Sibling Harassment/Escalated

[quincy]

Holy cow, THAT would light her up all right!!! If you can do that to someone, force a mental health evaluation, I'd be grateful she hadn't tried to do that to me yet. Honestly, my whole family is full of people I would sincerely love to force a mental health evaluation on, but I do not think we have that here.

Seriously, I think you're doing great with the grey rock. Possibly talk to the police. After having done that, I know just exactly what I need to say to have the police come if my hubby's long ago ex shows up in our driveway...(I do not KNOW if she's armed or not. I do know she has had mental problems and has made threats........I feel afraid/worried about what she might do.....) All true things, that will encourage them to come check out the situation before it becomes really bad.

I think many of us could be just one phone call away from forced commitment. Haha.

 

[stealth2]

my whole family is full of people I would sincerely love to force a mental health evaluation on

I so feel this! Well, only one, really.

I think many of us could be just one phone call away from forced commitment. Haha.

My brother would love to!

 

[Schmee]

Perhaps you can force a mental health evaluation? Here is a link to information on Washington’s Involuntary Treatment Act:

https://www.hca.wa.gov/assets/program/fact-sheet-involuntary-treatment-act-2022.pdf

Well that'd definitely pee in her cereal!

Really I just want her to leave me alone and be out of my life.

 

[Schmee]

Holy cow, THAT would light her up all right!!! If you can do that to someone, force a mental health evaluation, I'd be grateful she hadn't tried to do that to me yet. Honestly, my whole family is full of people I would sincerely love to force a mental health evaluation on, but I do not think we have that here.

Seriously, I think you're doing great with the grey rock. Possibly talk to the police. After having done that, I know just exactly what I need to say to have the police come if my hubby's long ago ex shows up in our driveway...(I do not KNOW if she's armed or not. I do know she has had mental problems and has made threats........I feel afraid/worried about what she might do.....) All true things, that will encourage them to come check out the situation before it becomes really bad.

Armed, like guns, unlikely. Knives? Almost certainly. Violent? On and off. It depends how much her narcissistic ego is hurt. Wouldn't put it past her.

Thank you for acknowledging my restraint! Solidarity and all that, amirite?

 

[Schmee]

Update

I contacted the non-emergency line for my city and was able to get a callback from an on duty officer.

The officer I spoke to asked me about my evidence and I pretty much gave him a brief description of what I said here. He heavily encouraged me to file for an anti-harassment order of protection on Monday.

He stated that although he is not a lawyer and cannot give me legal advice that it is in his opinion given the facts/proof I have that I will likely prevail in being granted one.

He was very nice and extremely helpful and assuring. He also told me I should include her daughter's threats because a judge may also include them on it.

So that's what I'm going to do. Just getting my information/proof printed off and trying to write up a detail of events with just the facts to take to court with me when the time comes.

I am feeling a little sick to my stomach but the family members that were involved in her crosshairs are all very supportive of me, so I think I'll be alright. I just have to push on. I've never been to court before.

 

[Schmee]

Question: When I file and hopefully get a court date will my sister be there? Is this similar to how other court would work where she is notified of what's going on and then shows up to defend herself? Also, if she doesn't show up and is supposed to, can I continue?

 

[LdiJ]

Question: When I file and hopefully get a court date will my sister be there? Is this similar to how other court would work where she is notified of what's going on and then shows up to defend herself? Also, if she doesn't show up and is supposed to, can I continue?

Yes, she will be notified and yes if she is smart she will be present. If she doesn't show up to defend herself the court should just go ahead and issue the order anyway. That is of course assuming that she was able to be properly served. The court may or may not treat it as an emergency where they will make temporary orders pending a hearing.

 

[Schmee]

Yes, she will be notified and yes if she is smart she will be present. If she doesn't show up to defend herself the court should just go ahead and issue the order anyway. That is of course assuming that she was able to be properly served. The court may or may not treat it as an emergency where they will make temporary orders pending a hearing.

If I hire a lawyer to represent me will they speak for me? Could they represent me without me being there?

I apologize if this seems obvious. I have never been in court.

Also, I know what to bring proof wise, but is it completely unwise to bring up things I cannot necessarily prove? For instance, if she has threatened and mocked me in person knowing we were alone. Will judges take that into consideration or is it a waste of time to mention?

Thank you for your time.

 

[stealth2]

If I hire a lawyer to represent me will they speak for me? Could they represent me without me being there?

I apologize if this seems obvious. I have never been in court.

Also, I know what to bring proof wise, but is it completely unwise to bring up things I cannot necessarily prove? For instance, if she has threatened and mocked me in person knowing we were alone. Will judges take that into consideration or is it a waste of time to mention?

Thank you for your time.

While the lawyer may be able to handle it w/o your presence, I don't think it's ever wise not to be present. If it's important enough for you to file? It should be important enough for you to show up.

I suspect the court will not see this as an emergent situation warranting an ex parte hearing, but that is something the lawyer you retain would be better able to tell you. If they do? It will be a temporary order at best, with a full hearing scheduled for a later date. Either way, your sister will need to be served at some point, and it will be up to her whether to appear or not. You should appear, IMO.

Whatever she's said to you in private is rather meaningless. And... threats are one thing. Mocking? Please.

 

[commentator]

You see, this thing of "she mocked me and she verbally abused me and called me names" is a little bit less serious than actual threats of physical violence, (which the courts see a lot of) after it has agreed to listen to your case. And no matter how much you wish you didn't have to ever see her again, you cannot expect to just detonate a complaint and have the courts call her in and make her stop, while you run off somewhere safe and hide. You will need to show up, preferably represented by an attorney, and be in the business of presenting yourself as the responsible party in this situation. Absolutely, it does not need to look like it has become in any way just a sibling spat where everyone has been upping the ante until it has come to this.

I have seen hearings where one or another of the parties did not show, and believe me, you do NOT want to be the one who doesn't show up. If she does show up, it's not likely she will be able to mock or verbally abuse you too much in the formal court situation, though you will have to be in the same area for a while. Walk away, do not engage.

Yes, you picked up on it. We've had a little issue going on in our lives too. Having ignored calls, texts, letters, messages left with other family members, etc, I fully expect a home visitation from the wicked witch of the west at some point! In preparation for this we have installed security cameras, started locking all doors, even when we are inside the house, spoken to local law enforcement and enlisted the observation powers of our neighborhood watchers. Since this is the rural Southeastern area, and it is virtually mandatory that one be armed, we fully expect her to show up with her tools of war and likely drunk. In a moment of fabulous judgment back in the day when they were together, my husband taught her to shoot, so it'd be a fine irony if she comes in blasting at us.

I do believe in the total non-response method, but I am really hoping this works out well for you and that perhaps soon your sister will be out of the picture. Keep doing the therapy, growing and improving your own life.

 

[Schmee]

While the lawyer may be able to handle it w/o your presence, I don't think it's ever wise not to be present. If it's important enough for you to file? It should be important enough for you to show up.

I suspect the court will not see this as an emergent situation warranting an ex parte hearing, but that is something the lawyer you retain would be better able to tell you. If they do? It will be a temporary order at best, with a full hearing scheduled for a later date. Either way, your sister will need to be served at some point, and it will be up to her whether to appear or not. You should appear, IMO.

Whatever she's said to you in private is rather meaningless. And... threats are one thing. Mocking? Please.

I said threatened and mocked me. I would think that her trying to provoke me while threatening me would be important to share but as I was saying, I can't definitively prove that she did that since it was, well, done in private. My word against hers.

I agree about showing up. I was merely curious as to how things work.

I spent some time watching a couple of WA state specific videos on YouTube that helped me get a better understanding. Between that and here, I've sure learned a lot.

I'm currently trying to look up cease and desist letters and see if that may be a good next step instead of court.

 

[stealth2]

threatened and mocked me.

In private. Prove it. The threats. Mocking? Please.

Full disclosure. I've mocked my brother. (folks here know there is no love lost.) We have a contentious relationship. But still - prove it.

 

[Schmee]

You see, this thing of "she mocked me and she verbally abused me and called me names" is a little bit less serious than actual threats of physical violence, (which the courts see a lot of) after it has agreed to listen to your case. And no matter how much you wish you didn't have to ever see her again, you cannot expect to just detonate a complaint and have the courts call her in and make her stop, while you run off somewhere safe and hide. You will need to show up, preferably represented by an attorney, and be in the business of presenting yourself as the responsible party in this situation. Absolutely, it does not need to look like it has become in any way just a sibling spat where everyone has been upping the ante until it has come to this.

I have seen hearings where one or another of the parties did not show, and believe me, you do NOT want to be the one who doesn't show up. If she does show up, it's not likely she will be able to mock or verbally abuse you too much in the formal court situation, though you will have to be in the same area for a while. Walk away, do not engage.

Yes, you picked up on it. We've had a little issue going on in our lives too. Having ignored calls, texts, letters, messages left with other family members, etc, I fully expect a home visitation from the wicked witch of the west at some point! In preparation for this we have installed security cameras, started locking all doors, even when we are inside the house, spoken to local law enforcement and enlisted the observation powers of our neighborhood watchers. Since this is the rural Southeastern area, and it is virtually mandatory that one be armed, we fully expect her to show up with her tools of war and likely drunk. In a moment of fabulous judgment back in the day when they were together, my husband taught her to shoot, so it'd be a fine irony if she comes in blasting at us.

I do believe in the total non-response method, but I am really hoping this works out well for you and that perhaps soon your sister will be out of the picture. Keep doing the therapy, growing and improving your own life.

It sounds to me like you have experience in dealing with things like this.

I think you make a lot of valid points that are important for me to think about.

Just to recap a little bit:

I am in month 5 now since I have told her to stop contacting me after she attempted to throw me under the bus for what she stole from our mom. When she realized I had proof of her actions and filed with the police report that was made against her she upped the anti and went on a raging smear campaign against me to several family members that she otherwise never spoke to. When she didn't get a response, she sent her daughter and friend after me through texts. I told her to also stop contacting me and blocked her only to have her change numbers and threaten me with cps/cops for child abuse and drug running.

Every week or so after that when I ignored her she upped the anti and tried smearing me to someone else or come up with something new to get to me. After almost 2 or so months of finally feeling like she was done, she somehow, even though she had no way of knowing who my therapist was, figures out who he is and contacts him with her same crazy antics. Nobody outside of my husband knows my therapist's name and he lives several cities away from me. Yet there she is in his email trying to smear me to him. That isn't normal sibling squabbling, surely?

I don't doubt that this may have started as a typical sibling squabble, but I can't help that it may have started that way. Typically she blows steam and then disappears, but she's on a vendetta against me for her potentially facing criminal charges, which in turn makes me even more nervous about retaliation.

Lots of food for thought. Thank you for giving me something to consider.

 

[Schmee]

In private. Prove it. The threats. Mocking? Please.

Full disclosure. I've mocked my brother. (folks here know there is no love lost.) We have a contentious relationship. But still - prove it.

Right. Exactly. I can't. So not worth mentioning.

Edit: Also, I acknowledge your point and message received. I am not trying to be flippant so I apologize if I came across that way.

 

[Zigner]

About court: Regardless of whether or not an attorney can handle this without you present (I doubt it), most, if not all, of your evidence is YOU. Without YOU present in court, there wouldn't be enough evidence to support the issuance of an anti-harassment order.