Broke and worse.

[ThePlane22]

Wisconsin, Brown County.

If you have joint legal custody, and shared placement, with a child support order to pay half of medical bills each, but 1 parent solely decides to have a medical procedure done that is not life threatening, such as getting braces at early age, can the parent who was excluded in the decision process opt out of paying for that process on that basis?

Basically my ex took my son to the orthodontist for a consultation. He is covered by my insurance so i gave her the card to bill the insurance for his consultation. She calls me a month later stating they are at his appointment and she needs 100 dollars from me right away or they will refuse treatment. I was not made aware that he was getting any treatment. She took him for his consultation and then again to get braces on.. He is 7 years old with literally 2 braces and 2 brackets in his mouth. That's all the adult teeth he has on top. They are doing this to correct an overbite, which i too had as a kid, but mine was not fixed or even worked on until 6th grade. She has been really bad about not telling me about any of his appointments, his teacher conferences or any of his out of school activities. I work 6 days on 2 off, so I only get to have him on those days, plus all morning in the summer. The court agreement is a shared placement of approx 33% and i pay apporox 17% child support(the max allowed) and i am also responsible to pay half of his medical bills, like his meds, doctors appointments etc. Keep in mind i also have insurance for him, which thankfully is quite good. But i dont feel i should be paying 450 of 900 on braces that i had no opinion on. Not to mention it is 1800 billed to my insurance, which picked up half. And he is likely to need full mouth of braces later, that will not be covered in this 1800 dollar procedure now. Please Help!

 

[LillianX]

Braces are kind of a grey area. I'm inclined to think that if, at age 7, the dentist/orthodontist was putting brackets on him, his overbite is severe enough that it was necessary.

This is one of those times in your co-parenting where you're going to have to decide whether or not it's worth a fight. You can certainly refuse to pay, she'll file for contempt and it'll go before a judge. It will create a ton of animosity between you and Mom. Is it worth it?

Do you have a mediation clause in your court order? Try that before court. Heck, maybe try it anyway, even without a clause.

Is 400 dollars worth not having a completely adversarial relationship with the mother of your child?

 

[ThePlane22]

i understand 450 doesnt seem like a lot, but his medications are at 50 a month with my insurance, and he makes regular trips to childrens hospital which is 2 hrs away. If this was the first and only time, i wouldnt have a problem. But she makes every decision without me. there is so much animosity between us already that this will merely fall into their somewhere. When i was 7 i went before orthodontist too. They recommended braces then too. But my parents agreed it didnt make sense to start them at that age, and then redo them in 5 years again. so we waited. I have a good full set of teeth and a nice smile. Dental checkups are always good. I dont think this was necessary based on personal experience. But she didnt even talk to me about it, thats what really hurts. I dont have extra money right now becuase of our State of wisconsin governor and all his budget cuts on state workers.

Im not a high paid state worker either. I dont want people to think i make 50k or more a year. cause i dont. I make around 30k, i rent, have a car payment. No handouts here!

 

[Free_Advice]

you gonna pay ... just the way it is -- sorry

 

[Tayla]

I would "suggest" getting a second opinion of the dental even if the child is in process of the braces. Since this is a legal site I will stick to the legal inquiry.

1: What does the court order state on "elective" procedures?
2: What does the court order say in reference to the insurance holder? Technically if you are taking the expense to pay the monthly dues on insurance then the courts recognize this and adjust the monetary ratio of out of pocket amounts. ( *footnote sometimes* since a permanent medical condition runs 50/50 or more in favor of the guardian paying near nothing since they have to do the daily care of the child etc)
3: I would at least petition the court to make a decision on this matter as the child will be growing , this issue will rear its ugly head again ...best to have the courts decide on clarification.
On a side note....Most orders for medical require BOTH parents be involved in the decision unless its a medical emergency ....

 

[ThePlane22]

I would "suggest" getting a second opinion of the dental even if the child is in process of the braces. Since this is a legal site I will stick to the legal inquiry.

1: What does the court order state on "elective" procedures?
2: What does the court order say in reference to the insurance holder? Technically if you are taking the expense to pay the monthly dues on insurance then the courts recognize this and adjust the monetary ratio of out of pocket amounts. ( *footnote sometimes* since a permanent medical condition runs 50/50 or more in favor of the guardian paying near nothing since they have to do the daily care of the child etc)
3: I would at least petition the court to make a decision on this matter as the child will be growing , this issue will rear its ugly head again ...best to have the courts decide on clarification.
On a side note....Most orders for medical require BOTH parents be involved in the decision unless its a medical emergency ....

1. courts dont generally state on "electives" unless it is brought upon, which it may need to be.
2. she carries insurance for him too, but it is never really used because until jan 1st, mine carries virtually no out of pocket.
3. i want to take this to court, but at the same time, if i just put this 100+ its gonna cost at court towards this, it could all be settled. But if i dont pay, and she petitions the court...i would have to pay both if i lose. neither if i win... i just dont know how the court would see this. I may try to get him in with the ortho i saw if i have too. This is more or less to prove a point to her, that i have a right to make decisions on his life too. This whole seperation is way more elaborate than i can even begin to relay on here. Bottom line, i love my son like i love my other 2 kids, but he cant take all my money. i gotta think about all my kids.

 

[mistoffolees]

I would "suggest" getting a second opinion of the dental even if the child is in process of the braces. Since this is a legal site I will stick to the legal inquiry.

1: What does the court order state on "elective" procedures?
2: What does the court order say in reference to the insurance holder? Technically if you are taking the expense to pay the monthly dues on insurance then the courts recognize this and adjust the monetary ratio of out of pocket amounts. ( *footnote sometimes* since a permanent medical condition runs 50/50 or more in favor of the guardian paying near nothing since they have to do the daily care of the child etc)

Rarely. Most commonly, the expense is split 50:50 or split proportional to income. It is very rare (if not unheard of) for CP to get a break on medical expenses because they have the daily care of the child. That's what child support covers.

3: I would at least petition the court to make a decision on this matter as the child will be growing , this issue will rear its ugly head again ...best to have the courts decide on clarification.

More important than any of those questions - was the procedure medically necessary or cosmetic (not your opinion, but the orthodontist's professional opinion)?

On a side note....Most orders for medical require BOTH parents be involved in the decision unless its a medical emergency ....

Not always true.

 

[ThePlane22]

i do not have all the facts from the cosultation, but i did get a letter in the mail stating generic statements that overbites cause. I.e. damage to the palate of the upper jaw. That being said, there are long term injuries to the mouth associated to that, but whether he is or was in imminent threat to those i do not know.



thank you everyone, if you cannot give me an answer, you only help me learn how to make my case stronger or learn what i need to know.

 

[mistoffolees]

i do not have all the facts from the cosultation, but i did get a letter in the mail stating generic statements that overbites cause. I.e. damage to the palate of the upper jaw. That being said, there are long term injuries to the mouth associated to that, but whether he is or was in imminent threat to those i do not know.

That sounds like medical necessity (which was likely because of the age, anyway). That makes it much easier for ex to ask the court to have you pay your share.

 

[tuffbrk]

Dental is not medical. I'd check the wording of the agreement.

 

[LdiJ]

Dental is not medical. I'd check the wording of the agreement.

That is not really correct. Family law wise dental is normally included in medical expenses.

 

[tuffbrk]

Hmm...my order is very specific. Learn something new every day!