How do lawyers compute hourly fees?

[maidao2001]

What is the name of your state?

California

I just got my first bill from my lawyer. I do not begrudge him making $310.00 an hour. I do begrudge them using creative math to overcharge, and overcharging for services not rendered, period. This is unscrupulous considering:
- they earn in 5 minutes what I earn in 1 hour
- my reason for seeking their counsel in the first place (was to keep my brother from
stealing money from our trust as well as lose money through bad management, my
sister who lives in poverty is one of the beneficiaries )

I was charged .4 hours for a 14 minute call. What would an ethical lawyer charge? I was billed 1.5 hours for what was actually a 25 minute consultation that was supposed to be free! I didn't realize I needed a lawyer to hire a lawyer!!

For such high hourly rates (the senior partner earns $400+ an hour), shouldn't the contract state how the rate is computed? If I had known it would be computed on the decimal system accurate to only one decimal point I would have ended the call after 12 minutes, or if I went past that I would ask questions until the 18 minute increment. As long as I am paying for it....

Do I need to just shut up and take it? Or is this an exception? Did I hire a firm that is out of my league and are only for the rich? Or is anyone out there going to champion the middle-class...I make too much money to get a lawyer pro-bono....

my state is California

 

[You Are Guilty]

The billing methods should be set out in your retainer agreement. Have you read it?

And as far as the activities themselves go, generally, what happens is that the "prep" (whatever it may be for each activity) and the actual activity are billed together. Maybe not the best thing, but it happens everywhere and unless you complain, it's doubtful it will change. But basically, that 14 minute phone call may have had 5 minutes of reviewing your file prior to the call, and 5 more minutes of say, looking up a statute or other research.

Of course, they might just be overbilling you too. In which case:
http://www.calbar.ca.gov/state/calbar/calbar_generic.jsp?cid=10428&id=1325

 

[badapple40]

Exactly. I'd be surprised if it wasn't in the retainer letter. We send a standard retainer letter that explains all of this, as well as the hourly rate of the primary attorney and other attorneys likely to be involved in the case.

There are some matters we only bill in .25 increments. So a 30 second call = a 15 minute bill (my rate is $425/hr, so that is over $100 for each call on a .25 hourly billing matter).

As was stated, the .4 (which, a 14 minute call is billed as .3) could be an overbilling, if the attorney did not prepare for the call. And I always prepare for a client call. If you initiated the call, the attorney could have spent some time after the call looking over the file, etc. based on something you brought up.

If the attorney violated your fee agreement, there are issues there in terms of the initial consultation. I don't do "free" initial consults, so I don't know about how that works, but I do know that if they advertize it, they have to do what they advertize.

You can always call the attorney over the bill. And make sure that your time asking about the bill is "off the clock." Alternatively, as has been mentioned, a viable option is a bar grievance.

If you like the attorney and feel as if he/she is rendering good legal service, you may want to think about the fact that doing anything other than calling the attorney over the bill is likely to result in your needing new counsel.

 

[maidao2001]

about the free half hour....

Thank you for the info. Since they don't advertise a free consultation I had a friend e-mail them about their fees his response was:
"We do offer the initial 30 minutes of consultation at no charge. Thereafter we charge our regular hourly rates."
However - the letter accompanying the contract, that I signed says "Such Standard conditions will be applicable to the matters for which you initially requested our services as well as for any additional matters for which you request our assistance...."
Some of the lawyers I interviewed before deciding on these guys said they would charge me for the free half hour if I became a client up front before going into the interview. They did not.
I only signed and sent the contract with the retainer a week later - in addition to the half hour I was charged for they charged me for a phone call I made to the lawyer - he wasn't there so they asked if I wanted to talk to his assistant and I did. I was charged 1.5 hours for establishing a legal file . I don't have a problem paying for establishing a legal file, and allow that perhaps they just got the date wrong? Why would they spend time establishing a legal file until a signed contract and retainer was received?
I have had great experience until now with lawyers - contingency and fee/hourly based ones. This firm is supposed to be one of the best in the county dealing with probate - I checked their ABA standing, I was consicientious and interviewed at least 5 or 6 before deciding on these guys. They have not only accomplished nothing, but just found out that they may have neglected to protect our interests that could have cost us $15,000 - I have been trying to can these guys all week long, with no response, luckily I did stop then to stop doing anything related to my case that involves a charge
Unfortunately I think I picked a bad apple. This is the kind of lawyer that gives lawyers a bad name. I am gun shy though as far as probate/trust attys are concerned - I've been told that of all the areas of law, probate lawyers are the worst when it comes to agressive billing.

 

[You Are Guilty]

Have you tried speaking to the lawyer to discuss your issues with his bill? There may be a perfectly acceptable answer to it all. (Conversely, there may be rampant fraud, in which case it's probably better to know about it early on).

 

[seniorjudge]

A young lawyer dies and is sent to heaven. (Willing suspension of disbelief required for this story.)

Upon his arrival, he meets St. Peter at the Gate. St. Peter asks the lawyer his name and looks up his entry in the Great Big Book.

St. Peter then looks at the lawyer and says, "You look very good for being 138 years old."

Astonished, the lawyer replies, "There must be some mistake, I am only 32."

St. Peter responds, "Not according to your billable hours."

 

[maidao2001]

Must have hit a nerve...

Yes, I did try. When I called to stop work on my case until the billing issues were resolved I was referred to my lawyer's clerk and was told she would take care of it. She confirmed this with a very polite e-mail making herself available. I then sent a very detailed e-mail regarding my issues about the bill to the assistant as instructed. My lawyer called literally minutes after the e-mail was sent to her, left a message that I should call him to discuss the bill and to talk about the most recent letter received from the opposing party's lawyer. I returned his call no more than 15 minutes later (I was in the shower when he called) and was told he was in a meeting. I have left a message every day since with no response back.
My trust is broken with him and he has made no effort to repair it. All I want is to get anything left over from my retainer and my file so I can find someone else to take over. I'm guessing this firm caters to the very rich, big corporations or something. This is hard to discern with lawyers. If I were making reservations in a hotel, I would not make them at the Four Seasons - I am more the Marriott or at best Hyatt type. I must have had my appt on a day when things were slow and he was worried about finances, because if he were trustworthy and ethical he should have referred me to someone more appropriate to my needs.
As usual I chalk it up to experience, and have added a few more interview questions to the list of questions I will ask lawyers I will hire in the future.