Vandalism after move out

[dadcobf]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

Sorry if this is too long, but wanted to get as much info out there for comment.

Summary: Sounds like vandalism happened to our rented home after we move out and now landlord's insurance company is trying to collect over $6,000 from me.

Details:
Moved into a rental home in June 2004.
Dec 2007: Lease was due to expire on 12/31/07. I sent letter to landlord stating that we would be moving out in mid-January, but would be willing to pay rent for the full month because at the time I was uncertain of exact move out date, but that it would definitely be in January.
Jan 2008: On Jan 21, full service moving company loaded up all our belongings throughout the day. A friend of my wife came over to say goodbye's and such. One of our neighbors stopped by to take some of our plants that we were not taking. Around 6-7pm I went to landlord's house and returned keys, gave her garage door opener (told her I'd mail the second one, or she could charge me for it because I had left it in the car that had been picked up earlier that day by a car hauler), gave her my new address in Colorado, made sure she had my cell phone number, told her the back door was locked, house was cleaned except for 2 rooms because our vacuum cleaner died on us. I told her all garbage had been hauled away (I paid someone to come and do that during that last day there) but that the dead vacuum was still in the living room.

We leave town around 7-8pm, the exact time can be verified by the CalTran FasTrak toll system because I used a drive through toll scanner thing, and both of our cars drove through since my wife and I were each driving one of our cars. Stayed in Reno that night, Salt Lake the next night, arrived in Denver on Thursday 25th of January.

Didn't hear anything from landlord at all. I was busy and forgot all about the garage door remote. Finally around June I mailed the remote and a friendly reminder to send me my security deposit ($2200) and/or a list of itemized deductions. I assumed there would be some as we have kids and there were some minor marks on the walls, some nicks on the corners, and two windows had been cracked over the years. I had told her about both windows when returning the keys.

Still heard nothing, so I sent an intent to sue letter if I did not get my deposit or justification as to why it wasn't returned.

Finally, in July, I got a letter from the landlord talking about how the house was in the worst condition she has ever seen a property in etc etc. She charged me for trash removal and cleaning and some other things. She mentioned a couch, but there was no couch left at the house. She included a check for a couple hundred dollars and a list of subtractions from the deposit. I though the amounts were high, 450 per window, a few hundred for carpet cleaning, etc. However, since I knew there were some stains on the carpet, and the windows were cracked I didn't feel it was worth going to small claims for a few hundred dollars given that I'd have to fly back to California, possibly multiple times.

A couple days ago I receive a letter from a collections law firm saying they are collecting $6,000+ from me on behalf of State Farm Insurance for the 'incident that happened on January 27'. So I called them to see what was up. The guy I spoke with said he had pictures of graffiti on the mirrors, holes punched in the walls, broken dishwasher, writing on the microwave, a door busted opened, and just a general mess. I explained that the house was not in that condition when we moved out and that I would email him the pictures we took on our last day there. Plan to do that this evening.

Other relevant info: As mentioned, I can easily prove that we left California because I have toll receipts (that indicate direction traveled), hotel bills, moving company bills and pickup receipts. I have pictures of most of the house, multiple people saw the place that day and afternoon and I could probably get their depositions/testimony if needed.
I did have renters insurance on the property through March 2008 I think, certainly had it in January.
We did NOT do a walk through because we had to leave that evening. I DO have pictures of the place after all our furniture and such was removed.

Questions:
Does the insurance company have a valid case against me?
Can the landlord get into trouble if they claimed damages on their home owner's policy that they also billed me for via deduction from my deposit?
Should I go back and contest the security deposit deductions since the landlord apparently received a payment from the insurance company?

Thanks!

 

[FarmerJ]

Just by chance this house wasnt in a rotten or near a rotten area was it ? Its too bad that this all happened BUT I think you should plan on using the links above to speak to a atty as soon as the ins co actually takes you to court. I have no opinion on how it will go , I do think though ( if legal in CA) if you can have a 3rd party use a limited power of atty to file small claims court case for you with you coming back to CA for the hearing that you might be able to convince a Judge that you were not responsible for the vandalism since you had moved with the LL knowing it and bring your pics, there is a chance the court would agree that the LL had not followed your states laws or was unfair in the amounts held back. BTW if the ins co turns it over to collections you will want to send them a written demand for a copy of a court awarded judgement.

 

[dadcobf]

Area

The area was pretty nice when we moved in, but it seemed like the neighborhood was getting worse. Our house was broken into the November before (contributed to our decision to move). The police were telling us that they had several break-ins around that area because kids could just jump the fence from the back alley whenever they saw that people had left to go to work or whatever.

It has gone to collections (the collections attorney that mailed a letter to me), but not to court yet. That is part of the odd thing about this, is that I never received anything from State Farm or the landlord or anyone mentioning the insurance claim until just a couple days ago.

 

[FarmerJ]

Then with it having gone to collections you need to do the demand in writting sent via certified mail , you can tell them if they cannot produce a court judgement then they are to cease further attempts to collect from you. Then check out what I said about finding another party to file for you with a limited power of atty that is written like a instruction wich would be that the only matter the POA would be valid for is filing small claims court case on your behalf , you want to give it a expiration date say ( 90 days after it is granted) this way the other person cannot use it for any other legal matter. ( if it would be legal in CA to do that)

 

[dadcobf]

Re

Thanks. I don't know that many people in California, at least not many I'd trust even with a limited POA. I'll see what happens with my discussions with the collections attorney over the next couple days. If they get adamant, I'll start down the normal collections dispute path. (I have won one of those in court before).

I assume that the insurance company/collector would have to show proof that I actually did the vandalism, correct? I mean, if I was still living there, and the place got vandalized, wouldn't the LL's home owner's policy be liable and not the tenant?

 

[ecmst12]

You have proof of the condition the house was in when you returned the keys and relinquished posession of the house. You can't legally be held accountable to anything that happened to the house after that date. In addition to dealing with the collection agency, you should sue your former landlord for return of your FULL security deposit due to their failure to send the accounting in a timely manner.

 

[wesawitbleed]

california requires an itemized list and deposit postmarked within 21 days of vacating delivered to tenants last known address or new address if given. only way to prolong the return of deposit is to send an estimate of repairs within 21 days of vacating, allowing them 14 more days to hold on to the deposit. they failed to do either of those.

like ecmst12 said, sue for full. you pretty much have a case on that issue alone. and having proof you're family was not in town during the vandalism is just icing on the cake. she'll probably try to counter sue so be ready for that.

 

[dadcobf]

Re

So I have a case even though she did send an itemization and (small) check six months later?

Also - in her letter that I got in July - she says she sent the check before in February. If she has proof that she mailed that, then I would NOT have a case against her correct? (Just as it relates to timing, I realize the might still be a case for excessive repair costs).

 

[wesawitbleed]

if you plan on proving you did not cause the vandalism you should still go to court to sue for what was withheld due to vandalism. again, you can sue for damages twice the amount of what was withheld. now if she can counter sue and try to recover the $6000+ she will do that. just bring all the proof you have when you take it to scc.

now if the LL can prove what damages you left is very questionable. which could lead to you getting the rest of your deposit to equal the full amount. but if the judge can, he could also deduct a portion from your award that would have gone to cleaning the rooms you left.

if you win and the collection agency is still coming after you, well you have the judgment to prove a judge sided with you on the vandalism.

 

[dadcobf]

Thanks for the comments. The only wrinkle in this now is that when I checked my pictures, I don't have pictures of every room. I have a couple of the rooms and they are clearly in good condition. I still haven't seen the pictures of the vandalism, but I'm sure I could get those in discovery if I needed to.

I do still have a few people that would testify though, so I imagine that would help.

Should I send a standard validation request to the collections attorney or do I need something more specific to this case?

 

[FarmerJ]

Simple demand is fine , just make sure that you say you insist on validation of the debt they are attempting to collect from you. In your letter tell them you will be expecting a copy of the judgement to be mailed to (your address) other wise cease all attempts to collect this until they do have a judgement. Sign , date and send certified mail.