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majomom1

Senior Member
What is the name of your state? MO/KS


At cjane’s suggestion I am posting this for additional help… I know if she is baffled at this there must to be something wrong.

I am still seeking the return of my 16 yo son after summer break and I am getting very frustrated at the process and events. Court order is in MO. We have joint legal custody. I have sole physical and my address is for mailing and education. My ex lives in KS and has refused to return our son and has enrolled him in other school in KS. That school will not honor my court order for custody and has allowed him to start/attend school. They do not have school records as my school is refusing to transfer records, per the court order.

8/12 Son was supposed to be returned. (Ex returned our 14yo son, but not the 16 yo.) My ex was 5 hours late returning, so I could only charge contempt for being late. He stated that he was not returning our 16yo, but there was nothing I could do until he actually didn’t return him. The sheriff refused to do a stand by to record the time they arrived and the non return of 16 yo, I had to call that in, which I did at 12:05 a.m. on 8/13.

8/14, after receiving advice here, I tried to file for an emergency ex parte order, for the return of my son. The court would not file it as there was no abuse. I went to the sheriff’s office and requested a charge for custodial interference and failure to return. Per MO statute this is a crime, and out of state is a felony. The deputy contacted my ex, and the KS school. My ex basically told him to F-off, and the school said it is not their problem. His attorney then called the deputy and asked if he would hold off filing the police report. The deputy said they would process for a warrant.

8/15 per my previous attorney, I was told I could file a Motion for Family Access without an attorney. I thought they said this would be heard within 15 days, but cannot find anything to confirm that. I also learned, that my ex filed a motion to modify and a request for temporary custody of both our kids that morning.

8/16 I received confirmation that the warrant request was sent to prosecutor’s office.

8/22 I called prosecutor. They did not have anything. I called sheriff again. It was still in the bin. (?) They re-processed and sent it over.

8/23 I received ex’s motion to modify.

8/24 Call from Prosecutor, they are not willing to file charges, because of the motion to modify.

8/29 Ex was served with my motion for family access. I had to call to get this info on 9/6/07. The clerk called the KS sheriff and got info that he was served and paperwork was on it's way.

9/12 I called to inquire about hearing: when and how I would be notified etc. I spoke directly to the judge’s clerk. The first possible date was 10/15. She called my ex’s attorney, and confirmed it all, while I was on the phones.

9/14 Notice of hearing filed by ex’s attorney and their notification that they were “calling up” all motions pending, to be included in the Family Access hearing. Time on this notice is 9:00.

9/18 Notice of hearing from the court… time is 1:30. I was also able to hire an attorney. She laughed at the motion for modification and his "change in circumstance" etc...

9/26 Ex attorney filed Motion for In Camera Interview of the minor children.

9/20 Met with my attorney to finalize answers and counter modification/contempt. My attorney was to file a Motion for Leave to File Out of Time, she said she would fax to my ex’s attorney etc.

9/27 Docket entry for Motion to file out of time.

10/4 Answers filed and she file my counter motion to modify and contempt

10/10 Docket entry: Response to the In Camera interview of the kids filed. (I have not seen this document yet.)

Now today, I have learned that our hearing has been continued to Nov 19th, because of the time mix up.

My attorney says there is nothing I can do. That makes no sense to me. Legally my ex has committed a crime and is getting away with it. My son is “illegally” enrolled in an out of state school and there is nothing I can do about it except wait for court?

It seems to me that someone should be able to make my ex return my son and HE be the one to wait for court. My attorney did say that the judge had requested that we both attend the parenting course that is required… Why can’t the judge “request” or state that my ex is to return our son, and follow the current court order, until the hearing?

I know more info may be required. Please ask specific questions and I'll try to answer. I will also try to find my previous threads and add them here.What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state?
 


LdiJ

Senior Member
This would have gone far differently if your child had been 6 rather than 16. This isn't being handled forcefully by the "powers that be" because your child is an older teen.
 

casa

Senior Member
What is the name of your state? MO/KS


At cjane_s suggestion I am posting this for additional help_ I know if she is baffled at this there must to be something wrong.

I am still seeking the return of my 16 yo son after summer break and I am getting very frustrated at the process and events. Court order is in MO. We have joint legal custody. I have sole physical and my address is for mailing and education. My ex lives in KS and has refused to return our son and has enrolled him in other school in KS. That school will not honor my court order for custody and has allowed him to start/attend school. They do not have school records as my school is refusing to transfer records, per the court order.

Smart school

8/12 Son was supposed to be returned. (Ex returned our 14yo son, but not the 16 yo.) My ex was 5 hours late returning, so I could only charge contempt for being late. He stated that he was not returning our 16yo, but there was nothing I could do until he actually didn_t return him. The sheriff refused to do a stand by to record the time they arrived and the non return of 16 yo, I had to call that in, which I did at 12:05 a.m. on 8/13.

Just because they refused a stand by...doesn't mean there isn't a data log of your call to the Police Dept., which will cite number & complaint. ;) Check with the Law Enforcement office you contacted. I recommend you do so in person - explaining the need for the information is that your X is defying court order & engaging in Parental Interference/Abduction. See what happens there.

8/14, after receiving advice here, I tried to file for an emergency ex parte order, for the return of my son. The court would not file it as there was no abuse. I went to the sheriff_s office and requested a charge for custodial interference and failure to return. Per MO statute this is a crime, and out of state is a felony. The deputy contacted my ex, and the KS school. My ex basically told him to F-off, and the school said it is not their problem. His attorney then called the deputy and asked if he would hold off filing the police report. The deputy said they would process for a warrant.

Have you checked out the site deltabravo.net? It has excellent form letters & information, links etc. for situations with schools, doctors, etc. The deputy said he would process for a warrant? What is the actual charge? When would they process it?

8/15 per my previous attorney, I was told I could file a Motion for Family Access without an attorney. I thought they said this would be heard within 15 days, but cannot find anything to confirm that. I also learned, that my ex filed a motion to modify and a request for temporary custody of both our kids that morning.

KS accepted his filing for custody when MO has Jurisdiction???? :eek: Has anyone notified KS courts there is an existing MO Court Order?

8/16 I received confirmation that the warrant request was sent to prosecutor_s office.

8/22 I called prosecutor. They did not have anything. I called sheriff again. It was still in the bin. (?) They re-processed and sent it over.

8/23 I received ex_s motion to modify.

8/24 Call from Prosecutor, they are not willing to file charges, because of the motion to modify.

8/29 Ex was served with my motion for family access. I had to call to get this info on 9/6/07. The clerk called the KS sheriff and got info that he was served and paperwork was on it's way.

9/12 I called to inquire about hearing: when and how I would be notified etc. I spoke directly to the judge_s clerk. The first possible date was 10/15. She called my ex_s attorney, and confirmed it all, while I was on the phones.

9/14 Notice of hearing filed by ex_s attorney and their notification that they were _calling up_ all motions pending, to be included in the Family Access hearing. Time on this notice is 9:00.

9/18 Notice of hearing from the court_ time is 1:30. I was also able to hire an attorney. She laughed at the motion for modification and his "change in circumstance" etc...

9/26 Ex attorney filed Motion for In Camera Interview of the minor children.

9/20 Met with my attorney to finalize answers and counter modification/contempt. My attorney was to file a Motion for Leave to File Out of Time, she said she would fax to my ex_s attorney etc.

9/27 Docket entry for Motion to file out of time.

10/4 Answers filed and she file my counter motion to modify and contempt

10/10 Docket entry: Response to the In Camera interview of the kids filed. (I have not seen this document yet.)

Now today, I have learned that our hearing has been continued to Nov 19th, because of the time mix up.

My attorney says there is nothing I can do. That makes no sense to me. Legally my ex has committed a crime and is getting away with it. My son is _illegally_ enrolled in an out of state school and there is nothing I can do about it except wait for court?

It seems to me that someone should be able to make my ex return my son and HE be the one to wait for court. My attorney did say that the judge had requested that we both attend the parenting course that is required_ Why can_t the judge _request_ or state that my ex is to return our son, and follow the current court order, until the hearing?

I know more info may be required. Please ask specific questions and I'll try to answer. I will also try to find my previous threads and add them here.What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state?
You're going to have to have patience with this one. It's going to feel unbearable, but a few months out of your lives is worth the years of him being you after that. If you freak out and irritate people who will ultimately help you~ you will do yourself no favors.

Have you flown to KS and showed up @ the same non-reactive school WITH your Court Order in hand & walked out with the children? I would recommend that IF it weren't already so late that there are court hearings being scheduled.

They have to untangle Jurisdiction first & foremost.

edit to add: Please tell me that you didn't accept Jurisdiction to KS???
 
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majomom1

Senior Member
LdiJ This would have gone far differently if your child had been 6 rather than 16. This isn't being handled forcefully by the "powers that be" because your child is an older teen.
Yes I know. That is why I have referred to this as a "gray" area. The age DOES matter.

He went from never wanting to live with my ex, to wanting to move NOW, after being promised a car and has done a 180 in attitude and behavior, including too many kids in car, warning tickets, speeding tickets and more. I have adults telling me that he has way too long of a leash, that he is being "made" to testify and being "bullied" into choosing him. They are also watching out for him. I have proof and people willing to testify.. IF I CAN GET MY EX INTO COURT!

I also have a 14yo quickly following suit. I am still responsible and worried about him until he is 18. My ex says I have NO say since he is 16... I disagree. Our court order is also in effect until he is 18, so I have to try whatever I can.

Thanks.
 

TinkerBelleLuvr

Senior Member
Majo ... after I muttered a few expletives here after reading about the continuance ... I'm trying to figure out how the times were different. Was this your attorney, his attorney, or the fact that there were two different attorneys involved. My gut feel is that is was your x's attorney that caused the screwup when he tried to combine the motions.

changing attorneys probably won't make anything go any faster.

I'll email you later.
 

majomom1

Senior Member
casa... thanks for your response.

Yes I have all phone records and police filings. We are actually on bordering states, so we are only 20 min apart. He filed his modification in MO... there is no way I will ever let it go to KS.

I did walk into the school, with my court order. They still will do nothing. They say they have to enroll all students and claim my ex is violating the order, not them.

I was trying to do this quickly, without fireworks and thought we would have the Family Access Hearing by now. I was trying to do this through the courts. Now I am getting ready to send a letter to the school district. They are violating their own board policy for enrollement of students; and any student that doesn't have certified transcripts on file after 30 days is supposed to start an investigation and report it for Missing kids etc... I am still looking for the appropriate wording...

And I am looking for any other avenue I can.
 

majomom1

Senior Member
Posted by Ginny J

Majo ... after I muttered a few expletives here after reading about the continuance ... I'm trying to figure out how the times were different. Was this your attorney, his attorney, or the fact that there were two different attorneys involved. My gut feel is that is was your x's attorney that caused the screwup when he tried to combine the motions.

changing attorneys probably won't make anything go any faster.

I'll email you later.
Thanks Ginny.... I will bet that I already used up all the expletives you did, but I welcome your support. I do believe it was his attorney that is creating this mix up. The court clerk gave us both the time, on the phone.... I think this "error" was intended.

But... I finally found the statute...

8. Final disposition of a motion for a family access order filed pursuant to this section shall take place not more than sixty days after the service of such motion, unless waived by the parties or determined to be in the best interest of the child. Final disposition shall not include appellate review.

I will be calling the court clerk tomorrow and reading this statute. The other stuff can be continued, but the Family Access Motion has to be heard by Oct 29th, to meet the 60 day time frame.
 

Ronin

Member
You should have gotten an experienced family law attorney involved from day one who would have known which legal buttons to push in each state to get prompt action. You wasted some time on ex-parte orders that were not appropriate and other self filed motions for family access and such. The buttons that needed to be pushed should have been with an attorney and law enforcement agencies in the state your child is in. But that is all water under the bridge now.

You can get an opinion from another attorney if you not satisfied with your attorneys explanation, but you have now gone far enough that you will likely have to ride this one out with the schedule the court has already set. There is probably not a big sense of urgency, legally speaking that is, since the kid is 16, and you have given no indication he is staying against his will.

On the above 60 day requirement, don't be surprised if that is ignored by the court. The best interest of the child clause is often improperly used.

It is not uncommon for a boy his age to go through a phase where he needs and would rather be with his father. Since I do not know the circumstances of this case, I only hope that however this shakes out is in the best interests of the child.
 
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majomom1

Senior Member
Posted by Ronin
You should have gotten an experienced family law attorney involved from day one who would have known which legal buttons to push in each state to get prompt action. You wasted some time on ex-parte orders that were not appropriate and other self filed motions for family access and such. The buttons that needed to be pushed should have been with an attorney and law enforcement agencies in the state your child is in. But that is all water under the bridge now.
True, but at the time I didn't have the money and legally no buttons should have needed to be pushed. I follow the court order. I expect him to do the same.

Legally, he can't enroll him in the other school and legally he can't deny custody or visitation. But he is doing it and will probably get away with it.

It is not uncommon for a boy his age to go through a phase where he needs and would rather be with his father. Since I do not know the circumstances of this case, I only hope that however this shakes out is in the best interests of the child.
It is not uncommon no... and I fully expected it and have never denied him being with his father. We have now changed states, schools and my son loses the use of his car "if" he comes to see me, that is so not right. I volunteered to share expenses on the car, and create rules for both houses, so he could have use of it in both places. I have always made our son clear any plans, with my ex on his time. My ex doesn't give me the same respect.

There was a time when our son was angry and didn't even want to go with my ex. I made him go and encouraged him to work it out with his dad. That all changed, after the purchase of the car. Now dad lets him go and do whatever he wants... and from what I understand our son begs people to let him come over so he can get away from his dad...

Thanks for your hope... I too want what is in the best interest of our son, even if it means that he lives with Dad. I would never tell him he had to choose and I would never impose any rule that our son could not drive a car, that I bought, to go see his dad.
 

CJane

Senior Member
You can get an opinion from another attorney if you not satisfied with your attorneys explanation,
No you can't. If you have an attorney working on your case, another attorney CANNOT consult with you about the same case w/out the first attorney withdrawing.
 

Ronin

Member
No you can't. If you have an attorney working on your case, another attorney CANNOT consult with you about the same case w/out the first attorney withdrawing.
Thats not necessarily true. There's consulting and then there is consulting, and most attorneys know how to toe the line. I consulted with an attorney other than my own before making the decision to change lead attorneys in the past. It was all on the up and up, and both attorneys understood the reasons for the change, and actually made the transition pretty smooth.
 

wileybunch

Senior Member
Thats not necessarily true. There's consulting and then there is consulting, and most attorneys know how to toe the line. I consulted with an attorney other than my own before making the decision to change lead attorneys in the past. It was all on the up and up, and both attorneys understood the reasons for the change, and actually made the transition pretty smooth.
My husband did, too, several years ago only it wasn't smooth b/c the original attorney wasn't doing a good job in the first place (ie. questionable practices) and she ended up keeping his entire retainer as a "fixed fee".
 
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