Wrongful VSPEC speeding ticket + math help?

[SlightlySalty]

Pennsylvania VSPEC speeding ticket.
Allegedly going 51.70mph in a 35mph
A question about the math involved:
Miles Followed: N/A
Miles Timed: 1.9700
Secs Timed: 0.0284
How does that math add up to 51.7mph?
Is the "secs timed" when he stated and stopped the timer? If so that is ridiculous reaction time and would make sense on a wrong reading.
I was not going a hair over 40mph as it was raining out at night.

 

[FlyingRon]

Something indeed is not right here. The numbers are nonsense as they stand (indeed .03 is a rediculously impossible reaction time and the math doesn't work out on the speed. Further the magnitude is off for the settings and display on the V-SPEC). I'm guessing he wrote them backward. The distance is .0284 and the time is 1.97. That works out to 51.90 mph.

What is written on the ticket is immaterial. If the officer testifies to the bogus numbers in court, then you have him.

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

I agree the numbers are likely switched.

But I would not use the "could only be going 40 because it was raining" defense. People drive faster than 40 in the rain all the time.

 

[xylene]

Just a very very important FYI

People seem to love to do this, but admitting a lower speeding violation is actually a terrible defense - in court or attempting to argue with an officer roadside.

I suggest you get a lawyer to assisst you.

 

[HighwayMan]

I was not going a hair over 40mph as it was raining out at night.

That's a very silly statement.

 

[AgentSmithers]

One thing you may need to to keep in mind is when you're showing your math at trial to show that 1.9700 * x = 51.7 and show that that value is NOT 0.0284.
Or you can show that 0.0284 * x = 51.7 and then show the numbers conflict with the officers testimony. DO NOT make a calculation of his time in open court or you may innocently lay the foundation for the officer that you were still speeding. For instance, if you said well 1.97m * 0.0284s = 51.90 then the judge can take that and have a finding that you were, of course, traveling at that speed. If things go the way they should the number 51.90 should never be brought up...

 

[PaulMall]

Anything a Police officer uses to enforce speed in Pa. has to be calibrated every 60 days unless it is radar than that has to be calibrated once a year. The device itself used to clock you speeding has to be approved by Pa. The calibration station that calibrates such device has to be an approved station by Pa. The section of road where the Police officer clocked you at has to be a straight road. It cannot be a curve in the road. At a hearing if you wish to contest such violation, the Police officer has to have a certificate stating that the device was calibrated within 60 days of your violation. Most Police officers bring a copy instead of the original. This certificate has to be an original as stated in Commonwealth vs. Cummings as it is not a hardship for the Commonwealth to produce such certificate. The Police officer also has to have a certificate that the device used for your violation is an approved device. There also has to be proof that the calibration station that calibrated the device used has to be an approved station. That can be found in the Pennsylvania Bulletin. I'm not saying that speeding is okay but where I'm from, some departments will sit somewhere and clock speeders for half of their shift just to generate revenue for their department. Basically everybody gets paid from speeding. The department gets paid, a small fraction of it of course. Pa. gets paid. The insurance companies get paid. The EMS fund gets paid. It's all a money thing. Whatever you do, do not admit that you were speeding. Also, find out if the magistrate used to be a Police officer. Many Magistrates where I'm from, are former police officers. You can say there is a conflict of interest but that usually doesn't fly. Good Luck.

 

[FlyingRon]

If the officer stands by his numbers as they are on the ticket, as I said, .03 sec is physiologically impossible to do accurately. I spend many years as a NASCAR official and clocked laps with stopwatches (usually the same ROBICs the PA cops use, which by the way are nicer than the V-SPEC toggles). We can usually come +/- .02 of the electric eye timer with practice. With that sort of accuracy, the speed could range from the car moving backwards to almost double what he measured.

Second, it's impossible to read .0284 seconds out of the V-SPEC. It only displays 2 digits to the right of the decimal place for time.

The math doesn't work out. It's not multiplication Wayland, it's DIVISION.

SPEED = DISTANCE / TIME

SPEED (mph) = ( 1.97 (miles) / 0,0284 (sec) ) * ( 3600 sec / hour) = ~250,000 MPH

Now if you flip those numbers around (.0284 miles and 1.97 seconds), that's in the range of the V-SPEC and yields the result of 51.9 MPH

 

[PaulMall]

Also, I left out in the previous comment, If it is possible, have a look at the Police cruiser that pulled you over. I know a guy who had a ticket thrown out because the Police cruiser that pulled him over was the same cruiser that the Police officer drove to the Magistrate's office and the inspection sticker was expired on the cruiser the time. He took a picture of it with his phone and asked the Police officer if that was the car he was driving and he stated yes. He showed the picture to the Magistrate and said that car shouldn't have been out on the road as it was illegal. It got thrown out.

 

[FlyingRon]

Alas, just because the cop was breaking the law doesn't mean you get off. As your mama told you, two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

Also, I left out in the previous comment, If it is possible, have a look at the Police cruiser that pulled you over. I know a guy who had a ticket thrown out because the Police cruiser that pulled him over was the same cruiser that the Police officer drove to the Magistrate's office and the inspection sticker was expired on the cruiser the time. He took a picture of it with his phone and asked the Police officer if that was the car he was driving and he stated yes. He showed the picture to the Magistrate and said that car shouldn't have been out on the road as it was illegal. It got thrown out.

You either heard that story 2nd 3rd or 18th hand or just made it up.

 

[Taxing Matters]

You either heard that story 2nd 3rd or 18th hand or just made it up.

It's possible that the story is true. At least outside Philadelphia and Pittsburgh traffic most traffic cases in that state are heard by district court judges. Those judges are elected officials and are not required to be lawyers. The DA does not appear for most of those cases either; rather it's just the cop that shows up to testify. So that leaves room for a district judge, especially one not a lawyer and not all that well versed in the law, to toss a ticket for something like this just because the judge gets ticked off that the police department is apparently not following the rules itself, even though under the law whether the police car had a valid inspection sticker is not admissible in the traffic offense case and has no bearing on the guilt of the driver. But while this might work with a judge here or there, it's not something that can be counted on for a defense.

I used to work for the federal government in PA many years ago. One of the taxpayers I visited was upset (even though he did owe the taxes I was there to collect) and was looking for some way to get back at me. So he reported to the police that my government car did not have a PA inspection sticker. When the nice police officer showed up, I pointed to the federal government plates and explained that the federal government is not subject to state laws and thus federal government cars are not subject to the PA vehicle inspection laws. So there was no violation of the law. He agreed, we shook hands, and he left. That did not make the taxpayer happy. I don't know if state/local government cars in PA are exempt from the inspection rules too, but they could be.

 

[PaulMall]

It's actually a true story. My cousin just got out of a speeding ticket. He got clocked going 48 in a 35. Where the Police officer was sitting at was at the end of a one way street. He pulled out going the wrong way to pull my cousin over. He brought this up questioning the Police officer at his hearing. The Magistrate dismissed it.

 

[FarmerJ]

now that ive had my wake up coffee , a former co -worker used to tell me that at night one had to speed in order to miss hitting deer.