Unemployment, Disability and Child Support

[kaizen]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? MI

Ex (who is NCP) became unemployed 2 years ago and collected benefits. The CS was adjusted accordingly.

Unbeknownst to me, he filed for disability last June, while he was collecting unemployment.

In January, I stopped getting child support. His unemployment ran out.

This week I found out about his disability claim via a call from Social Security. I will be getting benefits on behalf of our son via his disability, retroactive to the time he filed (6/12).

Now my question. Ex claims that I will have to pay back the child support I did receive from June till January. At first this sounded reasonable - since social security will be issuing me a retroactive check. Then I began to think that his income history still includes the unemployment benefits that the support amount was figured off of, and now the retroactive disability payments. I understand going forward that my support will come via the disability solely, but will I be ordered to repay the couple hundred bucks a month I was getting via his unemployment for the months that his income included both?

Thank you.

 

[commentator]

It is very possible HE will have to pay back unemployment insurance (at least he will be determined overpaid) for any weeks he received unemployment benefits that he is later backpaid for by SSDI. Because when you are in this situation, this can very easily occur. You are actually filing for unemployment benefits, you have filed for SSDI, and have not heard yet, and then at a later date, you are told that IF you receive backpay from SSDI. You have been told by unemployment insurance that if this situation occurs, you will be overpaid for these weeks of unemployment. It is not considered a fraud overpayment, and is not pursued criminally in most cases.

However, if this happens, I am a little confused as to how he'd try to collect this overpaid money back from you. Unless you were just agreeable to give it back to him so he could give it back to the unemployment system, they're not going to come after you for it at all. The unemployment system wouldn't, I can pretty much assure you of that. Whatever the money was used for, to pay child support, to pay his grocery bills, to buy his gas, they're not coming after the place he spent the money. They're just going to tell HIM he has an overpayment in xxx amount of dollars. He could always use the money he receives in backpay to reimburse the unemployment system.

 

[kaizen]

Thank you, commentator.

He is trying to get me to be agreeable to just giving it back. He claims that he can take me to court to pay it back to him, saying he can do that because I was overpaid.

I'm always leery of the deals he wants to make. He's trying to spin this into a deal that he claims will benefit me. (i.e. if I just solely pay a bill on my son's behalf that is a two to three hundred dollars, he will let me off the hook on the money he says he can take me to court to collect.)

 

[BL]

Thank you, commentator.

He is trying to get me to be agreeable to just giving it back. He claims that he can take me to court to pay it back to him, saying he can do that because I was overpaid.

I'm always leery of the deals he wants to make. He's trying to spin this into a deal that he claims will benefit me. (i.e. if I just solely pay a bill on my son's behalf that is a two to three hundred dollars, he will let me off the hook on the money he says he can take me to court to collect.)

So if I'm understanding this , CS was adjusted for unemployment benefits that you received .

He then has SSDI and you will receive a retroactive Child benefit amount and ongoing monthly amount.

What he is saying , is you should pay him back for the amounts per unemployment CS order during the retroactive period of child benefits ,from the retroactive amount.

Which is only fair - think about it , however in the end you may not legally have to.

 

[single317dad]

If the amount the child is back-paid includes the amount that was intended as child support for the same time period, he may be partially right, as you have been doubly compensated for the same ordered support. However, I wouldn't start paying back anything until the arrears were calculated.

If the child's benefits are only back-paid as the standard benefits he would have received just from Dad's disability, and Dad is responsible for support separately, then you've only been paid once for the support owed and Dad should be responsible for any shortfalls.

You need to communicate with child support staff on this, as they can advise you of the arrears and they'll need to be aware of any overpayment that gets returned.

 

[BL]

Regardless ,another modification with the court should occur and it can be calculated there.

 

[CSO286]

No, no and no. I know I've discussed this before here. I just can remember when.

It will be treated like an unexpected windfall to the CP and the CP will not be required to pay it back or pay back other the support paid.

Now, if the NCP owes any arrears, it's likely that the courts will require that the arrears be offset equal to the amount of the back pay.

If not, and the CP received payments from unemployment, and then was approved for soc sec for some of the time he was receiving unemployment, thereby entitling him to a lump sum payment, you as the child's rep payee, would not be required to pay back the support garnished from his unemployment. Why? Because you did not obtain that money fraudulently, nor was it overpaid to you. If unemployment cites an overpayment against the NCP, that's between the NCP and unemployment.

 

[CSO286]

So if I'm understanding this , CS was adjusted for unemployment benefits that you received .

He then has SSDI and you will receive a retroactive Child benefit amount and ongoing monthly amount.

What he is saying , is you should pay him back for the amounts per unemployment CS order during the retroactive period of child benefits ,from the retroactive amount.

Which is only fair - think about it , however in the end you may not legally have to.

Fair or not, she will not be required to pay back support she legally recieved and was legally entitled to.

 

[BL]

Fair or not, she will not be required to pay back support she legally recieved and was legally entitled to.

And that's what I indicated.

It looks like the NCP will be filing for modification and it all can be hammered out there .

 

[kaizen]

I received a notice "Petition and Order for Determination of Ongoing Support", with a date to come to court. The FOC date is only 12 days after I received the notice.

For once in a very long time, I've made plans with my son for his Easter break. We have reservations booked, etc. The two things conflict with one another.

Is 12 days enough notice, legally speaking?

I called FOC and have received different opinions. First lady said if I bring the SS papers in ahead of time, it should be okay. That's really all they want to see. Second lady asked a higher up (who the meeting is in front of) and she said we could move it back a week if Dad agrees. Dad says he can't do that . Third lady said to bring the paperwork in ahead of time and go on vacation - the meeting is just a formality.

It does say at the bottom of the petition if either party fails to appear, an order may be entered adverse to their position.

Now I'm wondering if this meeting is really a formality or if it'd be the time for Dad to bring up the previously mentioned things in the beginning of this thread and if I could wind up SOL if I'm not there. Of course if we have to miss our trip, it's our son who also winds up SOL - although I realize that is legally neither here nor there it sure does suck!

Any feedback on to go or not or what happens at such a meeting? Is it a formality or could Dad raise previous concerns and I find myself with a ruling adverse to my position? Is the 12 days adequate notice?

Thanks.

 

[CSO286]

I received a notice "Petition and Order for Determination of Ongoing Support", with a date to come to court. The FOC date is only 12 days after I received the notice.

For once in a very long time, I've made plans with my son for his Easter break. We have reservations booked, etc. The two things conflict with one another.

Is 12 days enough notice, legally speaking?

I called FOC and have received different opinions. First lady said if I bring the SS papers in ahead of time, it should be okay. That's really all they want to see. Second lady asked a higher up (who the meeting is in front of) and she said we could move it back a week if Dad agrees. Dad says he can't do that . Third lady said to bring the paperwork in ahead of time and go on vacation - the meeting is just a formality.

It does say at the bottom of the petition if either party fails to appear, an order may be entered adverse to their position.

Now I'm wondering if this meeting is really a formality or if it'd be the time for Dad to bring up the previously mentioned things in the beginning of this thread and if I could wind up SOL if I'm not there. Of course if we have to miss our trip, it's our son who also winds up SOL - although I realize that is legally neither here nor there it sure does suck!

Any feedback on to go or not or what happens at such a meeting? Is it a formality or could Dad raise previous concerns and I find myself with a ruling adverse to my position? Is the 12 days adequate notice?

Thanks.

There is a hearing coming up, the results of which will have a direct effect on your life. Do you think you need to attend a legal hearing to which you are a party?

 

[sandyclaus]

I received a notice "Petition and Order for Determination of Ongoing Support", with a date to come to court. The FOC date is only 12 days after I received the notice.

For once in a very long time, I've made plans with my son for his Easter break. We have reservations booked, etc. The two things conflict with one another.

Is 12 days enough notice, legally speaking?

I called FOC and have received different opinions. First lady said if I bring the SS papers in ahead of time, it should be okay. That's really all they want to see. Second lady asked a higher up (who the meeting is in front of) and she said we could move it back a week if Dad agrees. Dad says he can't do that . Third lady said to bring the paperwork in ahead of time and go on vacation - the meeting is just a formality.

It does say at the bottom of the petition if either party fails to appear, an order may be entered adverse to their position.

Now I'm wondering if this meeting is really a formality or if it'd be the time for Dad to bring up the previously mentioned things in the beginning of this thread and if I could wind up SOL if I'm not there. Of course if we have to miss our trip, it's our son who also winds up SOL - although I realize that is legally neither here nor there it sure does suck!

Any feedback on to go or not or what happens at such a meeting? Is it a formality or could Dad raise previous concerns and I find myself with a ruling adverse to my position? Is the 12 days adequate notice?

Thanks.

Your alternative here, in order to make sure that yours and your child's interests are being best represented in the hearing, is to hire an attorney to appear on your behalf. Otherwise, you run the risk that your voice will not be heard, and those orders may well go against you - and you'd be kicking yourself because you didn't bother to appear. There are some attorneys out there that will simply make appearances for you. It might be an option for you.

 

[LdiJ]

Your alternative here, in order to make sure that yours and your child's interests are being best represented in the hearing, is to hire an attorney to appear on your behalf. Otherwise, you run the risk that your voice will not be heard, and those orders may well go against you - and you'd be kicking yourself because you didn't bother to appear. There are some attorneys out there that will simply make appearances for you. It might be an option for you.

Are we really sure that she needs to be present?

FOC cannot make her pay back valid child support she previously received.
FOC cannot reduce the amount of SS benefits that the child will receive.

About the only thing that the FOC could do at this hearing that would impact the OP is reduce or remove any arrearages that dad has, and it sounds like the OP expects that to happen.

 

[gam]

Yes 12 days is adequate notice, your lucky you got that in Mi. The only one who can change a court date in Mi is the moving party(whoever filed), so either you get dad to move it or the court date stands. I believe in my county, the papers say something about the court date having to be 7 days out from the time of filing, however I have seen them skip that bit and I've seen less then 3 day notice.

FOC can only make RECOMMENDATIONS, you always can object to recommendations.

However if you fail to appear to a hearing, then your giving up the right to object to those recommendations and they can be sent to the Judge to sign off on. It's a court date, it's not invite, it's a must show or your in default.

Is it possible for you to call in on the day of the hearing? If so call FOC back and ask if you can call into the hearing. Your options would be to get dad to change it, ask FOC for a call in or send a lawyer in your place.

Tomorrow is good Friday and my county court house is only open a 1/2 day, not sure what other Mi courts are doing tomorrow, but just an FYI for you.

 

[CSO286]

Yes 12 days is adequate notice, your lucky you got that in Mi. The only one who can change a court date in Mi is the moving party(whoever filed), so either you get dad to move it or the court date stands. I believe in my county, the papers say something about the court date having to be 7 days out from the time of filing, however I have seen them skip that bit and I've seen less then 3 day notice.

FOC can only make RECOMMENDATIONS, you always can object to recommendations.

However if you fail to appear to a hearing, then your giving up the right to object to those recommendations and they can be sent to the Judge to sign off on. It's a court date, it's not invite, it's a must show or your in default.

Is it possible for you to call in on the day of the hearing? If so call FOC back and ask if you can call into the hearing. Your options would be to get dad to change it, ask FOC for a call in or send a lawyer in your place.

Tomorrow is good Friday and my county court house is only open a 1/2 day, not sure what other Mi courts are doing tomorrow, but just an FYI for you.

This is what it boils down to.

Your failure to appear says that it doesn't really matter to you what the outcome is.