This seems wrong

[Oldshoe]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Illinois


My divorce has been final for two years, but my attorney won't stop going after my ex. He owes her money that the court ordered him to pay her in the divorce order. She keeps filing new orders and going to court in order to get him to pay her. Then she charges me for that service. He has filed bankruptcy and her fees were discharged from his debts. He lives in AZ and she still continues 2 years after the divorce is final. I can't afford this and it seems dishonest. She won't stop, and when I ask her to she threatens me by saying I'll have to pay her what he's been ordered to pay her ~ in one lump sum.

 

[quincy]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Illinois


My divorce has been final for two years, but my attorney won't stop going after my ex. He owes her money that the court ordered him to pay her in the divorce order. She keeps filing new orders and going to court in order to get him to pay her. Then she charges me for that service. He has filed bankruptcy and her fees were discharged from his debts. He lives in AZ and she still continues 2 years after the divorce is final. I can't afford this and it seems dishonest. She won't stop, and when I ask her to she threatens me by saying I'll have to pay her what he's been ordered to pay her ~ in one lump sum.

Your pronouns are confusing me a bit.

Your attorney was awarded attorney fees to be paid by your ex and your attorney is charging you for the time and costs in trying to collect these fees?

Why do you still have this attorney working for you? The relationship should have ended when your need for her services ended (assuming you have paid for her services to you in full).

You should not be responsible for paying what the court ordered your ex to pay, absent any agreement that states otherwise.

If you have a dispute over attorney fees, you can submit a complaint to the Illinois State Bar.

Good luck.

 

[latigo]

Your pronouns are confusing me a bit.

Your attorney was awarded attorney fees to be paid by your ex and your attorney is charging you for the time and costs in trying to collect these fees?

Why do you still have this attorney working for you? The relationship should have ended when your need for her services ended (assuming you have paid for her services to you in full).

You should not be responsible for paying what the court ordered your ex to pay, absent any agreement that states otherwise.

If you have a dispute over attorney fees, you can submit a complaint to the Illinois State Bar.

Good luck.

Sorry, but I can't share that opinion, not unless the attorney expressly agreed to absolve the client of any responsibility for the payment of the fees.

I see it as somewhat akin to a patient demanding the care provider look solely to the patient's insurance coverage.

 

[quincy]

Sorry, but I can't share that opinion, not unless the attorney expressly agreed to absolve the client of any responsibility for the payment of the fees.

I see it as somewhat akin to a patient demanding the care provider look solely to the patient's insurance coverage.

Either Oldshoe's ex-spouse or Oldshoe's attorney would need to return to court for a review of the order if either wanted to have the order vacated. Right now, however, the ex-husband is responsible for paying the attorney fees, not Oldshoe.

When a court orders the other party to pay his opponent's attorney fees - which goes against the "American Rule" that each party is responsible for his own attorney costs - it is only because there was a petition made to the court requesting all costs be borne by the other party. The court considers the reasonableness of the request based on the financial findings of both parties. What is considered is the ability/inability of a party to pay and also considered will be the reasons why the attorney fees are what they are (e.g., if one party has filed frivolous motions or prolonged the case unreasonably).

There were recent changes in Illinois to attorney fees and some recent court decisions and I have not read through them all - but based on what I know, it appears to me that, until the current order has been reviewed by the court and vacated, Oldshoe is not responsible for paying her attorney fees and has good reason to dispute the additional fees being charged by her attorney in the attorney's attempts to collect from the ex-spouse.


Edit to add: The attorney fees were apparently discharged in the ex-spouse's bankruptcy so the attorney has nothing to collect.

 

[latigo]

Either Oldshoe's ex-spouse or Oldshoe's attorney would need to return to court for a review of the order if either wanted to have the order vacated. Right now, however, the ex-husband is responsible for paying the attorney fees, not Oldshoe.

When a court orders the other party to pay his opponent's attorney fees - which goes against the "American Rule" that each party is responsible for his own attorney costs - it is only because there was a petition made to the court requesting all costs be borne by the other party. The court considers the reasonableness of the request based on the financial findings of both parties. What is considered is the ability/inability of a party to pay and also considered will be the reasons why the attorney fees are what they are (e.g., if one party has filed frivolous motions or prolonged the case unreasonably).

There were recent changes in Illinois to attorney fees and some recent court decisions and I have not read through them all - but based on what I know, it appears to me that, until the current order has been reviewed by the court and vacated, Oldshoe is not responsible for paying her attorney fees and has good reason to dispute the additional fees being charged by her attorney in the attorney's attempts to collect from the ex-spouse.


Edit to add: The attorney fees were apparently discharged in the ex-spouse's bankruptcy so the attorney has nothing to collect.

Attorney fees are generally the responsibility of the party who incurred the fees. McGuire, 305 Ill.App.3d at 479, 238 Ill.Dec. 689, 712 N.E.2d 411; Marriage of Hasabnis; 322 Ill. App. 3rd 582, , 749 N.. E 2nd 448.

Also note in 750 ILCS 5/508 the language "may order any party to pay a reasonable amount for the other party's attorney fees". (Not must or shall, but "may")

Which literally presupposes that the litigant has incurred attorney fees. Nor can it be sensibly argued that without an agreement to the effect the attorney is limited to what the court finds as a reasonable fee.

Also further on in the Illinois statute this appears: "contribution to attorney's fees and costs may be awarded from the opposing party . . . ".

The word "contribution" cannot be reasonably taken to mean other than as helping or assisting the party in the payment of those incurred expenses.

Anyway I thoroughly disagree with you, but do not wish to belabor it further.

 

[quincy]

Attorney fees are generally the responsibility of the party who incurred the fees. McGuire, 305 Ill.App.3d at 479, 238 Ill.Dec. 689, 712 N.E.2d 411; Marriage of Hasabnis; 322 Ill. App. 3rd 582, , 749 N.. E 2nd 448.

Also note in 750 ILCS 5/508 the language "may order any party to pay a reasonable amount for the other party's attorney fees". (Not must or shall, but "may")

I understand all that.

The court "may" order any party to pay the other party's attorney fees. And, as described here, the court did exactly that. The court ordered the ex-spouse to pay Oldshoe's attorney fees.

I have no idea with what you are disagreeing.

 

[Ohiogal]

I understand all that.

The court "may" order any party to pay the other party's attorney fees. And, as described here, the court did exactly that. The court ordered the ex-spouse to pay Oldshoe's attorney fees.

I have no idea with what you are disagreeing.

However, it is Oldshoe's responsibility to go after ex for the fees. NOT the attorney's.

 

[LdiJ]

However, it is Oldshoe's responsibility to go after ex for the fees. NOT the attorney's.

I can understand it being Oldshoe's responsibility to go after the ex for the fees. I can understand Oldshoe's attorney going after Oldshoe for the fees since the ex did not pay. What I cannot understand is Oldshoe's attorney deciding, without Oldshoe's approval, to go after the ex for the fees AND charging Oldshoe new fees for that.

 

[Ohiogal]

I can understand it being Oldshoe's responsibility to go after the ex for the fees. I can understand Oldshoe's attorney going after Oldshoe for the fees since the ex did not pay. What I cannot understand is Oldshoe's attorney deciding, without Oldshoe's approval, to go after the ex for the fees AND charging Oldshoe new fees for that.

Yep. I disagree with that.

 

[quincy]

However, it is Oldshoe's responsibility to go after ex for the fees. NOT the attorney's.

The attorney fees that were ordered paid by the ex were apparently discharged in the ex's bankruptcy. I am not sure the attorney can collect his fees from anyone at this point.

 

[Ohiogal]

The attorney fees that were ordered paid by the ex were apparently discharged in the ex's bankruptcy. I am not sure the attorney can collect his fees from anyone at this point.

The attorney can collect from his client. Whether his client can file for contempt on the attorney fees depends on information not disclosed.

And I agree with LD. NOT disagree.

 

[quincy]

The attorney can collect from his client. Whether his client can file for contempt on the attorney fees depends on information not disclosed.

And I agree with LD. NOT disagree.

The attorney increasing the bill of the client by charging for attempts to collect from the ex seems unethical at best. If it was clear that filing a fee dispute wouldn't backfire on Oldshoe, that might be the best course of action.

I will try to take some time later to see if the recent changes to the State Bar's attorney fees addresses anything like this. My feeling is that once a debt has been discharged in bankruptcy, the creditor/attorney cannot then try to collect on the debt.

 

[Ohiogal]

The attorney increasing the bill of the client by charging for attempts to collect from the ex seems unethical at best. If it was clear that filing a fee dispute wouldn't backfire on Oldshoe, that might be the best course of action.

I will try to take some time later to see if the recent changes to the State Bar's attorney fees addresses anything like this. My feeling is that once a debt has been discharged in bankruptcy, the creditor/attorney cannot then try to collect on the debt.

Depends on what the contract states. Many attorneys include a clause that states that costs of collection will be transferred to the client. The attorney can attempt to collect from his/her client. That is with whom the attorney has a contract. The divorce decree is binding only upon the two parties and not the attorneys. Hence, the attorney should be suing OP. Now if OP stated, nope, contact my ex, then that is on OP. And she may very well owe for that as well. OP has a motion to show cause. If the divorce decree protected against bankruptcy it is possible OP can collect from the ex. But OP still owes the attorney and should pay.

 

[Oldshoe]

May I clarify?

Thanks for all the replies. I'm sorry I didn't explain my situation properly the first time, but it's such a long story.
During the course of my divorce which was final 2 years ago, my ex did not comply with the judges orders.
He failed to come to court, he failed to provide the requested documents, and he was held in contempt. Since my attorney was forced to file extra paperwork, schedule extra court dates, and put in extra labor because of his noncompliance, she asked that the court allow her to request that those additional fees he caused be paid by him. That request was written in the final divorce decree.
At that time he owed my atty $6000.00.
Since she has continued to pursue him for two more years, his total is closer to $10,000.
My atty did not request that my ex pay all my llegal fees.
Since my ex never paid my atty, the charges are included in my atty fees. My total is over $23,000.
My ex has since filed for bankruptcy.
When I ask my atty to stop charging more to my bill, she threatens me by saying that if she stops I will have to pay my ex's fees in a lump sum. She says her contract is with me, not my ex. Even though it's written on the decree that my ex pays her.
I'm frustrated and my hands are tied. She seems to think there's some loophole she can use to get my ex to pay her even though he's bankrupt. He lives in AZ.
Does anyone know of an Illinois law that will be honored for this type of debt in AZ even though bankruptcy is involved?
I am 64 years old, and I pay my atty $800 per month. Every month my total stays the same because the $800 is eaten up by her constant pursuit. I understand that my attorney should be paid for work she performed. I just don't know why she continues to chase him if she knows my ex is not liable to pay her. How can I get this to stop?

 

[quincy]

Thanks for all the replies. I'm sorry I didn't explain my situation properly the first time, but it's such a long story.
During the course of my divorce which was final 2 years ago, my ex did not comply with the judges orders.
He failed to come to court, he failed to provide the requested documents, and he was held in contempt. Since my attorney was forced to file extra paperwork, schedule extra court dates, and put in extra labor because of his noncompliance, she asked that the court allow her to request that those additional fees he caused be paid by him. That request was written in the final divorce decree.
At that time he owed my atty $6000.00.
Since she has continued to pursue him for two more years, his total is closer to $10,000.
My atty did not request that my ex pay all my llegal fees.
Since my ex never paid my atty, the charges are included in my atty fees. My total is over $23,000.
My ex has since filed for bankruptcy.
When I ask my atty to stop charging more to my bill, she threatens me by saying that if she stops I will have to pay my ex's fees in a lump sum. She says her contract is with me, not my ex. Even though it's written on the decree that my ex pays her.
I'm frustrated and my hands are tied. She seems to think there's some loophole she can use to get my ex to pay her even though he's bankrupt. He lives in AZ.
Does anyone know of an Illinois law that will be honored for this type of debt in AZ even though bankruptcy is involved?
I am 64 years old, and I pay my atty $800 per month. Every month my total stays the same because the $800 is eaten up by her constant pursuit. I understand that my attorney should be paid for work she performed. I just don't know why she continues to chase him if she knows my ex is not liable to pay her. How can I get this to stop?

You would probably be smart to file a complaint against your attorney with the State Board.

It was on your attorney's request that the additional costs be borne by your ex. The court ordered that and included it in the decree.

I do not see that you are responsible for fees ordered paid by your ex - that is between your attorney and your ex. You should also not be charged for the attorney's efforts to collect on the money owed her by your ex.

The above is assuming your own contract with the attorney does not have a clause that allows for collection from you if the ex doesn't pay.

You can wait for Ohiogal and latigo to post as they seem to be in disagreement with me on this.