding to her drama in a calm but determined manner is more effective in stopping it than just ignoring it.

Anyway, here is my latest draft:

"Because minor child can be contacted by cell phone, each party shall have the flexibility to take advantage of last minute opportunities for sleepovers and other changes to travel plans."

Just let her know that she can't control what happens on your time just like you can't control what the child does on her time. Filing contempt when she violates the court order is a clear message that says you won't stand for her disregard of the court order.

I just cant believe that any judge is going to allow any of these versions of your clause.

 

[thedoctorisin]

Just let her know that she can't control what happens on your time just like you can't control what the child does on her time.

This is exactly the problem. My ex-wife thinks that she can do whatever she wants on her time with our daughter, but everything that happens on my time is subject to her direct approval or she can refuse visitation/call the police/other outrageous action.

Filing contempt when she violates the court order is a clear message that says you won't stand for her disregard of the court order.

I tried this already; it didn't work out so well. The judge basically gave her a slap on the wrist, but let her get her way. After reading Wednesday Evenings and Every Other Weekend by F. Daniel McClure and Jerry B. Saffer, I got the impression that this was the typical result. From their book:

Ever heard of a "Show Cause" order? These are petitions people constantly file because they think the other party is operating outside the agreement or court order. When a Show Cause order is filed, a court date is established for some time in the relatively distant future. You then go to Court and one side tells the judge why the other is being unfair and "cheating" on the agreement. The other then denies this cheating or presents all sorts of reasons why they were driven to cheat by the irresponsible behavior of the other. Typically the judge sends both parties on their way with the instruction to stop cheating and just get along. These orders are difficult to enforce with any consistency and especially with any speed. They are often flagrantly disobeyed, and only rarely is the offending party called to account. Even when they are, it's simply an official admonition from the Bench to stop doing whatever it is they were doing. Is this starting to sound a little ridiculous?​

I just cant believe that any judge is going to allow any of these versions of your clause.

I would love it if someone else would suggest a possible wording that would close this supposed "loophole" that exits in my ex-wife's mind, in a way that the judge would allow.