YES - Another Ebay Question

[coralfragger101]

What is the name of your state? FLORIDA

Seller is also in FLORIDA

I'm fed up with Ebay and PayPal and from reading other listings - you guys are too. But here goes
Trust me - this is the short version:

I purchase a 10 Pack Variety Mix of Ricordea - this is saltwater coral - live animals. Listing specifically states that I am to get a good mix of colors, not all green but a GREAT VARIETY. The listing goes on to say I WILL GET SOME OF EACH and it starts listing colors - blue, lavender, orange . green . yellow or light green etc, and some with a solid color with a different colored rim! two tone.
You can view the listing: Item #7737848795

What I get in the mail are 6 green and 4 blue. Not a good mix. No Lavendar,
No Orange, No Yellow, No Two-Toned.

I contact the seller to try to work things out. Seller offers a discount on
NEXT PURCHASE. I'm sorry, but this is unacceptable. Why should I, as a buyer, be forced to purchase more from this seller just to get what I originally
ordered or some other form of compensation??

I file a PayPal complaint for "Item Not as Described". I only got 2000
characters to do this in and couldn't even send an attachment to send a photo of what I actually received. I assumed that more info would be gathered before rendering a decision. In PayPal guidelines for complaints (which you can look up online), it states that the process goes as follows:
a) A complaint is filed
b) Seller responds to the complaint
c) Buyer reviews seller's response
d) PayPal reviews all and makes a decision

What happens: Without any further questions or requests for photos, ect. from PayPal Investigators, without me being allowed to view the sellers response as stated in PayPal's own guidelines, my claim is denied: "Based on PayPal's definition of significantly not-as-described, this claim does not qualify for a refund.We found the seller to have accurately represented the item(s) in question."
How someone can make that determination without even seeing what I received is beyond me.

In the meantime, I contact at least 3 other Ebay buyer's who purchased a
"Variety Mix" from this buyer and ALL of them were not really satisified and
the main complaint was the colors they received.

I call and speak to a PayPal Rep: They see my point and inform me on how to
appeal the case. I send more information concerning the case since I was
limited to 2000 characters initially. I'm still not allowed to view the seller's response. Case denied: "We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused. However as stated in the PayPal User Agreement: "Once PayPal has made a decision on a 'significantly not as described' item, that decision is final and cannot be appealed."

I call and speak to another PayPal Rep: They see my point and reopen the case AGAIN: I'm still not allowed to view the seller's response, even though I keep mentioning this to PayPal in words and writing. Case denied:" I understand your frustration about getting misinformation, however, the
case was closed with the item being effectively presented on their auction.
Again, my apologies."

I call and speak to another PayPal Rep: They see my point, talk to a Senior
Advisor and tell me that I can appeal the case but that PayPal is offering me
$50 because I've been with them for 3 years and have been a loyal customer.
They didn't technically say that the $50 was to resolve the case. I took the
money.

Back to Ebay: With this being all said and done, I leave Neutral Feedback on
Ebay for the Seller so that it wouldn't hurt their overall feedback rating.
(You can view this online) Seller turns around and leaves Negative feedback for me on Ebay for the whole world to see which does hurt my feedback rating and leaves comments that could be construed as libel.

Now I'm faced with either Mutually agreeing with the seller to remove feedback, which isn't going to happen or start a whole other process through Ebay in an attempt to have the Negative feedback removed.

I was initially wronged by the seller and I'm sure I have rights under some
consumer protection law but obviously the cost involved is going to prevent
this from occurring.

I was then wronged by PayPal on several occassions with their failure to
properly investigate the case in accordance with their own guidelines.

And finally, I'm wronged again by the seller by them leaving negative feedback
to hurt my Ebay Rating.

And this seller is allowed to continue with their misleading listing and
dupping more unwary buyers.

The saga continues and gets even better:

I've been wronged by a seller - original transaction
I've been wronged by PayPal - not following their own guidelines
I've been wronged by the seller again - leaving negative feedback on Ebay

NOW - I've been wronged by Ebay in my attempt to get the negative feedback removed:

Ebay's own rules state that negative feedback can be removed if it falls under
their guidelines of Feeback Abuse.

Under Feedback Abuse, I found the following:
------------------------------------------------------------
Feedback that meets any of the circumstances below is feedback abuse and may be
subject to removal. Feedback that doesn't meet any of the reasons outlined
below will not be removed:

The feedback makes reference to an eBay, PayPal or law enforcement organization
investigation.
------------------------------------------------------------

I submitted a request to Ebay to have the Neg FB removed from my record based on a violation of their own policy in that the Neg Comments DO reference a PayPal Investigation.

Ebay's response was that I would have to go through something called Square
Trade. Square Trade must be in cohoots with Ebay but I signed up with Square Trade only to find out that Square Trade basically acts as a mediator to resolve disputes. I would have to pay for the mediator. Participation is voluntary.

I signed up anyway, willing to pay to have this neg feedback removed even
though it's against Ebay Policy.

The seller refuses to mediate - end of Square Trade

I contact Ebay once more - they tell me that is the only way to have it removed.

Ebay goes out of it's way to let you know as a buyer and a seller that you are
entering into a legal contract by purchasing online but they are not willing to
follow their own guidelines when a problem arises?????

Seems to me that I almost have a law suit against the seller, PayPal AND Ebay.

My latest attempt to resolve matters is sending an email to a local TV Consumer Reporter to see if they might pick up on the story.

Does anyone see any other alternatives for me other than going to court over a $100 purchase ? Is there any criminal charges that could be filed against any of the parties ?

HELP

 

[seniorjudge]

eBay is a private company and basically do what it wants.

 

[coralfragger101]

So Private companies are exempt from consumer laws?

 

[Zigner]

Your losses are $50 not $100.
I think you spent more than $50 in time writing your original post.
I know it stings, but take this as a lesson. Don't buy ANYTHING from EBay unless you can afford to never get it. Then you'll be pleased when it actually turns out ok.
Additionally, EBay feedback is not the end-all, be-all that it's made out to be. 1 negative amongst 80+ positives will likely not hurt you at all in the long run.

 

[coralfragger101]

Technically - you may be right or wrong. PayPal didn't specifically state that the $50 was to resolve the issue. I didn't sign anything to get it. BUT - I can only assume that a court of law would view it as payment on the case.

You are also probably correct that in the long run - the negative feedback won't hurt me. Especially since the feedback is as a buyer. As a Seller - I have no complaints.

It just erks me as a moral human being how someone can put a description of an item in writing and not be held accountable for it.

I guess - as a seller - this is good news. I can do anything I want and not be held accountable. I can sell anything I want - send an empty package to the customer and as long as I provide a tracking number that the package (not the item) was delivered - the case will be dropped. Yes - I learned that one as well during my own investigation.

 

[dallas702]

You have two more opportunities to "adjust" your feedback. You can post a followup on one and a reply on the other.

Burn him on both.

 

[coralfragger101]

That was a given - and I did

 

[rdrector]

What has worked for me and I continue to do is pay only with a credit card through PayPal. I've been completely sucessfull with chargebacks going through my credit company versus PayPal. From my own and others' experinces PayPal always finds a way to not intervien or only half ponying up to what they say they will do. Bottom line is PayPal and Ebay seem to do what they want and for nominal amounts it seems this is this price you pay when shopping Ebay since it's not worth the cost of taking it further. Funny thing is when I get turned down by PayPal and win through my credit company PayPal all of sudden wants to communicate with me and asks that I work with them in the future, yea right.

 

[coralfragger101]

Great advice and one that I will employ in the future. This does bring about another "hassle" in itself however nothing close to the hassle I've been through with this one transaction.

As a seller, I always have a balance in my PayPal account and it is therefore super easy to pay for items from this account. It is also real easy to change that option and pay with a credit card as you are making the purchase - HOWEVER, PayPal does not allow you to withdraw funds to your credit card (which would make things a lot easier). PayPal states it does not do this because of "agreements" they have entered into with MC - VISA.

SO - Now I will have to purchase with a credit card - withdraw funds from PayPal to my bank account - pay my credit card.

Like I said - added hassel but apparently worth the extra protection you will receive from the CC Company.