Do I have to defend or explain my actions/decisions?

[BalloonGirl]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? NH

When my former husband attacks parenting decisions I have made, am I under any legal obligation to respond? Case in point, the below quote is from an email he sent...

"Another question to you is what happened at the Halloween party with the kids, (10 year olds) drinking beer? The girls told us that you let them sleep over their house Saturday October 25th when this happened. I am very uncomfortable with who you are exposing the girls to and if you are you making proper decisions for the girls and their well being? We are questioning your judgement as custodial parent!!!!! I want and have the right to the whole story!"

Does he have the legal right to the whole story?

And - FYI - the kids "drinking beer" had bottles of root beer, the ones that look like real beer bottles, and were 14, not 10 yr olds... And they weren't OUR kids drinking root beer, they were other kids at the party.

If this were an isolated "demanding to know" I wouldn't mind. But there is always something of my parenting he criticizes and wants me to explain.

Do I have to keep defending myself?

[mistoffolees]

Originally Posted by BalloonGirl

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? NH

When my former husband attacks parenting decisions I have made, am I under any legal obligation to respond? Case in point, the below quote is from an email he sent...

"Another question to you is what happened at the Halloween party with the kids, (10 year olds) drinking beer? The girls told us that you let them sleep over their house Saturday October 25th when this happened. I am very uncomfortable with who you are exposing the girls to and if you are you making proper decisions for the girls and their well being? We are questioning your judgement as custodial parent!!!!! I want and have the right to the whole story!"

Does he have the legal right to the whole story?

And - FYI - the kids "drinking beer" had bottles of root beer, the ones that look like real beer bottles, and were 14, not 10 yr olds... And they weren't OUR kids drinking root beer, they were other kids at the party.

If this were an isolated "demanding to know" I wouldn't mind. But there is always something of my parenting he criticizes and wants me to explain.

Do I have to keep defending myself?

This was discussed at length in another thread just a day or two ago.

You have no obligation to respond to every allegation. If he thinks it's serious, though, he is free to go to court to bring up custody and then you'll be explaining it to the judge.

If he has joint legal custody, he DOES have legal responsibility to ensure the child's well-being, anyway.

In the above case, I would simply respond factually with a note that the girls had root beer while they were at your house and that you agree it would have been inappropriate if you had served them real beer. Then drop it.

It's a pain in the rear, but he is the child's father and probably deserves the benefit of the doubt - maybe he really IS concerned about her well-being. It's a lot easier to explain it now than to let him go on thinking that you're serving them beer until all these accumulated mis-conceptions build up in his mind.

[LdiJ]

Originally Posted by BalloonGirl

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? NH

When my former husband attacks parenting decisions I have made, am I under any legal obligation to respond? Case in point, the below quote is from an email he sent...

"Another question to you is what happened at the Halloween party with the kids, (10 year olds) drinking beer? The girls told us that you let them sleep over their house Saturday October 25th when this happened. I am very uncomfortable with who you are exposing the girls to and if you are you making proper decisions for the girls and their well being? We are questioning your judgement as custodial parent!!!!! I want and have the right to the whole story!"

Does he have the legal right to the whole story?

And - FYI - the kids "drinking beer" had bottles of root beer, the ones that look like real beer bottles, and were 14, not 10 yr olds... And they weren't OUR kids drinking root beer, they were other kids at the party.

If this were an isolated "demanding to know" I wouldn't mind. But there is always something of my parenting he criticizes and wants me to explain.

Do I have to keep defending myself?

If this is typical, then yes, I think that you have to respond. I think that he might be attempting (and very poorly at that) to set up a paper trail demonstrating that you are not a fit parent.

I would respond very simply:

There were children drinking root beer. The kind that comes in bottles. Our children didn't drink any root beer. There were no children drinking beer.

Then I would print out his email, with headers, and your response, and put them together in a file.

[BalloonGirl]

Just to clarify - it wasn't at my house, and it wasn't our children, it was other kids at the Halloween party.

Does that change your suggestion?

I did read the previous thread, and have been trying to follow those suggestions for a while now - we are not allowed to communicate except via email because of his harassment, and I typically respond "Thank you for your concern," without going through explanations.

They fall on deaf ears anyhow.

I just wasn't sure if I had a LEGAL obligation to explain my decisions to him.

[LdiJ]

Originally Posted by BalloonGirl

Just to clarify - it wasn't at my house, and it wasn't our children, it was other kids at the Halloween party.

Does that change your suggestion?

I did read the previous thread, and have been trying to follow those suggestions for a while now - we are not allowed to communicate except via email because of his harassment, and I typically respond "Thank you for your concern," without going through explanations.

They fall on deaf ears anyhow.

I just wasn't sure if I had a LEGAL obligation to explain my decisions to him.

Since you are only allowed to communicate by email, and its necessary for you to communicate with the children's other parent, I do think that legally you have to response to some extent.

Sometimes it may be ok to simply say "thank you for your concern". However, sometimes you may need to give some brief explanation. You cannot make it appear that you are refusing to engage in the only form of communication that is allowed under the court orders.

However, your explanation can stick to simple facts.

In fact, in this case you could give an even simpler explanation than I suggested previously:

"LOL...it was ROOT beer in bottles".

[BalloonGirl]

Well... I sent this, because I did leave the kids there...

"I was unaware of any underage children drinking at the party. I asked the children what they saw, and they said they saw 8th graders (not 10 year olds) with beer. I do know that there was a lot of IBC Root Beer in bottles being passed around, and perhaps that is what they saw. Since I didn't see anything after I left, I can't address it. I assure you, if I had seen it happening, I would not have allowed the girls to accept the invitation to sleep over."

Got this in reply:
"I believe the girls about the party, I don't believe you. They had too many details that nobody at their age could make up."

So, I sent back:
"You are entitled to believe whatever you'd like. I spoke the truth of what I saw. I am not disputing what the children saw, simply that I did not see it and if I had, I would not have left the children."

Did I do ok?

[mmmagique]

I hate to say this, but there is a difference in what you said to us at the beginning, and what you are saying now.

So there WAS beer at the party?

You didn't ask the parents what happened?

This doesn't sound right.

[LdiJ]

Originally Posted by mmmagique

I hate to say this, but there is a difference in what you said to us at the beginning, and what you are saying now.

So there WAS beer at the party?

You didn't ask the parents what happened?

This doesn't sound right.

I agree. You were very specific with us that there were no children drinking beer at the party. You were very specific with us that it was root beer.

If there were no children drinking beer at the party then why were you not specific with dad?

[BalloonGirl]

It also said in my post that the kids slept over - meaning I left the party before it was over. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear.

I only saw kids with root beer. When I asked the other parents (including specifically the parent of the specific child my kids named), and the owners of the house, that is what they saw as well.

I asked my kids, they said they saw "Jane Doe" with a bottle of beer. I called "Jane Doe's" mom, talked to her, she said "Jane Doe" wasn't drinking beer, that she saw her with root beer only.

HOWEVER - there were lots of people there at a very large house. Is it possible there were kids sneaking beer? Sure it is possible. Could I testify under oath that there were no kids sneaking beer? No - I wasn't there the whole time, nor could I monitor the entire house every minute.

I answered his question as truthfully as I could - and I'm sorry if I wasn't clear in my original post.

I wasn't there the whole night.

There was beer at the party - for the 21+ crowd. This is a huge, annual party, with familes, singles, couples, kids. There is beer, wine, soda, water, juice boxes, milk. We've been attending for 6 years, and I have never seen anyone under 21 drinking alcohol there. It isn't allowed.

I saw kids with root beer.

The other parents saw kids drinking root beer.

My kids didn't say anything to me about seeing kids with beer until I told them what their father mentioned.

I asked the other parents who were there the whole party, and they confirmed what I saw was also what they saw.

So, to the best of my knowledge, there were no kids drinking beer.

Should I badger my kids to make them understand it was only root beer and have them talk to their dad again? It wouldn't matter. He won't believe me, nor would he believe the other parents.

I am a firm believer of keeping the kids out of the middle. They said what they saw to him and to me. I did my calls and am satisfied there were no kids drinking beer.

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

In a court of law, he could NOT prove that OTHER children had beer. Can we safely assume that you monitored YOUR children while you were there so that they did not consume alcoholic beverages?

[BalloonGirl]

Originally Posted by tinkerbelleluvr

in a court of law, he could not prove that other children had beer. Can we safely assume that you monitored your children while you were there so that they did not consume alcoholic beverages?

absolutely!

[LdiJ]

Originally Posted by BalloonGirl

It also said in my post that the kids slept over - meaning I left the party before it was over. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear.

I only saw kids with root beer. When I asked the other parents (including specifically the parent of the specific child my kids named), and the owners of the house, that is what they saw as well.

I asked my kids, they said they saw "Jane Doe" with a bottle of beer. I called "Jane Doe's" mom, talked to her, she said "Jane Doe" wasn't drinking beer, that she saw her with root beer only.

HOWEVER - there were lots of people there at a very large house. Is it possible there were kids sneaking beer? Sure it is possible. Could I testify under oath that there were no kids sneaking beer? No - I wasn't there the whole time, nor could I monitor the entire house every minute.

I answered his question as truthfully as I could - and I'm sorry if I wasn't clear in my original post.

I wasn't there the whole night.

There was beer at the party - for the 21+ crowd. This is a huge, annual party, with familes, singles, couples, kids. There is beer, wine, soda, water, juice boxes, milk. We've been attending for 6 years, and I have never seen anyone under 21 drinking alcohol there. It isn't allowed.

I saw kids with root beer.

The other parents saw kids drinking root beer.

My kids didn't say anything to me about seeing kids with beer until I told them what their father mentioned.

I asked the other parents who were there the whole party, and they confirmed what I saw was also what they saw.

So, to the best of my knowledge, there were no kids drinking beer.

Should I badger my kids to make them understand it was only root beer and have them talk to their dad again? It wouldn't matter. He won't believe me, nor would he believe the other parents.

I am a firm believer of keeping the kids out of the middle. They said what they saw to him and to me. I did my calls and am satisfied there were no kids drinking beer.

The way you worded it to dad made it sound like you were backpedaling. I would have honestly taken what you said to mean that there were probably kids drinking beer but you didn't see it.

I would have said something along the lines of:

"We have gone to this annual party every year for the last six years. Children have never been allowed to drink alcohol at this party. I checked with several of the other parents, including the parents of the girl that our children said were drinking beer, and all of them said that no children were drinking beer. The children however were drinking root beer from bottles. I cannot guarantee that no child snuck a beer. No one can guarantee that no child snuck a beer. However, after talking to the other parents, I am satisfied that no children were drinking beer."

You need to be firmer with dad when he makes those kinds of accusations. It also wouldn't hurt to have a talk with your children about being absolutely certain about things before they tell them to people. That it can unfairly cause trouble for people.

For example, you could use the child that the named by name. You can say something along the lines of:

"If Jane Doe was really drinking beer, then she could get into a lot of trouble, and so can Jane Doe's parents. If you are really sure that she was drinking actual beer, then its ok to tell. However, if you are not really sure, then its not fair to her to make an accusation like that."

[mistoffolees]

Originally Posted by LdiJ

The way you worded it to dad made it sound like you were backpedaling. I would have honestly taken what you said to mean that there were probably kids drinking beer but you didn't see it.

I would have said something along the lines of:

"We have gone to this annual party every year for the last six years. Children have never been allowed to drink alcohol at this party. I checked with several of the other parents, including the parents of the girl that our children said were drinking beer, and all of them said that no children were drinking beer. The children however were drinking root beer from bottles. I cannot guarantee that no child snuck a beer. No one can guarantee that no child snuck a beer. However, after talking to the other parents, I am satisfied that no children were drinking beer."

You need to be firmer with dad when he makes those kinds of accusations. It also wouldn't hurt to have a talk with your children about being absolutely certain about things before they tell them to people. That it can unfairly cause trouble for people.

For example, you could use the child that the named by name. You can say something along the lines of:

"If Jane Doe was really drinking beer, then she could get into a lot of trouble, and so can Jane Doe's parents. If you are really sure that she was drinking actual beer, then its ok to tell. However, if you are not really sure, then its not fair to her to make an accusation like that."

I agree with all of that completely. However, I guess I have a little problem with letting 10 year olds spend the night with a crowd of kids large enough (including older kids) that the parents/chaperones can't say for sure that there was no beer.

There's a big difference between "we didn't see any beer" and "we supervised the kids all the time and if there had been beer, we would have seen it". Maybe I'm over-reacting, but it sounds like a poorly supervised party which I would be concerned about as a father. I want to know that my kids are safe, particularly at that age, not just "well, we didn't see any beer, but it could have been there".

If the chaperones don't know for sure that there was no beer, how do they know the kids weren't off having sex or doing drugs (hopefully not the 10 year olds, but you never know these days).

[LdiJ]

Originally Posted by mistoffolees

I agree with all of that completely. However, I guess I have a little problem with letting 10 year olds spend the night with a crowd of kids large enough (including older kids) that the parents/chaperones can't say for sure that there was no beer.

There's a big difference between "we didn't see any beer" and "we supervised the kids all the time and if there had been beer, we would have seen it". Maybe I'm over-reacting, but it sounds like a poorly supervised party which I would be concerned about as a father. I want to know that my kids are safe, particularly at that age, not just "well, we didn't see any beer, but it could have been there".

If the chaperones don't know for sure that there was no beer, how do they know the kids weren't off having sex or doing drugs (hopefully not the 10 year olds, but you never know these days).

While I understand your point, it sounds to me like it really wasn't that kind of party. It wasn't a kid party with some adults supervising, it was an adult and kid party with a equal ratio of adults to kids...,with adults having their beverages and kids having theirs. At that kind of party its less likely that kids are going to sneak off, because there are too many adults around to be successful. I suspect that most of the kids there belonged to adults who were also there. Even the OP mentioned that she was at the party, its only that her kids didn't go home with her because they spent the night.

[BalloonGirl]

Originally Posted by LdiJ

While I understand your point, it sounds to me like it really wasn't that kind of party. It wasn't a kid party with some adults supervising, it was an adult and kid party with a equal ratio of adults to kids...,with adults having their beverages and kids having theirs. At that kind of party its less likely that kids are going to sneak off, because there are too many adults around to be successful. I suspect that most of the kids there belonged to adults who were also there. Even the OP mentioned that she was at the party, its only that her kids didn't go home with her because they spent the night.

Correct - on all counts.

It is mainly a family party - lots of parents, aunts, uncles, friends who are as close as family - and their kids. Mine were the only ones who slept over - and they have slept over at that house probably 30 times over the past few years (and the kids from that family have slept over equal times at my home) - our families are very close. When I left at 10:30, the majority of the party-goers had left, and the remainder were gone by 11:30.

Mist, I can see your point, and if it were a really rowdy party, with tons of kids running around unsupervised, I would totally agree. But, it wasn't like that at all. I'm sure you're right (from your earlier post) - he will add this to his pile of things he thinks I do that are inappropriate in an attempt to prove I am an unfit parent. Do I think he could prove that? Absolutely not. Is it incredibly draining to deal with his attacks? Absolutely. And he puts the kids in the middle all the time, which is even worse.

Bottom line - I have told him that we need to have child support recalculated - it hasn't been done since our initial one at our divorce in 2003 when he was self-employed and making peanuts. He knows his amount is going to go up. So... he is angry and attacks everything.

Do I waste my breath trying to defend and explain everything? I have asked a hundred times to go to coparenting counseling, but he refuses.

The post has gotten very off track from what I intended - which was - do I have to respond to all his attacks? I guess the question about the party was a bad example, lol....